The Big Little Man

[Amechra]

This is a build I was thinking of that uses an interesting combination of Dragonborn and Kobolds.

Dragonborn keeps any abilities that are based off of your size, such as Slight Build or Powerful Build.

So we grab a pair of Kobolds and enlarge them to Medium, and then make them Dragonborn. This a. makes the size change permanent and b. can give them some nifty stuff. Nifty stuff is less useful than the fact that, since they basically count as small when it suits them, kobolds should still qualify for feats or classes that require size Small or Smaller. The reason for this assumption is that Goliaths count as large because of Powerful Build, which uses similar language to Slight Build.

So what does this mean? It means we can do the following:

Dragonborn Kobold Fighter 2/Marshal 1/Warblade X

Feats (Not in Order): Swarmfighting, Confound the Big Folk, Shield Wall, Phalynx Fighter, Underfoot Combat.

The point of this is that you can stick 2 of these guys in a square, and they gain nice benefits for each ally that has the same feats that is adjacent/threatening the same enemy, so they get them as long as theri budy is in the same space as them.

Funnily enough, these guys are massive threats to people of Large size or larger, because they can effectively stand in his square and laugh at him.

If I made any mistakes, please tell me.

[carnivore]

that would be great ..... however:

notice:
"THE RITE OF REBIRTH

The Rite of Rebirth transforms a character into a dedicated draconic servant of Bahamut known as a dragonborn.

Becoming a dragonborn isn't undertaken lightly. It is a long process full of self-reflection and commitment. Those supplicants raised in the ways of their original race must carefully consider what they're giving up. While a human might be content to give up her natural versatility, it's rare for someone heavily invested in her racial identity to forfeit that race's abilities.

When the rite begins, the supplicant lays aside all her equipment and possessions for the duration of the ceremony. Dressed in a loose, linen shift, she spends a full day and night fasting and meditating upon her choice. Her mind fills with all the things she is giving up, reminding her she must forgo much of herself to become a dragonborn.

When dawn comes, the prospective dragonborn crawls inside an egg-shaped structure that she has built (see Cost) in order to sleep for the last time in her original form. This symbolic act represents her acceptance of the transformation. When the next dawn arrives, she is transformed into a dragonborn. After awakening inside the sealed egg, she breaks out of it as a glorious, draconic child of Bahamut.
"

how are you making them stay bigger while they change?

 

[TheEndIsNear]

that would be great ..... however:

notice:
"THE RITE OF REBIRTH

The Rite of Rebirth transforms a character into a dedicated draconic servant of Bahamut known as a dragonborn.

Becoming a dragonborn isn't undertaken lightly. It is a long process full of self-reflection and commitment. Those supplicants raised in the ways of their original race must carefully consider what they're giving up. While a human might be content to give up her natural versatility, it's rare for someone heavily invested in her racial identity to forfeit that race's abilities.

When the rite begins, the supplicant lays aside all her equipment and possessions for the duration of the ceremony. Dressed in a loose, linen shift, she spends a full day and night fasting and meditating upon her choice. Her mind fills with all the things she is giving up, reminding her she must forgo much of herself to become a dragonborn.

When dawn comes, the prospective dragonborn crawls inside an egg-shaped structure that she has built (see Cost) in order to sleep for the last time in her original form. This symbolic act represents her acceptance of the transformation. When the next dawn arrives, she is transformed into a dragonborn. After awakening inside the sealed egg, she breaks out of it as a glorious, draconic child of Bahamut.
"

how are you making them stay bigger while they change?

 

While they are big, you operate them and put woden braces inside him. They will keep him big when he'll shrink?

I think.

[Amechra]

I don't know how you get them to stay that size; maybe an Ocular Spell Persisted Enlarge Person?

Then just retrain feats and you're peachy keen.

[carnivore]

you realize that the Rite of Transference does not make a Magical Effect Permanent .... when the Duration for the spell ends... so does the Size boost, since it was not the Natural Size of the creature anyways

 

[Amechra]

iirc, the Rite retains your size. It never says anything about natural size.

Still, this can work with any other permanent (more or less) way to turn a creature medium without changing race.

[carnivore]

maybe this will help:

from page 10 Races of the Dragon
"THE MECHANICS OF REBIRTH
Upon transformation from her initial race to a dragonborn,
a supplicant loses many racial traits and gains those of the
dragonborn. The following information describes how to mechanically
achieve this transformation.
Type, Subtype, and Race: You retain your original type and
subtypes, gaining the dragonblood subtype. You still count as
a member of your original race for the purpose of any effect or
prerequisite that depends on race.
Racial Hit Dice: You retain your original racial Hit Dice, as well
as all benefits gained therefrom (base attack and save bonuses,
skill points, hit points, and so on).
Ability Modifiers: You retain your original racial ability modifiers
and gain the ability modifiers of the dragonborn race.
Size: You retain your original size

[Amechra]

OK, so you are correct.

Is there are a way to raise your size to medium through a template, then?

[Endarire]

Half-Minotaur.

[The_Mad_Linguist]

The only real way to cheese size and templates is through expansion + incarnate construct.

[strider24seven]

Half-Minotaur.

Would that give a character with Slight Build the ability to count himself/herself as 3 different size categories, depending on what suited him/her best?

[snakeman830]

Half-Minotaur.

Would that give a character with Slight Build the ability to count himself/herself as 3 different size categories, depending on what suited him/her best?

Nope, just two.  The actual size and one size smaller.

[PlzBreakMyCampaign]

The only real way to cheese size and templates is through expansion + incarnate construct.

I hope you mean things based off size, but not the size itself, in which case you are correct.

[The_Mad_Linguist]

The only real way to cheese size and templates is through expansion + incarnate construct.

I hope you mean things based off size, but not the size itself, in which case you are correct.

Yeah, basically it's cheese to get the giant type at low LA.

[PhaedrusXY]

OK, so you are correct.

Is there are a way to raise your size to medium through a template, then?

Well, Enlarge Person can be made permanent.

[strider24seven]

Half-Minotaur.

Would that give a character with Slight Build the ability to count himself/herself as 3 different size categories, depending on what suited him/her best?

Nope, just two.  The actual size and one size smaller.

Oh, damn posting at the late hours of night.  HM doesn't give powerful build... it just increases size.  Silly me.

And Permanent Enlarge Person can be dispelled easily.

[Amechra]

Maybe use Fusion with a Goliath...

Then you could use Throw Ally on your friend...

Would you still get Swarmfighting benefits for that throw...