Author Topic: Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)  (Read 3412 times)

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Alastar

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Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)
« on: June 23, 2008, 04:20:16 PM »
Hey all, once again I require the attention of this board here.

this is for a friend of mine, he's a bit new, so he's not a full caster, so we made him a kinda morphic BSF with limited spell abilities. (He's the guy with the trex)

First of all, here is the character:

Druid 7/Beastmaster 1/Warshaper 4/Master of Many form 4

Now here I'm wondering: how to make him strong

I thought about removing some master of many form levels to get druid 9.

All books allowed.

So here's what i would require help with:

What are good fighting forms, considering he has a 2 size increase with his natural attacks (possibly more with GMW)

What are good items to get?

Suggestion of feats.

The idea here is to make him tanky enough to litterally eat people up and take a strongload of damage.

He lacks BAB so a humanoid form isn't such a good idea.

I'm literrally considering not going master of many forms, as it doesnt give him much.  He just picks one good fighting form and goes with it.

Maybe going to Druid 11/Beastmaster 1/ Warshaper 4 would be a good step for him, he kinda likes the animal forms anyways


As for items: he has a belt of magnificience + 4 with a wildling clasp, a +4 Darkleaf full plate that is wild, and that's about it.  I'm thinking maybe a wild shield too, maybe a monk's belt instead, althought he doesnt really boost his wisdom (more his cons).  Something to boost the rest?

He has paacticed spellcaster too.

Thansk for help gtg

Tshern

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Re: Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)
« Reply #1 on: June 23, 2008, 04:52:17 PM »
A little dip to Fist of the Forest if he's dumping spellcasting anyway?

With fighting forms you can't really go wrong with Venomfire+Fleshraker. Perhaps Aberrant wildshape to get Shrieking terror wildshape for 5 poison attacks per full attack... Can you combine Rapidstrike with that? That ought to be EASILY around 75d6 extra acid damage a round.

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Ubernoob

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Re: Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)
« Reply #2 on: June 23, 2008, 06:57:05 PM »
IMX, polymorph and friends are harder on noobs than spells.  I would *suggest* you not make the new player use wildshape.
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Alastar

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Re: Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2008, 12:21:05 AM »
IMX, polymorph and friends are harder on noobs than spells.  I would *suggest* you not make the new player use wildshape.

Oh i have suggested it, it<s just that he likes his character and has been playing it for a while.

Basically he just picks a shape and sticks with it, so really master of many forms doesnt do much for him, i might switch him to fist of the forest, gonna check it.

Basically, it's a semi-optimised game and he'S not that good, so the dm made him his character with him.  I decided to shush at creation but he's been subpar recently, so i'm trying to help him without shuffling things too much.

What's the book in ravenloft where there's a feat that allows you to use any stat for your main spellcasting stat?

Alastar

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Re: Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)
« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2008, 12:25:25 AM »
Checked fist of the forest, it's incredibly good, but do all those (ex) abilities carry over to his animal forms?  I thought they negated your existing (ex) abilities?

Straw_Man

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Re: Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)
« Reply #5 on: June 24, 2008, 03:22:28 AM »

Whys Beastmaster in there? And if he's not very eager to spellcast leave out Natural Spell (obvious) and perhaps try a Shifter Moonspeaker druid instead? Or maybe even a Bear Warrior/ Primeval build?

+1 Fleshraker even w/o Venomfire.

Items: Amulet of Mighty Fists, Wilding Clasp armour, ... I'll think more on it.
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Brainpiercing

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Re: Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2008, 06:36:02 AM »
Cut back to MOMF3 or MOMF 2 (all you really want is Giant anyway, although Fey can actually be tempting, but not for a BSF). You will also have noted that the MOMF (as well as the Warshaper) has the same inherent suck programmed into it as the Daggerspell shaper - namely that enhanced wildshape does NOT stack with druid wildshape for Max-HD and duration. How many Gargantuan 10HD creatures do you know? Personally I think this is a really in need of a house-rule. Without a House-rule, get back as many Druid levels as possible. That also most probably means cutting back Warshaper to 2 levels. Keep the Beastmaster so he can keep the T-Rex.

So the build would look like this:
Druid11-x/MOMF2/Beastermaster1/Warshaper2;Barb or Fighter x (may be 0, I guess)

What I would do:

Pick the meanest Troll form he can get with the max HD allowable (WAR Troll requires MOMF3 AND Druid 12, unless the Accessory update changes it to Giant type). This is also the minimum Druid level you need to stick with. (Is there such a thing as a Practiced Wildshape feat? I don't think so.)
Then always cast extended Enhance Wildshape for Ex-abilities. That will take care of most defensive needs, the remaining being to get as much resistance as possible to the elemental damage that can still damage him.
Offensively there are two possibilities: Melee or Ranged. Since unfortunately his classes have eaten a lot of feats, a good offense will likely as not require a level or two of Fighter. Personally I would seriously consider ranged, since it only really requires ONE feat, Brutal Throw. Power attack is a given for any fighting character, and if he can fit it in, Power Throw. Now all he needs is items. (You can use Weapon Crystals for Quick-draw and Returning properties.) The trouble with ranged is his low number of attacks due to low BAB.

The melee variant undoubtedly needs Shock-Trooper and Pounce, so likely needs Lion Totem Barb 1 (if not going Cave Troll) or Fighter1. He'll be going with a smaller Troll-form, Cave Troll seems the best. He also wants a big two-handed weapon in reserve in this case, perhaps a reach weapon. (Strongarm bracers and one size larger than the troll form.)

Of course there is also the monkish-route:

Monk2/Druid8/FOTF1/MOMF2/Warshaper2/Beastmaster1; Enough for normal Troll shape, or just a Fleshraker. Cave Troll at Lvl 17 with Druid 9. This is very strong defensively, but lacks the ability to cast the better Bite spells - which seriously cuts down the damage unless he uses Venomfire.

Straw_Man

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Re: Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2008, 06:48:34 AM »

I believe there is both a feat and items that enhance WS but damned if I can remember them. I'll find them in the archives eventaully but if a wiser CO'er were to step in and help out .... *nudges meaningfully*
"No, no, don't think, Maya." Ritsuko chided. "We will not gattai the Evas or their pilots.

Such thoughts lead inevitably to transformation sequences."

Risada

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Re: Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2008, 10:40:05 AM »

I believe there is both a feat and items that enhance WS but damned if I can remember them. I'll find them in the archives eventaully but if a wiser CO'er were to step in and help out .... *nudges meaningfully*

The feat is in Complete Adventurer.... Natural Bond or something...

Smudgy

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Re: Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2008, 11:45:17 AM »
Why does he have a belt of magnificence +4? Constitution and Wisdom are really the only things that'll apply to him. Seems like a waste of cash for adding +4 to some useless stats.

Alastar

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Re: Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2008, 12:51:15 PM »
Strenght and dexterity are also meaningful during batle, since he gets the bonuses to his wildshape form, due to the wildling clasp.

Surreal

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Re: Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)
« Reply #11 on: June 24, 2008, 03:04:17 PM »

I believe there is both a feat and items that enhance WS but damned if I can remember them. I'll find them in the archives eventaully but if a wiser CO'er were to step in and help out .... *nudges meaningfully*

The feat is in Complete Adventurer.... Natural Bond or something...
There's an amulet in Magic of Faerun that increases your wildshape (not sure if it updated in MiC). I don't think there's an official feat that does it, but I think there was something in Dragon.

Natural Bond increases your effective druid level in regards to your animal companion. It does nothing for wildshape.

Cut back to MOMF3 or MOMF 2 (all you really want is Giant anyway, although Fey can actually be tempting, but not for a BSF). You will also have noted that the MOMF (as well as the Warshaper) has the same inherent suck programmed into it as the Daggerspell shaper - namely that enhanced wildshape does NOT stack with druid wildshape for Max-HD and duration.
MoMF was errata'd to increase wildshape HD. Sadly, Daggerspell Shaper did not receive the same treatment.
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Brainpiercing

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Re: Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)
« Reply #12 on: June 24, 2008, 04:01:56 PM »
Count on me to forget erratas - even if they make sense, for a change.... :(

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Re: Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)
« Reply #13 on: June 24, 2008, 06:23:08 PM »
Checked fist of the forest, it's incredibly good, but do all those (ex) abilities carry over to his animal forms?  I thought they negated your existing (ex) abilities?
If you get them from race yes. But you keep abilities from class levels IIRC.

Risada

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Re: Druid BSF, cause that's the way it is ;)
« Reply #14 on: June 25, 2008, 10:23:56 AM »

I believe there is both a feat and items that enhance WS but damned if I can remember them. I'll find them in the archives eventaully but if a wiser CO'er were to step in and help out .... *nudges meaningfully*

The feat is in Complete Adventurer.... Natural Bond or something...
There's an amulet in Magic of Faerun that increases your wildshape (not sure if it updated in MiC). I don't think there's an official feat that does it, but I think there was something in Dragon.

Natural Bond increases your effective druid level in regards to your animal companion. It does nothing for wildshape.


Oh crap....that's what I get being AFB...