Metamagic and You: A Thesis

[cru]

feat full text here:
http://www.worldofwarcraftnet.info/magic-mayhem/greater-link-spell-%5Bmetamagic.html

Imho, not worth it at all. A +1 or +2 adjustment might work. But 7? No way.

[Andion Isurand]

Transcendent Spell (Warcraft RPG: Magic and Mayhem 33)

Well, this feat could be applied to many spells... allowing greater magic weapon spells that grant epic enhancements, phantom steeds that fly faster than 240 ft and polymorph spells without HD limits... etc etc

...while Enhance Spell only upped the cap for damage spells by 10 dice for 4 slots as an epic feat.

I think its a good feat for epic game play when playing with Improved Spell Capacity and metamagic reducers.  The cost of 7 slots might be high, but I still think the feat should be mentioned in the opening list.

--------------------

Whereas my opinion of then Hasten Spell feat from the same book is a poor one, since it would mean using move actions to cast spells, which tips the action economy further in favor of the spellcasters.

Link Spell is also rather dubious in my mind...

But as long as a feat like Irresistible Spell is listed, you might as well include these feats as well.

[CantripN]

Transcendent Spell is more than a bit useful with all the Free Metamagic tricks, such as DMM, Anima Mages, Ultimate Magi...

A Circle Magic Transcendent Greater Magic Weapon is a +10 Weapon, a Dragonskin is +20 AC, a simple Dispel Magic beats Greater Dispel Magic, Giant's Wrath is +40 to attack and damage... Yeah, I could use that feat better than Persistent Spell, by far, seeing as I can boost my CL to WAY, WAY, way, higher than what it should be, even without Circle Magic (we don't allow that...).

[Andion Isurand]

Yeah, master spellthief + ultimate magus + transcendant spell,  etc etc.... ouch

[McPoyo]

Wait wait wait wait. Kell, your group allows MST Cl boosting shenanigans but not circle magic? My mind = blown.

[RelentlessImp]

Over the next few days, I'm going to be color-coding this guide with the standard of Best, Okay, Meh, and IT'S A TRAP!. I'll be adding a new color, You'd be a fucking moron not to take this, as well.

Also, I'll not be including anything not directly meant for 3.5 D&D (so Warcraft and such are out).

[McPoyo]

Should add Slaymates from LM and Soulticks from FF.

[nijineko]

any chance of a similar thesis with metapsionics?

=D (pretty please?)

[RelentlessImp]

Should add Slaymates from LM and Soulticks from FF.

They're already there. :/

On Psionics: I don't play with psionics much. Someone like Lycanthromancer would be able to better put together something with psionics than me. Petition him to do so. Also, Psionics haven't had as much supplemental support, so you can pretty much get everything you need out of two books, three with third party: Expanded Psionics Handbook and Complete Psionic. With third party, you add Hyperconscious.

[McPoyo]

Whoops, I'm blind

[nijineko]

Should add Slaymates from LM and Soulticks from FF.

They're already there. :/

On Psionics: I don't play with psionics much. Someone like Lycanthromancer would be able to better put together something with psionics than me. Petition him to do so. Also, Psionics haven't had as much supplemental support, so you can pretty much get everything you need out of two books, three with third party: Expanded Psionics Handbook and Complete Psionic. With third party, you add Hyperconscious.

don't forget secrets of sarlona. ^^ there are also a scattering of psionic options throughout various splat books. usually a couple of pages or so.

[Nanshork]

Should add Slaymates from LM and Soulticks from FF.

They're already there. :/

On Psionics: I don't play with psionics much. Someone like Lycanthromancer would be able to better put together something with psionics than me. Petition him to do so. Also, Psionics haven't had as much supplemental support, so you can pretty much get everything you need out of two books, three with third party: Expanded Psionics Handbook and Complete Psionic. With third party, you add Hyperconscious.

don't forget secrets of sarlona. ^^ there are also a scattering of psionic options throughout various splat books. usually a couple of pages or so.

And for Third Party there's everything Dreamscarred Press published.   

[RelentlessImp]

Now with color!

[Widow]

A couple of things to add, hopefully they are not repeats of other people's posts.

For the Metamagic Spell shaper, the Rod of Bodily Restoration or the Orb of Mental Health can be found in the Magic Item compendium for 3,100 gp each.  Each can be used three times a day to heal 2 points to each physical or mental ability score respectively.  So that is 3 free persistent spells for 3,100 gp, far better economy than divine metamagic and nightsticks (plus you can use as many as you want).  For higher level divine casters, don't forget you can just throw a heal on the end of your buffing spell chain to remove all the ability damage.  So you can choose Naberious with a class level or feat, burn a 6th level spell, or spend some loot; choose whatever resource is most abundant.

For those lucky enough to have access to action points in eberron, don't forget unfettered heroism.  Not only can this cover the one point a round necessary for a free application of a metamagic feat, but it can also be spent to double the effectiveness of a feat or grant a feat for one round (forgot which options are available with unearthed arcania and eberron).

For the Heirophant, I agree it can be a trap for base classes.  But it is useful if you are lucky enough to be playing epic or a fast spell progression PrC (Such as the Ur-priest worshiping a dead God route, Divine Crusader, etc).  I have used it in several epic builds to pick up 5 bonus metamagic feats and/or free reach.

[KellKheraptis]

Wait wait wait wait. Kell, your group allows MST Cl boosting shenanigans but not circle magic? My mind = blown.

I think he means his RL group.  No self-respecting Black Mage would turn down access to one of the single most powerful tools in their arsenal, after all.  And now AFK while I read up on these "new" feats and see what sort of abomination I can spawn with them

EDIT : Omfg...the first feat alone!  Talk about upping the ante...

"Hi there, Hi Welcome!  Meet my entire spell list, all at once, every round, but WAIT!  Since Time Stop is in there and I'm a Miser with Magic and Unfetteredly Heroic, this barrage continues ad infinitum as I self-replicate each round within itself through a true Celerity loop!"

This one little page basically would give arcane casters the same Tech Psionics has without going into Shadowcraft Mage and emulating it with Wish/Miracle.  Sick!

[The_Mad_Linguist]

Miser with magic has a per/day use limit in the errata.

Miser with Magic:
Prerequisite: Arcane Spellcaster level 7+. The feat Miser with Magic can be used on a
number of spell levels per day equal to the ability score modifier appropriate to the type
of spells you cast.

Which makes it good, but not OMGWTFBBQ good.

[KellKheraptis]

Only OMGWTFBBQ good with the ability to activate per-day abilities with a standard action, say by spending an infinitely replenishable action point on it

[The_Mad_Linguist]

Only OMGWTFBBQ good with the ability to activate per-day abilities with a standard action, say by spending an infinitely replenishable action point on it

But it's not a "class ability that has a limited number of uses per day."  It's not a class ability, and it doesn't have a limited number of uses per day.  It can affect a limited number of spell levels per day, but that's not the same thing as uses.

And you're mixing two different action point systems anyway

[KellKheraptis]

Same deal with Chaotic Spell Recall, though ultimately, with this, you can just abuse the fuck out of Mage's Lubrication (I think that was the combo from the Red Wizard Handbook) and self replenish your whole list all at once before the arbitrarily long Time Stop wears off, and repeat ad nauseum.  Looking at it again, it really just makes it more convenient and less convoluted to throw your whole arsenal at someone, without ultimately raising the bar.  Now in less optimized campaigns...dropping 6 simultaneous Orbs of Force would most likely end anyone and anything it hits

[RelentlessImp]

Miser with magic has a per/day use limit in the errata.

Miser with Magic:
Prerequisite: Arcane Spellcaster level 7+. The feat Miser with Magic can be used on a
number of spell levels per day equal to the ability score modifier appropriate to the type
of spells you cast.

Which makes it good, but not OMGWTFBBQ good.

Actually, the per/day use limit is in KoKPG, not the errata.

"You may only use this ability on a number of spell levels equal to the ability score modifier appropriate to the type of spells you cast." It's also mentioned in the write-up.