Author Topic: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?  (Read 30982 times)

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Chilastra022

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #80 on: June 27, 2010, 01:15:40 AM »
Well, in that case id probably just start out as warforged for the immunities, then greater metamorph into all the other types, saving outsider for last (since each time you metamorph you lose your SU's) and that way you can keep all the SU's you acquire from fusing with outsiders.

Sohala

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #81 on: June 27, 2010, 01:29:02 AM »
Just wondering, what are we trying to avoid while skipping sleep? Is there even a downside to not sleeping...I can't seem to find one. Though I thought there was mention of clerics not needing to sleep at some point...

edit: With the mention of cleric I was meaning you could get an item with a daily charge of whatever spell you need.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2010, 01:35:09 AM by Sohala »
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CustosTheFluffy

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #82 on: June 27, 2010, 01:32:50 AM »
Keeping the fusion and all buffs up, negating the need to re-apply and pay the XP cost.

jojolagger

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #83 on: June 27, 2010, 01:39:56 AM »
Keeping the fusion and all buffs up, negating the need to re-apply and pay the XP cost.
Which is due to using temporal reiteration each turn, which we can't do when sleeping.
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Sohala

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #84 on: June 27, 2010, 01:45:52 AM »
The drawback to not sleeping, without warforged/outsider, is?
"You think I'm talking about breaking the rules?"
"No I'm just trying to figure out how far you want them bent."
[spoiler]
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Amechra

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #85 on: June 27, 2010, 01:51:33 AM »
Isn't there some way to get your psicrystal to cast temporal reiteration for you?
[spoiler]Fighter: "I can kill a guy in one turn."
Cleric: "I can kill a guy in half a turn."
Wizard: "I can kill a guy before my turn."
Bard: "I can get three idiots to kill guys for me."

On a strange note, would anyone be put out if we had a post about people or events we can spare a thought for, or if its within their creed, a prayer for? Just a random thought, but ... hells I wouldn't have known about either Archangels daughter or Saeomons niece if I didn't happen to be on these threads.
Sounds fine to me.
probably over on "Off-topic".
might want to put a little disclaimer in the first post.

This is the Min/Max board. We should be able to figure out a way to optimize the POWER OF PRAYER(TM) that doesn't involve "Pazuzu, Pazuzu, Pazuzu".
[/spoiler]

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jojolagger

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #86 on: June 27, 2010, 02:16:35 AM »
The drawback to not sleeping, without warforged/outsider, is?
If you sleep the temporal reiteration loop stops. That is bad. We have thrallherd and fusion, so warforged and/or outsider can solve this with ease. I advise combining otherworldy and DCFS to fuse with anyone.


Isn't there some way to get your psicrystal to cast temporal reiteration for you?
it can get temporal reiteration a few times per day at epic levels, but that doesn't help.
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Quotes [spoiler]
In other words, he thinks there's a "correct" way to play D&D.  *sigh*
There is: Kill shit and loot the corpse!
When you use a tool the way it was designed for -- its intended function -- then it will work very well for you.

But it's not the tool's fault if you use it for something else and you fail utterly, such as trying to eat cereal with a butterknife, pounding nails with a screwdriver, blogging to voice your political opinions, and brushing your teeth with a hammer.
[/spoiler]

Sohala

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #87 on: June 27, 2010, 02:32:34 AM »
If you sleep the temporal reiteration loop stops. That is bad. We have thrallherd and fusion, so warforged and/or outsider can solve this with ease. I advise combining otherworldy and DCFS to fuse with anyone.
Drawback of sleeping ^
The drawback to not sleeping, without warforged/outsider, is?
"You think I'm talking about breaking the rules?"
"No I'm just trying to figure out how far you want them bent."
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Torgthen-The Darkening
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CustosTheFluffy

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #88 on: June 27, 2010, 03:01:37 AM »
Wasn't able to find out what happens without sleep, just found the following...

"Using the example situations above, staying awake might be a Constitution check (DC 12, +4 for every previous night without sleep)..."

So just a check to make sure your ass passes out.

New thought, say the second part of the fuse has a PrC that has the "+1 level manifest blah blah blah". Would that apply just their class or the 10 levels of Psion? Get 30+- level Psion in 20 levels?
« Last Edit: June 27, 2010, 03:06:07 AM by CustosTheFluffy »

Amechra

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #89 on: June 27, 2010, 03:05:32 AM »
rap, you know what I just remembered?
Elan racial abilities are immediate actions.

Now how do we get more than one immediate action a round?

And Otherworldly and DCFS would work, I believe.
You might want to use the Elan first, though. Then you can get aberrations, and all of their happy-fun racial abilities.

Heh, fusioning an Aboleth...
[spoiler]Fighter: "I can kill a guy in one turn."
Cleric: "I can kill a guy in half a turn."
Wizard: "I can kill a guy before my turn."
Bard: "I can get three idiots to kill guys for me."

On a strange note, would anyone be put out if we had a post about people or events we can spare a thought for, or if its within their creed, a prayer for? Just a random thought, but ... hells I wouldn't have known about either Archangels daughter or Saeomons niece if I didn't happen to be on these threads.
Sounds fine to me.
probably over on "Off-topic".
might want to put a little disclaimer in the first post.

This is the Min/Max board. We should be able to figure out a way to optimize the POWER OF PRAYER(TM) that doesn't involve "Pazuzu, Pazuzu, Pazuzu".
[/spoiler]

My final project for my film independent study course. It could do with a watching and critiquing

jojolagger

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #90 on: June 27, 2010, 03:18:47 AM »
New thought, say the second part of the fuse has a PrC that has the "+1 level manifest blah blah blah". Would that apply just their class or the 10 levels of Psion? Get 30+- level Psion in 20 levels?
If + 1 manifest blah blah blah is a class ability, yes you could.
Countdown to Zombie Apocalypse 97
When you see this, copy it into your sig and -1
:lovefirefox
Quotes [spoiler]
In other words, he thinks there's a "correct" way to play D&D.  *sigh*
There is: Kill shit and loot the corpse!
When you use a tool the way it was designed for -- its intended function -- then it will work very well for you.

But it's not the tool's fault if you use it for something else and you fail utterly, such as trying to eat cereal with a butterknife, pounding nails with a screwdriver, blogging to voice your political opinions, and brushing your teeth with a hammer.
[/spoiler]

CustosTheFluffy

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #91 on: June 27, 2010, 03:24:35 AM »
So Psion 10/Metemind 10 fused with cohort Fighter 1/Psion 1/Illithid Slayer 10/Anarchic Initiate 6 would get us a 30 level Psion..... WOOT!

jojolagger

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #92 on: June 27, 2010, 03:28:16 AM »
So Psion 10/Metemind 10 fused with cohort Fighter 1/Psion 1/Illithid Slayer 10/Anarchic Initiate 6 would get us a 30 level Psion..... WOOT!
They would also get a fighter bonus feat and some other stuff.  :D
Countdown to Zombie Apocalypse 97
When you see this, copy it into your sig and -1
:lovefirefox
Quotes [spoiler]
In other words, he thinks there's a "correct" way to play D&D.  *sigh*
There is: Kill shit and loot the corpse!
When you use a tool the way it was designed for -- its intended function -- then it will work very well for you.

But it's not the tool's fault if you use it for something else and you fail utterly, such as trying to eat cereal with a butterknife, pounding nails with a screwdriver, blogging to voice your political opinions, and brushing your teeth with a hammer.
[/spoiler]

Amechra

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #93 on: June 27, 2010, 03:58:13 AM »
[spoiler]Fighter: "I can kill a guy in one turn."
Cleric: "I can kill a guy in half a turn."
Wizard: "I can kill a guy before my turn."
Bard: "I can get three idiots to kill guys for me."

On a strange note, would anyone be put out if we had a post about people or events we can spare a thought for, or if its within their creed, a prayer for? Just a random thought, but ... hells I wouldn't have known about either Archangels daughter or Saeomons niece if I didn't happen to be on these threads.
Sounds fine to me.
probably over on "Off-topic".
might want to put a little disclaimer in the first post.

This is the Min/Max board. We should be able to figure out a way to optimize the POWER OF PRAYER(TM) that doesn't involve "Pazuzu, Pazuzu, Pazuzu".
[/spoiler]

My final project for my film independent study course. It could do with a watching and critiquing

Chilastra022

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #94 on: June 27, 2010, 06:52:41 AM »
Well, also remember that each time you metamorph into something else you lose your SU abilities to gain the SU's of the new form (even those acquired through fusion in this case), so you want to begin with a race that doesnt need sleep so when you finally stop needing metamorph you can end it, and regain -all- the racial abilities of all the fusioned creatures youve ever gotten. So while Elan's are great as a race (and certainly powerful with this type of character), for this the warforged is probably most ideal to start out as.

Edit: Or a necropolitan.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2010, 07:53:39 AM by Chilastra022 »

lianightdemon

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #95 on: June 27, 2010, 11:37:17 AM »
If your an Elan and able to use 3rd party resources theres a feat in the Races of the Elan known as Elan Vigilance (Psionic). Only requirement is being an Elan and you no longer need to sleep and you can no longer become exhausted. Must still rest for 8 hours to regain power points but since your not technically losing any with the font of power going then no need to rest either.

CustosTheFluffy

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #96 on: June 27, 2010, 12:53:40 PM »
Alright, so lets get working on a list of powers that the ML 30 Font/TR/Schism Elan should have up on loop. Starting off with AC I went with Inertial Armor (adding 19 Armor), Force Screen (Adding 11 Shield), Mental Barrier (Adding 11 Deflection), Thicken Skin (Adding 11 Natural), and Defensive Precognition (Adding 11 Insight). With no Dex modifier that should bring us to an AC of 73, and not too shabby for a 20th level. Now we just add the crazy sh*t. Biofeedback for DR 12/-, Power Resistance for a PR of 42, and Psionic Fly just cause. What else ya got?

Chilastra022

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #97 on: June 27, 2010, 01:42:28 PM »
Precognition, Defensive
Assimilate
Empathic Feedback
Adapt Body
Wall Walker
Prowess
Mind Blank
Teleport Trigger
Intellect Fortress
Empty Mind
Energy Retort >_> ionno, everything?

Edit: ah i repeated a few you already mentioned oh well.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2010, 01:46:51 PM by Chilastra022 »

jojolagger

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #98 on: June 27, 2010, 01:49:41 PM »
Of course, you're gonna have to hit huge or larger somehow.
DCFS for expanded knowledge : Expansion, Your going to have bonus feats that repeat at some point.
Countdown to Zombie Apocalypse 97
When you see this, copy it into your sig and -1
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Quotes [spoiler]
In other words, he thinks there's a "correct" way to play D&D.  *sigh*
There is: Kill shit and loot the corpse!
When you use a tool the way it was designed for -- its intended function -- then it will work very well for you.

But it's not the tool's fault if you use it for something else and you fail utterly, such as trying to eat cereal with a butterknife, pounding nails with a screwdriver, blogging to voice your political opinions, and brushing your teeth with a hammer.
[/spoiler]

Azrael

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Re: How to (ab)use Thrallherd for fun and profit?
« Reply #99 on: June 27, 2010, 03:27:34 PM »
Actually I believe its erattaed somewhere (by the creator of the power himself) that the original intent of fusion was to fuse with any type of character, but the metamorphosis works too.

You could shapechange or metamorphosis into an undead or the like, but my character uses Veil of Undeath (since hes fused with a wizard/initiate of the seven fold veil (thats right 24/7 indigo and violet veils :D ) which makes it so you don't have to sleep, then hes free to shapechange into anything he wants. However, if you play straight psion, stygian veil also does the trick.

There's also a warforged graft in one of the Eberron books (faiths I think) called the wakeful mind. It only costs 14k, -2 hp, and a -2 on all knowledge checks but makes it so you never have to sleep. I used that one for a while until I discovered veil of undeath/stygian veil.

Alright, so lets get working on a list of powers that the ML 30 Font/TR/Schism Elan should have up on loop. Starting off with AC I went with Inertial Armor (adding 19 Armor), Force Screen (Adding 11 Shield), Mental Barrier (Adding 11 Deflection), Thicken Skin (Adding 11 Natural), and Defensive Precognition (Adding 11 Insight). With no Dex modifier that should bring us to an AC of 73, and not too shabby for a 20th level. Now we just add the crazy sh*t. Biofeedback for DR 12/-, Power Resistance for a PR of 42, and Psionic Fly just cause. What else ya got?

Already WAYYY ahead of you...and this includes Azrael's spells from the wizard/initiate as well...and his AC is 138 btw :D

POWERS WHICH ARE ALWAYS ACTIVE (ML 20)

Vigor (285)*, Inertial Armor (33)*, Force Screen (18)*, Precognition Offensive (18)*, Precognition Defensive (18)*, Thicken Skin (18)*, Prescience Offensive (20)*, Concealing Amorpha Greater, Touchsight (300ft, transdimensional)*, Sense Danger (up to 56 pp)*, Mental Barrier (17)*, Detect Remote Viewing (widened), Schism, Freedom of Movement, Temporal Reiteration, Telekinetic Buffer, Second Chance, True Seeing, Dispelling Buffer, Moment of Prescience, Fusion, True Metabolism.

Note: *powers are manifested using 20 power link shards (ML 60).

SPELLS WHICH ARE ALWAYS ACTIVE (CL 2053 (17))

Bloodwind, Beastland Ferocity, Deep Breath, Divine Favor, Expeditious Retreat, Neverskitter, Tounges, Ferocity of Sanguine Rage (gives him +1026 to melee damage), Battlemagic Perception, Ghost Touch, Fly, Sonorous Hum (Major Image (irresistible)), Alter Fortune, Spellcaster’s Bane, Ruin Delvers Fortune (all), Delay Death, Consumptive Field x 12 (CL 2053), Friendly Fire, Favor of the Martyr, Divine Power, Forceward, Greater Blink, Duelward, Indominability, Eyes of the Oracle (readied action to use temporal accelertation if a timestop or temporal acceleration is used), Contingency (activates only if a mordenkainens disjunction effect would end up effecting Azrael – cast Time Stop), Starmantle, Freezing Glance (irresistible), Anticipate Teleport Greater, Antimagic Field (Modified with extraordinary spell aim so it doesn’t affect Azrael and Widened), Repulsion (irresistible), Veil (to make Azrael appear as Azrael), Arcane Spellsurge, Energy Immunity (All), Ironguard, Arcane Sight Greater, Ghostform, Golem Immunity, Superior Invisibility, Mind Blank, Veil of Undeath, Foresight, Effulgent Epuration (2053 spheres), Dimension Jumper Greater, Shapechange (default is troll form).

I could theoretically say I have every (beneficial) defensive spell in existence cast on him…but I think I’ve covered all the angles well enough.


I would just post the whole character but like I said before, hes far from finished and I have a lot of editing to do. The current Azrael is made only using two thralls and his believers. However, I plan on editing him using the "villiage of the thralls" model so I can get some factotum, archivist, druid, etc, levels in there as well.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2010, 03:43:19 PM by Azrael »