A new spin on an old class?

[Solo]

Ok, so I might be taking part in my brother's RL 3.5 campaign soon, but one of the things I realized is that, since there are only a few ways of effectively playing the classes I like, and that I will need to play effectively due to the fact that the rest of the group are 1) new at this and 2) more inclined towards basket weaving than optimization, that I know beforehand exactly what I'm going to be doing.

I tried a cleric with PA, Law Devotion, Knowledge Devotion, and Extra Turning. Fun, but I don't know if that's really what I want. Can someone suggest me interesting things to do with said build - or any other core class except for druid - at level 5?

[StreamOfTheSky]

What books can you use, and why only core classes if your feat list wasn't core?

[Mixster]

Bard 5 with Inspire Courage optimization. It's a fun class to roleplay, and you are relatively effective at filling in holes that everybody else don't. Play it like a Tier 3 class should be played and you'll do splendid.

[Lycanthromancer]

You could always go for uber-buffer. Play a changeling double-focused-specialist (Transmutation/Illusion; hey, it's a wizard)/war weaver. You can get into war weaver at level 4 if you play your cards right, and then you can start buffing the whole party with multiple spells for the cost of the slots, a bit of prep-work, and a move action.

Find ways to get healing in there, and heal the whole party for one spell, if you like, or cast into your tapestry from wands.

[jeffrie]

Looking at your OP i like the bard idea, for the same reasons.

What level are you going through, maybe? Do you know the party makeup? What's the campaign like?

Out of the box; Chameleon is ecl6.

[Endarire]

Alternatively, I like Conjurer/Malconvoker for summons for Conjurer/Incantatrix for crowd control

[jeffrie]

Wait. New spin on an old class. Maybe cleric.

Trickery?

True neutral?

Rogue?

Female?

[Bester]

I'm in the same boat Solo.  New game, but non-optimisers and new players.

I was gonna try going strait Factotum, but this is a Pathfinder/3.5 included game...arrgh!  I need a solution to all skills are class skills, which seems overpowered to newbs.  And that cloistered cleric dip for knowledge devo, and travel devo is probably out too.

It's hard to play in a group that thinks wizards/clerics/druids are the weaker classes compared to fighter/paladin/etc.

[SorO_Lost]

I tried a cleric with PA, Law Devotion, Knowledge Devotion, and Extra Turning. Fun, but I don't know if that's really what I want. Can someone suggest me interesting things to do with said build - or any other core class except for druid - at level 5?

Drop Law for Trickery and max those turns per day (skipping persist since they are newbs and you don't want to totally out scale them). Increase your melee ability some more, maybe some Prestige Paladin / Ordained Champion or something, but aim for unarmed combat.

And get a lot of body piercings.

Like this
[spoiler]

[/spoiler]

[Caelic]

Definitely agree on the buffing direction.  By optimizing your character, you make the OTHER members of the party shine--which is ideal when the other players aren't experienced.

Bard heading for Sublime Chord, maybe?  I guess it depends on how long the campaign's likely to run.

[jeffrie]

I'm in the same boat Solo.  New game, but non-optimisers and new players.

I was gonna try going strait Factotum, but this is a Pathfinder/3.5 included game...arrgh!  I need a solution to all skills are class skills, which seems overpowered to newbs.  And that cloistered cleric dip for knowledge devo, and travel devo is probably out too.

It's hard to play in a group that thinks wizards/clerics/druids are the weaker classes compared to fighter/paladin/etc.

If you aren't 'allowed' to go factotum, are you interested in skill monkey? What type of rogue prcs will be allowed later?

[X-Codes]

Play a Poison Dusk Lizardfolk, buy off the LA, and get the following:

Poison Fangs Graft (Serpent Kingdoms, 8k)
Poison Spell Feat (DotU)
Divine Magician ACF (CM)
-Parching Touch (Sandstorm)
-Spectral Hand (Core)

This lets you, at range, hit with Parching Touch for 1d6 dessication damage (all but un-resistable), poorly scaling Fort Save or 1 Con damage + dehydration (fatigue), and well scaling Fort Save or 1d6 Con/1d6 Con poison.  You get 1 touch per CL per day with 1 preparation of Parching Touch.

Since it's a very compact shtick, you can spend the rest of your resources on party buffing (Spontaneous Time Domain, anyone?) and DMM: Persist for things like mass lesser vigor and recitation.  If the situation calls for it, you can even throw down a Divine Power and mix it up in melee with a Claw/Claw/Bite routine.

[Lycanthromancer]

And get a lot of body piercings.

Like this
[spoiler]

[/spoiler]

Solo already has enough holes in his head...

[ninjarabbit]

You could always go elf cleric archer with the elf domain and zen archery.

You could also go dragonwrought (or not) kobold cloistered cleric with the kobold and trickery domains to fill 2 roles.

[Solo]

Here's the thing; I'd love to make a buffing build, but the other party members are evil and have displayed a tendency towards Chaotic Stupid, and I need to be able to take on likely 3 of them, possibly 4, if it comes to that.

So far, they are a Paladin of Slaughter, a Rogue, and another cleric. However, I have suggested that the Paladin take the Blackguard class and the Cleric take the Death and Destruction domain in order to lower their power level while appearing to be helpful. The Rogue plans on going into Assassin and using Death Attack, but at the same time does not consider himself to be a combat specialist and has geared himself towards social encounters - doesn't even have ranks in UMD or Tumble.

I figure the most trouble I will have is with the Psion, who I have given actual optimization advice to, but he seems to be neutral and friendly with me in game and IRL, so I might be able to expect him as an ally should I lay the smack down on the rest of the party.

[Lycanthromancer]

If they like your buffs, they'll want to stay on your good (or at least less Evil) side. Otherwise, a well-placed Dominate Person or a beatdown from your Planar Bound bodyguards (or a well-placed Gate-from-a-scroll and a quick Teleport out) should suffice well enough to get them cooperating (or, y'know, dead).

[Bester]

If you aren't 'allowed' to go factotum, are you interested in skill monkey? What type of rogue prcs will be allowed later?

so far i'm allowed to take whatever I want (maybe even faerie mysteries ).  The problem is the same as Solo, when one or 2 players play a tier 1 class and unintentionally upset the balance.  I don't see any infighting as in solo's case, but I do see a wizard/cleric/druid just owning entire encounters.  I have made it clear to the dm that I have no intention of playing such a class(unless c cleric dip 1), but want to optimise the hell out of my factotum.  In my mind Facto=competent fighter who can do anything mundane on the side.

[Solo]

If they like your buffs, they'll want to stay on your good (or at least less Evil) side. Otherwise, a well-placed Dominate Person or a beatdown from your Planar Bound bodyguards (or a well-placed Gate-from-a-scroll and a quick Teleport out) should suffice well enough to get them cooperating (or, y'know, dead).

The velvet glove must conceal a fist of iron.

[Lycanthromancer]

If they like your buffs, they'll want to stay on your good (or at least less Evil) side. Otherwise, a well-placed Dominate Person or a beatdown from your Planar Bound bodyguards (or a well-placed Gate-from-a-scroll and a quick Teleport out) should suffice well enough to get them cooperating (or, y'know, dead).

The velvet glove must conceal a fist of iron.

You're a wizard. Gather an army of buffed squirrels and kill them in their sleep if they piss you off.

[Solo]

Yes, but I'd like to be able to kill them if they start attacking the queen in her courtroom.