Author Topic: [PATHFINDER]Core+APG, playing a Rogue. Currently level 9.  (Read 8539 times)

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Senevri

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[PATHFINDER]Core+APG, playing a Rogue. Currently level 9.
« on: August 06, 2010, 01:19:26 PM »
Skills: 5/lv(20)
ranks: Appraise 3+3, Bluff, Craft(alchemy) 1+3, Craft(sculpting) 1+3 craft(painting) 1+3, Fly, Intimidate 4+3, Knowledge (arcana) 1+3, Knowledge(local/planes) 1+3 Profession, Spellcraft 4+3, UMD 2+3 Ride 2

Stats: str 10 dex 14(5) con 12(2) int 14(5) wis 7(-4) cha 15+2+1(7) = 18

Slots/Spells:
i/6 prestigitation, mage hand, detect magic, ghost sound, mending, ray of frost
6/3 identify, silent image, enlarge person, grease
3/1 summon monster II

Feats:
B Spell focus (conjuration) 1 Augment Summoning
3 Deadly Aim

Familiar:Equipment:
Carrying capacity 30/60/90
carried weight:
Haversack 5lb
Traveller's outfit 5lb
mwk longspear 9lb
Buckler 2.5lb
Adventurer's Sash 3lb


+1 mithral buckler: 2015 gp +1 AC ACP 0 ASF 0 Wt 2.5lbs
Handy Haversack: 2000gp
Bracers of Armor +1: 1000gp
Masterwork Longspear: 305gp 1d8-1 x3 9lbs
5320gp

680

Heavy Warhorse 300gp
Military Saddle 20gp (+2 ride)
Saddlebags 4gp
Feed x 20 1gp 200lbs (saddlebags
=325

Portable Alchemist's lab 75gp
Merchant's Scale 2gp
=77 = 402

standard gear
[spoiler]
Traveler's Outfit 1gp
Hot Weather Outfit 8gp
Cold Weather Outfit 8gp

Small Tent 10gp 15lbs
Trail Rations x20 10gp 20lbs
Rope, silk, 50ft 10gp 5lbs
Grappling Hook 1gp 4lbs
Adventurer's sash 20gp 3lbs
MWK Backpack 50gp 4lbs (+1 carry str)
Bedroll 1sp 5lbs
Bag, waterproof 5sp 0.5lbs
Blanket, common 2sp 0.5lbs
Blanket, winter 5sp 3lbs
Block-and-Tackle 5gp 5lbs
Chalk x 5 5cp
Ink Vial + ink 9gp
inkpen 1sp
Ladder, Folding 2gp 16lbs
Magnet 5sp 0.5lbs
Small Steel Mirror 10gp 0.5lbs
5x parchment 1gp
Scroll Case 1gp 0.5lbs
Waterskin 1gp 4lbs
Whetstone 2cp 1lbs
[/spoiler]

147gp 9sp 7cp

---
money:
110 gp 3cp
[/spoiler]
Rogue
[spoiler]
I wanted to play off a not-ugly, but instead socially awkward and shy, but lethal character.
//Elf, +2 dex +2 int -2 con +2 perception, llv, longbow, rapier
Human, +1 skill point per level
Stats:
str 10 dex 18(=15+2+1)(7) con 14(5) int 14(5) wis 12 cha 7(-4)

Sneak Attack +2d6, Evasion, Trapfinding, Trao Sense +1

Feats and talents:
1 Agile Maneuvers
t finesse
3 TWF
t weapon training: short sword

Skills 44 (11)
Acrobatics 4+3
Appraise 1+3
Bluff: 1+3
Craft:Trapmaking 3
Climb 4+3
Disable Device 4+3
Disguise 2+3
Escape Artist 2+3
Heal 3
K:Dungeoneering 1+3
K:Local 1+3
Perception 4+3
Stealth 4+3
Sense Motive 4+3
Survival 1
Swim 4+3
UMD 4+3
Ride 1

Defense
HP 8+4+3d8+4fc
Fort +3 Ref +8 Will +2 CMD 17
AC 19 T 14 FF 15 = dex +4, armor +5

Offense:
BAB +3
CMB +7
dual mwk short swords:

single +9, 1d6, 19-20/x2
twf +7/+7, 1d6, 19-20/x2

Equipment:
+1 Mithral Shirt 3100 gp +5/0 ACP
2x masterwork short sword: 620 gp
//Elixir of Hiding: 250gp
Handy Haversack: 2000gp
5720
Standard gear --- see sorcerer
mwk Thieves' tools 100gp 2lbs
Disguise Kit 8lbs

247gp 9sp 7cp
5067.97
32.03
[/spoiler]
Bard
[spoiler]
Straight Treantmonk, albeit considering elf/halfelf->arcane archer
Halfling: +1 size AC atk, -1 CMB CMD +4 stealth; +2 dex, cha; -2 str
+1 saves +2 fear +2 perception acrobatics climb
Str (-2 racial): 12 (5)
Dex (+2 racial): 18 (7)
Con: 10
Int: 12 (2)
Wis: 7 (-4)
Cha (+2 racial): 16 (5)

Bard:
+4 knowledge checks
Inspire Courage +1 Competence +2
Fascinate DC 15
Versatile Performance:Oratory

Skills: 7x4.
10pts knowledge: rank +9
11pts remain
Stealth 4
Perform 4
Acrobatics 1 +3 +2
UMD 1 +3 + cha 3
Climb 1 + 3 + 2

Feats:
1 Point Blank Shot
3 Rapid Shot
----
5 precise shot
7 deadly precision
9 arcane strike

slots/Spells:
i/6 prestidigitation, mage hand, detect magic, mending, dancing lights, message
3+1/4 Silent Image, Grease, Charm Person, Expeditious Retreat
1+1/2 Mirror Image, Invisibility

Defense:
6+3d6,
+1/+8/+2

Offense:
BAB +3 +1 size, + 4 dex +1 point blank
+1 mighty(+1) short bow: +9, 1d4+2/x3
bard song: +1/+1 morale,
point blank: +1/+1 30ft.
Rapid Shot: -2
Deadly precision: -1 to hit, +2 damage
[/spoiler]
Monk
[spoiler]
Again, pretty much Treantmonk here
Human
Stats: Str: 18 (10) Dex: 14 = 1+13 (3) Con: 13 (3) Int: 8 (-2) Wis: 14 (5) Cha: 7 (-4)
Bonus feat, flurry of blows +2/+2, stunning fist, unarmed strike, bonus feat, evasion, fast movement, maneuver training, still mind, ki pool(magic), slow fall 20ft

Ki pool 2+WIS
1: extra flurry,  +20ft move 1r, +4 dodge AC 1r

Skills: 3+1
Acrobatics 4+3+2 (jump +13)
Climb 2+3+4
Perception 4+3+2
Swim 2+3+4
Stealth 4+3+2

Feats:
1 Toughness h deflect arrows b dodge
b improved grapple
3 power attack

Defense:
HP  =8+ con 4 + 3d8 +4 toughness
Saves +5/+6/+6 (+8 vs. enchantment)
AC 18 = armor 1 + deflect 1 + dex 2 + monk 1 + dodge 1 + wis 2
CMD 23 grapple 25

Offense:
BAB +3, CMB +8, grapple +10
Stunning Fist 4/d: Stun/Fatigue DC 14
Flurry: +6/+6, 1d8+4
Power Attack: +7, 1d8+6
PA Flurry: +5/+5, 1d8+6

Equipment:
Bracers of Armor +1 1000gp
mwk cold iron temple sword: 360GP 3lbs 1d8/19-20/x2
//Adamantine Sai: 3001GP; 1d4/x2, 1lb
Ring of Protection +1 2000gp
50x masterwork Shuriken: 310gp.
[/spoiler]
Archer
[spoiler]
Fighter-archer
Going Arcane Archer with minor in magic.
Elf
str 14(3) dex 18 con 10(2) int 14(2) wis 10 cha 7(-4)

Feats:
1 point blank shot  f rapid shot
f deadly precision
3 WF longbow
f precise shot

Offense:
mwk mighty composite (+2) longbow: +7/+7, 1d8+2 (3)
deadly precision: +5/+5, 1d8+6(7)
[/spoiler]
[/spoiler]

awaken DM golem

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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #1 on: August 06, 2010, 05:09:34 PM »
I had no idea Pathfinder was gonna do their version of an SRD.

Pathfinder_OGC ---> http://www.d20pfsrd.com/

Otherwise I've nothing to offer just yet.


edit
{ ... insert carnivore has the link in his sig smiley face ... }
« Last Edit: August 06, 2010, 05:59:30 PM by awaken DM golem »

juton

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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #2 on: August 06, 2010, 08:53:59 PM »
d20pfsrd.com has been around for a while now, I think it was out during the beta.

You've got a lot of good ideas Senevri. I've always loved Rogues, but I think your Arcane Archer could be fun, I've never tested one of those though. I've found Monks and Bards a little weak in core Pathfinder, so I'd advise caution on those. The Sorcerer looks strong as well, if you are comfortable with casters at lower levels then that could be a lot of fun as well.


awaken DM golem

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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2010, 04:58:55 PM »
hmm ... at least some of the classes in APG got put in their Srd:
Alchemist, Cavalier, Inquisitor, Summoner, and Witch.

I have my doubts on first read, that the Alchemist would have anything to offer,
a Ranged Cleric build, like whats been floating around these parts the last few days.
Maybe a 1 level dip, would be useful for that PrC (?) that takes Potions up to 9th level.



juton

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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #6 on: August 08, 2010, 03:41:31 AM »
Any thoughts on items, feats, skill point allocations.... early multiclassing?

Skill point allocation will vary depending on your campaign, you need different skills to go dungeon delving then Undertaking court intrigue.

Let's talk about Rogues and Arcane Archers:

Rogues: Most effective Rogues use two weapon fighting to deliver a lot of damage through sneak attack. You'll want a high acrobatics skill to tumble into position. You might also want to take a few levels of Shadow Dancer to get some of it's better abilities like hide in plain sight, but it's expensive feat-wise to get into. You'll probably want Weapon Finesse so you can focus on your Dex. Rogues are pretty easy to get right as long as you keep going for that sneak attack.

Arcane Archer: You need to be an Elf or Half Elf to get in, Half Elf is nice but Elf has everything you need. You'll want really good Dex and Int, but you'll need a few points in Str and Con as well.

There is two ways you can approach multiclassing, one is fairly direct but a little weak, the second is much stronger but may raise some ire.

A simple arcane archer would be Fighter 4/Wizard 4/Arcane Archer 10/Wizard 2. You'd take turns taking fighter and wizard levels. At 20th level you'll have a 17 BAB and cast like a 13th level Wizard. This is the build I'd take if your team members aren't that strong, so you won't be more powerful than the group.

A more optimized Arcane Archer would be Fighter 1/Wizard 5/Eldritch Knight 3/Arcane Archer 4/Eldritch Knight 7. At 20th level you'll have a BAB of 17 but cast like an 18th level Wizard, which means 9th level spells. With the right Wizard spells you'll be a very powerful member of any team, if your party has Druids and Clerics in it use this build, if it has Monks and Bards use the first one.

For feats you really want to hit the essentials, Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, Precise Shot, maybe Manyshot once you start getting a lot of extra damage per arrow. Deadly Precision also helps up damage, focus on archery at lower levels, then start to pick up metamagic feats for your wizard half. For items you'll want a magic bow, and all the items that boost AC, except armour because you have mage armour.

Senevri

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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #7 on: August 08, 2010, 06:04:45 AM »
I hadn't considered the usual Shadowdancer dip - it would fit this rogue concept perfectly, though.
People seem to consider the Arcane Archer interesting - and why not? After 3.5, it's nice it's more than a 2-level dip.

I could trade agile maneuvers and CF:Shortsword for Dodge and Mobility, then pick Combat Reflexes at l5, and go for Shadowdancer. Definitely no more than 4 levels, though - and even then, I'm not getting much out of it's abilities without Charisma.
Let's see what Shadow Conjuration's Spell list is:
- All of 1st level s/w conjurations. 'Mount' is nice.
- 2nd level, too. 'Glitterdust' may even generate sneak attacks, if one's lucky.
- 3rd level phantom steed isn't any better than mount, with CL 4. Nothing really useful with bad CHA here. I mean, DC 11?
Shadow Jump is nice, if not much. Still, you can use spells to create enough shade to jump through.

Looking at shadowdancer further, it's 10th-level ability is nice - you can generate shade, and DR 10/- is a significant damage reducer, and on-crit blindness generates sneak attacks.
Still, you'd be giving up 5 dice of sneak attacks to get there.
Let me just check Greater Shadow Conjuration and Shadow Evocation...
- 4th, not much. Solid Fog can be used to slow down impacts safely. 5th has Major Creation and Wall of Stone. Not sure if the summons list has any utility by this point.
- Evocation has Floating Disk, Shatter, Wind Wall, Resilient Sphere.
Not much for a low-charisma character.

Initially, I'd say it's at it's best as a 1-level dip. Will have to check with the DM if he allows such.... Not worth the career change at that point, I think.

*edit*
According to Ask a Simple Question, I can't deadly aim a ray, so I need to replace that feat in the sorc build.


Senevri

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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #9 on: August 12, 2010, 09:10:49 AM »
Okay, here's one more - it's a CMB-using showcase (barbarians get nice STR), it's also prepped so that it can enter Dragon Disciple with a single Bard level. Probably standard gear + warhorse + maybe a beast of burden of some sort. Definitely Mwk backpack.
Idea is to use master craftsman+CMA&A to self-upgrade the heirloom weapon. ( I know, suboptimal weapon, but swords are cooler than, oh, spiked chains. )
[spoiler]

CMB-man
Human
Barbarian 4(Bard 1)
Fast Movement +10ft
Rage: +4 morale STR, CON, +2 will, -2 AC, (2hp per hd)
Rage Powers:
Knockback, Guarded Stance

Stats: Str 15->16(7) Dex 12(2) Con 18(10) Int 8(-2) Wis 7(-4) Cha 12
Traits: Ancestral Weapon(free mwk), Magical Knack(+2 bard CL)
Feats:
1 Power Attack h Greater Bull Rush
3 Cleave
--
5 Master Craftsman
7 CMA&A

Skills:
Acrobatics 4+3+1
Climb 4+3+3
Craft(Weaponsmithing) 4+3-1
Intimidate 0+1
Ride: 1+3+1
Swim: 1+3+3
Perception: 1+3-2
Linguistics 1(draconic)

Defense:
HP 12+3d12+16 (raging +8)
naked AC 11 Touch 11 FF 10
MWK Breastplate 350GP, +6, +4, -3, 25%, 20ft base, 30lbs
AC 17 Touch 11 FF 16
CMD 18 (bull rush 20)
Saves +8/+2/+0

Offense:
CMB +7
MWK Heirloom Adamantine Bastard Sword 3000gp +9, 1d10+4/19-20/x2, (+3 1h)
Raging: +11, 1d10+7
[/spoiler]
I could go into sundering...

*sigh*, Game in ... three hours, and I'm still pondering.

fuinjutsu

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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #10 on: August 12, 2010, 07:27:20 PM »
Starting at 4th level, 6000gp, 15 point buy.

Either point buy works REALLY differently in pathfinder, or your DM just hates you.
Eh, the wizard have more money than them combined, he could in theory just use all his money on a fleet of trained attack mules, but then we aren't playing 3.5 but zergling rushing in Starcraft instead.

Senevri

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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #11 on: August 12, 2010, 07:58:17 PM »
it works really differently.
As it turns out, the final party was:
1.  human paladin
2.  human Ranger with 2h sword and bow
3.  human Monk with cestus and crossbow.
4.  gnome Alchemist of awesomeness.
and me.
I could've gone with the archer or the sorcerer, or bard, looking at it, but I didn't have an access to a printer and I was in a huge rush, so I went with the Rogue. Least amount of stepping on people's toes.
The ranger is okay, but the player seems to be a d20 newb. The Monk is... well,
combat reflexes, scorpion style, nimble moves.
Out of those, only Nimble Moves was really useful, as terrain is a factor. Incidentally, I hate forests.

The gnome alchemist had an extensive background prepared, as well as a custom set of equipment - with craft skills, he could just about double what he had, he had two wagons, a driver/muscle hireling and so forth.

My bat-belt of equipment was missing light sources as well as needle + thread.

One fight, vs. two giant spiders, and immediately afterwards, a basilisk. Got turned to stone. T_T. Got better ^_^. I rolled 18 to hit, so my total AB for a human rogue was 27 with TWF, which seemed surprising to some, so  I guess other folks' ABs aren't _that_ high.

I have a pair of non-magic mwk short swords - one is cold iron, the other adamantite. My extra feat went to combat expertise, as I could pick threatening defender as a trait. Also, I might try out disarming - although lack of humanoid opponents isn't promising right now.

I also totally forgot my idea of picking up a two-bladed sword using Heirloom weapon. >_<;

I THINK I can now say something about the PF Rogue, so here goes:
1. EVERYONE picks finesse at 2nd. Even archers should probably choose this.
2. picking WF for short swords... okay if you're not going heirloom 2-bladed (in which case you pick THAT, otherwise, it's the single combat feat or fast stealth. You get a total of 4 talents before the improved ones, and finesse, combat feat, fast stealth and _maybe_ Weapon focus are your picks. If you skip weapon focus, resiliency is probably your choice. Trap spotter, if you're in Tomb of Horrors.

There are very few dip-worthy choices - maybe fighter 2, for quick entry to Shadowdancer, which is still decent at 3 levels. A monk would do too, but loses 1 point of base attack.

Advanced Talents - Skill Mastery is great, and I like Opportunist and Crippling Strike too - lose Opportunist if it seems too costly. Also, a Feat!
And that's about it.

Basically, Rogue 16 is a good exit, at the latest. You may even go for Fighter 1/Shadowdancer 3, and lose nothing, BAB-wise.

Feats... There are some combinations, some which are good for charismatic rogues only - mine's a bit atypical. Combat Reflexes + Lunge is fine, of course, albeit nothing impressive. ITWF is probably worth it near 20th. Nimble Moves/Acrobatic Steps depends on the DM, but it can be very nice. Not sure about Acrobatic or Stealthy, but I'd wait 'til level 10, at least, before picking them. Imp Init, of course.

Senevri

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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #12 on: August 16, 2010, 10:02:21 PM »
Our Monk has an attack of +4. Flurry, +3. T_T

Got a chance to look through the APG. Some goodies for Monks, Shadow Strike make Precision Damage work in concealment, but is arguably redundant with the Greater Blindfight line.
Dirty Trick is a great maneuver. CMB to give the opponent a condition for 1 round? throw sand on eyes for BLINDNESS? Sneak attack!

There was also one which allowed a 5d6 SA rogue CdG stunned or cowering opponents. With the monk's Stuns, it could be nice...

Fight scene - since our alchemist's hireling, Gerardo has been 'guarding' us by, basically, sleeping outside, we set up watch. And got immediately attacked by a wolf pack. On my watch.
- Paladin's DEATH FROM ABOVE charged the Dire Wolf alpha male.
- Ranger tried to deal non-lethal to one wolf and managed nothing
- I got mauled, and dealt a grand total of 3 or so points of damage (thrown dart).
- My Warhorse opened a can of whoop-ass. It pretty much critted 1/round. Once with a Bite. (Which left the wolf alive, but in negatives. Our ranger was healing it all day long.) A Hoof-stomp splattered one wolf all over the place. Still, with AC of 13, and 19 HP, it got hurt badly. I managed to get the alchemist to concoct a cure potion for the horse, too.

 - Did I mention we - well, they - are travelling with a depressed minotaur kept in the alchemist's extravagant wagon? (it's apparently some guy who got stuck in a castle sub-basement hundreds of years ago and prayed for salvation. Note to self: never ever pray. ) His is the best Eeyore impression I've heard in a while.

Later, we also ran into a rather polite if a bit Evil (paladin radar, yo!) large green dragon (except, apparently not a true dragon, and maybe not color-coded for convenience) while looking into some missing kids' case, who mysteriously vanished from a village.
... Who apparently had a secret club and met every now and then in the woods...
... who had been entertaining the dragon with their stories, and...
... had apparently been kidnapped by GRIFFONS to get people suspecting the dragon, and get someone to kill it.

Unfortunately, we're running with a strict policy of giving enough rope to our opponents, and of not initiating hostilities.
Tricky with our (slightly stained) paladin,  but I think we can agree "getting help in saving kids" counts in "associating with evil for the purpose of preventing a greater evil from happening", and also redeeming an evil dragon can be neat.

I revealed some of my character's back story for others - basically, I work with a moral code which sees law and order as what's necessary for the society, and I've worked as a trouble consultant of sorts, sometimes in cases where someone's been trouble, and had needed removing. I was for the most part amazingly vague when speaking of it. ;)

Glutton

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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #13 on: August 16, 2010, 10:18:09 PM »
shame I didnt see this I would have heavily endorsed bard 8/ Arcane archer, as it is a really fabulous build in pathfinder, especially if you can get the Arcane Duelist Variant from the advanced players guide and swing a +1 seeking/+1 harmonizing elvencraft longbow out of your bonded item. Dirge of Doom is really fantastic, especially if you group can fit in a barbarian with the terrifying howl rage power. Best of luck on your rogue.

Senevri

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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #14 on: August 16, 2010, 10:32:39 PM »
Still open on suggestions with the Rogue?
- Is shadowdancer worth three sub-optimal feats? (well, less sub-optimal, once Lunge becomes feasible)
- Shadow Strike, must have? What of other APG stuff? I didn't have time to read through it, really.
- Your favorite, must-have Rogue talents? Core, or APG?

*sigh* I really should've gone for 'dirty fighter' or 'reactionary' for a trait instead of 'killer' -- well, I was in a rush with the traits, and I picked it partially for flavor... Oh well. No need to be 100% optimized all the time. I still get rarely chances to flank and get chewed up by wolves....

fuinjutsu

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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #15 on: August 17, 2010, 06:40:48 AM »
Still open on suggestions with the Rogue?
- Is shadowdancer worth three sub-optimal feats? (well, less sub-optimal, once Lunge becomes feasible)
- Shadow Strike, must have? What of other APG stuff? I didn't have time to read through it, really.
- Your favorite, must-have Rogue talents? Core, or APG?

*sigh* I really should've gone for 'dirty fighter' or 'reactionary' for a trait instead of 'killer' -- well, I was in a rush with the traits, and I picked it partially for flavor... Oh well. No need to be 100% optimized all the time. I still get rarely chances to flank and get chewed up by wolves....

Did they fix the Summon Shadow ability so it actually helps you in combat?
Eh, the wizard have more money than them combined, he could in theory just use all his money on a fleet of trained attack mules, but then we aren't playing 3.5 but zergling rushing in Starcraft instead.

Senevri

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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #16 on: August 17, 2010, 10:55:54 AM »
Did they fix the Summon Shadow ability so it actually helps you in combat?
What do you mean? The shadow has PC's BAB and saves, and half HP, so it shouldn't be totally useless, and works as a STR-draining flanking buddy in any case.

*edit* Here's an interesting Shadowdancer path (I'm a sucker for synergic prereqs.) Hardly uber, or anything, but...
[spoiler]
Rogue 4; Evasion, Trapfinding 2, Trap Sense +1, Rogue talents: Rogue Finesse(snatches weapon finesse), combat feat(dodge),
Feats: mobility
Ranger 2; Track, Wild Empathy 2, Favored Enemy, Quick Draw //Could use anything full BAB - LG could even be paladin.
Duelist 4; Canny Defense 4, Precise Strike 4, +2 init, +4 vs. AoO, Combat Reflexes, +2 Reflex save.
Shadowdancer 10.

Rec. Feat paths:
- Cleave, and Great Cleave are skirmish feats, so you can do bomb attacks, especially with Lunge vs. mobs. Great Cleave as a Std. action, then HiPS away.
- STEALTH is your thing, so SF:Stealth and Stealthy at level 11 would be nice picks for a +7 Stealth, total.
- Surprisingly Spring Attack works well for you, as you can hide as a part of a move action, so you literally appear as you strike and vanish immediately afterwards - you can only be catched by prepared or immediate actions, really. You already have +8 AC vs. attacks of opportunity, anyway.
- I like the fluff of lightning stance and it's almost as good - or sometimes even better - as HiPS - it takes two move actions to set up, but during your Concealment round you can hide wherever you damn well please.... I dunno.

So, how good IS your stealth, really?
- starting DEX of 18, +5 levels, +6 item, +5 book, puts you at 34. Let's presume a mishap of some sort and only 30 DEX. That's +10.
- Skill is a total of 23. Add Focus and Stealthy, and you're at 50. Unfortunately you missed out on Rogue's Take Ten advanced talent, but...
- Greater Shadow armor is +15, so that's a total of 65. Minimum check 66, maximum 85. That's some good hiding.
[/spoiler]

Also, took a look at Inquisitor and it is an awesome divine gish class. Up to +7 to attack and damage? add some AC, DR or fast healing on top. TWF or archery, that's really nice. I mean, not Paladin nice, but still.

Of course, plain old Bards get Arcane Strike which divines don't so... But, they have a rather nice divine list:
- divine favor, bless, true strike.
- heroism, greater magic weapon (no haste, though)
- divine power
- disrupting weapon, righteous might
- heroes' feast
They also get, oh, invisibility, all four holy word type spells, harm AND heal.
And half inquisitor level on intimidate checks? Nice for dazzling display/shatter defenses.
Super Bane weapons, Mettle, Wis to Init, all nice.
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I'm considering Improved Dirty Trick as a feat from APG, by the way. Blinded 1 round? Thank you.

fuinjutsu

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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #17 on: August 17, 2010, 03:22:44 PM »
Did they fix the Summon Shadow ability so it actually helps you in combat?
What do you mean? The shadow has PC's BAB and saves, and half HP, so it shouldn't be totally useless, and works as a STR-draining flanking buddy in any case.

I mean fix it vs core D&D.  The core shadow companion gets a few bonus hitdie, and most definitely does not use the PC's BAB.

the core shadow companion makes a great scout but isn't much for combat.
Eh, the wizard have more money than them combined, he could in theory just use all his money on a fleet of trained attack mules, but then we aren't playing 3.5 but zergling rushing in Starcraft instead.

Senevri

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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #18 on: August 17, 2010, 05:12:08 PM »
Well, take a look.
It has half HP, but also ignores half-damage --- and fewer creatures deal magic damage than you'd think, anyway.
BAB as per the PC, so that's... quite alright for touch attacks, really.

fuinjutsu

  • Bi-Curious George
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Re: [PATHFINDER]Core, choosing build.
« Reply #19 on: August 18, 2010, 07:16:10 PM »
Well, take a look.
It has half HP, but also ignores half-damage --- and fewer creatures deal magic damage than you'd think, anyway.
BAB as per the PC, so that's... quite alright for touch attacks, really.
Niiice.
And no death attack nonsense.  I'm liking this version.
Eh, the wizard have more money than them combined, he could in theory just use all his money on a fleet of trained attack mules, but then we aren't playing 3.5 but zergling rushing in Starcraft instead.