Author Topic: I think I've found something stupid...  (Read 11301 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Sinfire Titan

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 5697
  • You've got one round to give a rat's ass.
    • Email
I think I've found something stupid...
« on: March 12, 2009, 05:48:09 PM »
Open up your copy of the Draconomicon and turn to the Dragonkith PrC. Look at the entry requirements:

Quote
Requirements
To qualify to become a dragonkith, a character
must fulfill all the following criteria.
Base Attack Bonus: +6.
Feats: Alertness, Endurance.
Skills: Knowledge (arcana) 4 ranks.
Language: Draconic.
Special:Must be chosen by a dragon
of the same alignment. If a dragonkith
ever ceases its relationship with the
dragon, or the dragon dies, the character
loses all special abilities gained
from this prestige class.

How do you qualify? Easy. Get a Dragonwrought Kobold Sorcerer as your best friend and have him choose you. That's taken care of. Now look at their 6th level class feature.

Quote
Sorcerous Knack (Sp

See the broken part there? No? Want me to spell it out?

The ability is an SLA, not a spell. No components, no XP cost, nothing. CL is set at 10th, but that can be boosted. There's no Errata for the Draconomicon. The earliest you can get this feature is 12th, but you can delay that so you can pick from any spell on their spell list.

Pick a spell. Any spell. Preferably something broken. This has major potential, just pick a spell that really helps you and go to town. IIRC, Savage Species has a feat that grants extra uses of SLAs. Could someone check this for me?


[spoiler][/spoiler]

Operation Shoestring

  • King Kong
  • ****
  • Posts: 937
  • Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
    • Email
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #1 on: March 12, 2009, 06:10:59 PM »
Class level, not character level.  So no higher than a 5th level spell.

Sinfire Titan

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 5697
  • You've got one round to give a rat's ass.
    • Email
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #2 on: March 12, 2009, 06:15:10 PM »
Class level, not character level.  So no higher than a 5th level spell.

That can be bypassed via Legacy Champion+Uncanny Trickster+Bloodlines, so max spell level is not an issue.

Still, even 5th level spells have something broken. Fabricate, for example.


[spoiler][/spoiler]

archangel.arcanis

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 2938
    • Email
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #3 on: March 12, 2009, 06:15:16 PM »
well if you can get the caster level up high enough Simulacrum would be a good choice.
Everyday you cast it and hand the guy a white plastic suit of armor and a blaster... um i mean.. no i'm not ripping off storm troupers. ok i am, but it would still be cool to make my own imperial army of me.

The copy retains 1/2 of everything and special abilities are specifically listed, maybe let them make a copy too?
Clerics and Druids are like the 4 and 2 in 42. Together they are the answer to the ultimate question in D&D.
Retire the character before the DM smacks you with the Table as the book will feel totally inadequate now.-Hazren

Sinfire Titan

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 5697
  • You've got one round to give a rat's ass.
    • Email
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #4 on: March 12, 2009, 06:22:48 PM »
well if you can get the caster level up high enough Simulacrum would be a good choice.
Everyday you cast it and hand the guy a white plastic suit of armor and a blaster... um i mean.. no i'm not ripping off storm troupers. ok i am, but it would still be cool to make my own imperial army of me.

The copy retains 1/2 of everything and special abilities are specifically listed, maybe let them make a copy too?

Ha! Now we're talking!


[spoiler][/spoiler]

Akalsaris

  • Hong Kong
  • ****
  • Posts: 1143
    • Email
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #5 on: March 12, 2009, 06:36:41 PM »
First off, wouldn't it generally be a 3rd level spell?  Equivalent to Sorcerer 6 is when you get the spell, and you can't change the spell later.  Though I guess nothing prevents you from choosing an abnormally high level spell that you won't get access to for another 8 levels or whatever.

Anyhow taking legacy champion+Uncanny Trickster+Bloodlines is not always an option, not to mention fitting those into a decent build.  Plus, you require another PC or the leadership feat to make good use of the ability without relying on the DM simply giving you a dragon that knows the spell you want.  So it's a decent trick, but not that broken given the heavy investment.

How about: Kobold Abjurer 3/M. Specialist 10/Initiate of the 7-fold Veils 7, with a Dragonkith cohort that is a desert orc paladin 6/Intermediate Gold Dragon Bloodline 2/Dragonkith 9?  You could ride on your buddy's shoulder and share all your tasty abjurations with him.  Plus, desert orc fills the Endurance requirement, while dragon bloodline grants alertness, and your orc can be riding a dragon, this creating a megazord of draconic creatures.  Plus, it gets that 1 5th level SLA, castable when the cohort hits 17th level. 




Sinfire Titan

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 5697
  • You've got one round to give a rat's ass.
    • Email
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #6 on: March 12, 2009, 06:48:45 PM »
I wouldn't go Paladin. I'd go Fighter and use lockdown tactics (that way he can at least cover your ass when needed). It works best if two players coordinate their builds, one going Sorc while the other goes X/Dragonkith.

The good thing about their Share Spells ability is that it works out to 100ft (but requires you to be touching at the start). It makes for an incredibly useful buff. I'd have the Kobold be a War Weaver, just to get more mileage out of the effect (one extra ally who never has to be included in the Weave, but can if you want him to be).


[spoiler][/spoiler]

bayar

  • That monkey with the orange ass cheeks
  • ****
  • Posts: 254
    • Email
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #7 on: March 12, 2009, 06:56:31 PM »
Can a dragonwrought kobold sorcerer choose himself for a Dragonkith ? And grant himself SLA ?

Sinfire Titan

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 5697
  • You've got one round to give a rat's ass.
    • Email
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #8 on: March 12, 2009, 06:58:57 PM »
Can a dragonwrought kobold sorcerer choose himself for a Dragonkith ? And grant himself SLA ?

Why would he? Dragonkith doesn't advance spells, so you are losing 6 levels of casting in exchange for an SLA. Archmage is better than that.


[spoiler][/spoiler]

The_Mad_Linguist

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 8780
  • Simulated Thing
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #9 on: March 12, 2009, 07:13:17 PM »
Decent choice for a kobold kohort.
Linguist, Mad, Unique, none of these things am I
My custom class: The Priest of the Unseen Host
Planetouched Handbook
Want to improve your character?  Then die.

woodenbandman

  • Man in Gorilla Suit
  • *****
  • Posts: 2188
    • Email
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #10 on: March 12, 2009, 07:26:43 PM »
I don't believe that there's a restriction on Caster Level for SLAs. Efreeti have Wish at CL10. You could choose whatever you wanted.

bayar

  • That monkey with the orange ass cheeks
  • ****
  • Posts: 254
    • Email
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #11 on: March 12, 2009, 07:42:54 PM »
Can a dragonwrought kobold sorcerer choose himself for a Dragonkith ? And grant himself SLA ?

Why would he? Dragonkith doesn't advance spells, so you are losing 6 levels of casting in exchange for an SLA. Archmage is better than that.

Because I thought I found something else stupid...

Akalsaris

  • Hong Kong
  • ****
  • Posts: 1143
    • Email
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #12 on: March 13, 2009, 01:08:00 AM »
I wouldn't go Paladin. I'd go Fighter and use lockdown tactics (that way he can at least cover your ass when needed). It works best if two players coordinate their builds, one going Sorc while the other goes X/Dragonkith.

The good thing about their Share Spells ability is that it works out to 100ft (but requires you to be touching at the start). It makes for an incredibly useful buff. I'd have the Kobold be a War Weaver, just to get more mileage out of the effect (one extra ally who never has to be included in the Weave, but can if you want him to be).

Only reason I went paladin is because you need a good charisma to use the SLA, and I don't like being reliant on a cloak for my class feature or spending a lot of money or exp on inherent bonuses.  If charisma were out of the picture, I'd probably go with warblade or something :P

PhaedrusXY

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 8022
  • Advanced Spambot
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #13 on: March 13, 2009, 02:45:07 AM »
I don't believe that there's a restriction on Caster Level for SLAs. Efreeti have Wish at CL10. You could choose whatever you wanted.
Interesting.

Even if there is, and given the restriction of having to choose it at level 6 of the PrC, bloodlines would add to it, so we can at least get to level 4 spells.

Animate Dread Warrior would be another good one, if you can get 6th level spells.
[spoiler]
A couple of water benders, a dike, a flaming arrow, and a few barrels of blasting jelly?

Sounds like the makings of a gay porn film.
...thanks
[/spoiler]

woodenbandman

  • Man in Gorilla Suit
  • *****
  • Posts: 2188
    • Email
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #14 on: March 13, 2009, 07:46:13 PM »
Quote from: SRD
For creatures with spell-like abilities, a designated caster level defines how difficult it is to dispel their spell-like effects and to define any level-dependent variables (such as range and duration) the abilities might have. The saving throw (if any) against a spell-like ability is:

Emphasis mine. You can choose anything.

Runestar

  • King Kong
  • ****
  • Posts: 820
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #15 on: March 14, 2009, 07:56:13 AM »
Seems like a very roundabout manner of abusing an ability. Especially when I am sure you are all capable of achieving much more with far less effort using planar binding shenanigans and the like... :smirk
A clear conscience is the surest sign of a failing memory.

X-Codes

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 3941
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #16 on: March 14, 2009, 10:04:56 AM »
Seems like a very roundabout manner of abusing an ability. Especially when I am sure you are all capable of achieving much more with far less effort using planar binding shenanigans and the like... :smirk
Well, you can make Planar Binding into an SLA... :p

Sinfire Titan

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 5697
  • You've got one round to give a rat's ass.
    • Email
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #17 on: March 14, 2009, 11:52:36 AM »
Seems like a very roundabout manner of abusing an ability. Especially when I am sure you are all capable of achieving much more with far less effort using planar binding shenanigans and the like... :smirk
Well, you can make Planar Binding into an SLA... :p

And pay NOTHING for it!


[spoiler][/spoiler]

woodenbandman

  • Man in Gorilla Suit
  • *****
  • Posts: 2188
    • Email
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #18 on: March 14, 2009, 12:12:35 PM »
I think that I'd prefer Genesis as an SLA.

Sinfire Titan

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 5697
  • You've got one round to give a rat's ass.
    • Email
Re: I think I've found something stupid...
« Reply #19 on: March 14, 2009, 12:29:37 PM »
I think that I'd prefer Genesis as an SLA.

Not practical, as it still takes 24 hours to cast the damn thing. A Fighter who just stands around for 24 hours is not a fighter I want in my party.


[spoiler][/spoiler]