Lowering Metamagic

[Amechra]

I got this idea because I thought I saw a reduce spell metamagic years ago.

Reverse Metamagic
Prerequisites: 3 metamagic feats
Benefit: A spellcaster with this feat may reverse their metamagic feats. These reverse metamagics have the opposite effect of the normal metamagic they came from; for example, a wizard 6 casting a Unpowered (Reverse Empowered) Fireball would do 6d6-21 damage. In addition, these new reverse metamagics cause the spell to take up a number of slots lower than the original equal to the number of slots higher the original metamagic used, so an Empowered Fireball is 4th level, and an Unpowered Fireball is 2nd level.

So, thoughts?

[veekie]

Well the obvious one would be to use it to lower spell slot costs for spells that deal damage as a secondary effect.

[Prime32]

Well the obvious one would be to use it to lower spell slot costs for spells that deal damage as a secondary effect.

Un-empowered finger of death as a 5th-level spell? Not to mention un-silent and un-still.

It gets ridiculous with Reverse Heighten Spell allowing you to cast 9th-level spells as cantrips. A human cleric with domains which grant metamagic feats could do this at lv1.

[Amechra]

So... A little overpowered?

Maybe I should limit the amount you can apply...

[Solo]

The Mailman would love it.

[veekie]

So... A little overpowered?

Maybe I should limit the amount you can apply...

Issue is of course, something for nothing, and that most metamagic effects are severely overcosted and only really useful in certain rare scenarios.
The cost is situational, whereas the benefit is static.

I could see a case for a reverse Quicken that makes you require twice the normal number of actions to cast a spell in exchange for a slot reduction, which could see some use for abuse in long duration buffing, but otherwise, theres a reason why so many metamagic tricks involve getting the slot modifier to a negative number.

Now, a package deal now, is much saner, a metamagic to decrease an AoE spell's area threefold(with a condition that the minimum spell dimension is 15ft) in exchange for maximizing all damage dice for +0 is not so abusable.

[Amechra]

Sounds good. I would make a package or two, but right now I'm starting to work on a big project, do I need some shuteye.

[Prime32]

I think you need to state in the feat description that you can't reverse Heighten, and possibly Silent and Still.

[veekie]

^^^
How about an Unempowered, Minimized, Twinned Icelance?

[Littha]

what happens to an unextended (or otherwise unmetamagiced) level 0 spell?

[Amechra]

Quick comment on the 0 level unmetamagic: you can't do it.

Actually, you could have unsilent, unstill, and material spells, each one adding a new component to the spell, as long as the spell does not have them in the first place. For example, an unstill material Dimension door, would be 2 levels lower and would require a somatic and material component.

I have no problem with removing reversed Heighten.

Might want to disallow fell drain, too...

[snakeman830]

Definitely remove Un-Fell Drain.  That would shatter the game.

And a quick comment: Eschew Materials is not a Metamagic feat, so there shouldn't be a "add material component" one either.

[Amechra]

I added Material Spell just to finish of the whole components "set", if you will.