Time For a New Character. I've Been Dreading This for Months. *EDIT*

[kevin_video]

So the campaign's coming to a close, and I have to honestly think about what I'm going to be. Considering my options, I've got nothing. The DM's suggested that I copy what one of the players did with his red dragon, and take a gold dragon. Just I'd have illithid blood instead of merolith blood, and would have tentacles instead of extra arms. I'd rather try and stay original. At least as original as possible. He's also heavily suggested that I take a psionic. I don't know that that will be happening. I'd rather a spellcaster with a magic pool.

I've asked the DM to forward me what I've got for options next campaign.

Base races can be: gold dragon, spellscale, water elemental, ice mephling, elf, aquatic elf, human, medusa, half-elf, fire half-elf, fire elf, and illithid.

Base race templates are dragonborn, fire, water, and aquatic. After the character is born, half-celestial will be added to him.

LA templates that the character will have, unless a particular race is taken in exchange (ie taking the illithid base race from Savage Species instead of the half-illithid template) are half-dragon, half-illithid, half-medusa, half-water elemental, half-celestial, and (the son was cursed and a mystery template was added).

I'm not allowed any classes out of the main books (believe me I tried really hard), there are no buy-offs, and no I can't start from scratch. And we're not 100% sure, but we might be doing the 32 pt buy again for stats. I also don't have to take any of the LAs if I don't want to, unless I die. Then the blood will force the character to live again, and one of the templates will randomly show itself. At the same time, whatever you're killed by, you gain a template of as well (ie if you're killed by a demon you gain a level of half-fiend).

My original plan this time around, before all the LAs, was to go human wizard/sorcerer/ultimate magus since it's been quite a long time since I played an arcane user. I was considering going with it anyways, but the fire elf looks like a decent plan too. The only problem being that they lose CHA so being a sorcerer wouldn't do them much good.

I was also thinking of Lurker or Psychic Rogue since they'd probably fit this character's personality pretty well. At the same time, I was thinking a fighter type with full BAB which could come in handy since I'd be likely to not get too many class levels. In the end, the red dragon only got +6 BAB after 20 levels because of his +0 classes and LAs. I can see why the DM said I should do that.

I'm honestly stuck. And if I die, or take the levels, the templates don't even really add anything useful to the stats. Of course more INT and CHA never heard a wizard/sorcerer. Also, I'm sure a lot people would be against it, but I'd take the variant that makes it so the wizard loses his familiar and Scribe Scroll. To be honest, it's pretty much the only way you'd survive the DM's game. That spellbook and familiar are always the first target. That's why anything but a wizard survive his campaigns (unless he's playing them himself).

And inb4 "leave", "kill the DM", "get a new group", "take over the group", etc, etc, etc.

EDIT: Just got an e-mail from the DM with an answer to my question about the phrenic creature.

His answer:  Being part illithid qualifies him for Half-farspawn [Lords of Madness], Half-illithid [Fiend Folio], Illithid [Savage Species], Phrenic creature [XPH], and Pseudonatural [Manual of the Planes and 3.5 Update Booklet].

[Prime32]

If he likes psionics, see if you can choose phrenic as your template. Then take the Magic in the Blood feat.

Having levels in a ToB class would let you retrain your manouvers to higher-level ones whenever your ECL increases from a template. In the unlikely event that you can get Tome material allowed, a Fiendish Sphere would also increase in power based on character level.

No way you can just be a warforged? Or a racist guy obsessed with "blood purity"?



EDIT: Here's an idea - have you suggested to your DM that characters get a separate progression of monstrous/bloodline feats instead of templates?

For instance, at odd levels you get normal feats, at even levels you get a feat which must be something like Illithid Heritage or Celestial Bloodline. He could homebrew some stuff for more exotic lineages. Even if you don't get him to fully convert, if you show him some of these you're a step closer to getting Spheres.

[kevin_video]

No, it was too late to go the warforged route. I had everything planned out with a human swashbuckler/rogue idea, but then the kid got curse, and then remade as an illithid, etc, etc, etc, etc more templates added on, etc. I was thinking of just having his soul placed into a warforged, but the deities disallowed it once they found out that the child had illithid blood in it.

I'll look into the phrenic template, but he might not go for it unless I know 100% what I'm going for because he's starting to get tired of me constantly having him look at things, and not ending up going that route. Not to mention he's getting tired of saying "no" to things as well (most classes outside of WotC but are still d20).

ToB is very much allowed. We've got a swordsage and warblade in the current campaign.

[Prime32]

What if your character becomes a necropolitan? Most of his templates don't apply to undead.

On phrenic, note that PLAs are automatically augmented as if you spent a total number of pp equal to your character level (ie. a 12th-level character using a body adjustment PLA would be treated as if he spent 12pp on it, and can choose which augments to use that for).

[kevin_video]

What if your character becomes a necropolitan? Most of his templates don't apply to undead.

He'd make them apply. We've got a necropolitan dragonborn kobold sorcerer/paladin/force missile mage/fighter, and I don't even remember all the other templates that are on the guy.

And you can't just "become" an undead. The only reason the kobold became one was because of a botched wish, and his mother was a lich.

[Prime32]

And you can't just "become" an undead. The only reason the kobold became one was because of a botched wish, and his mother was a lich.

Necropolitans do in fact, "become" undead, and likewise you must willingly conduct a ritual in order to become a dragonborn.

It would still work if he became a dragonborn first, then a necropolitan, but he couldn't become either against his will.


What if you were a sharn? They have a special ability which means their form cannot be changed from its base by any means (so even gods can't apply templates to you), and they cannot interbreed with other creatures (in fact, it is physically impossible to turn into a sharn or disguise yourself as a sharn). Pretty powerful to boot.

[kevin_video]

And you can't just "become" an undead. The only reason the kobold became one was because of a botched wish, and his mother was a lich.

Necropolitans  do in fact, "become" undead, and likewise you must willingly conduct a ritual in order to become a dragonborn.

The fun thing about this DM is that there's an exception to every rule. Like dying. You can be -4000 HP and still be alive for 10 minutes afterwards. You're just clinically dead until either you're healed back to your death threshold, or you "die" if you don't. PCs just have divine intervention bring them back (usually as something else at the cost of an item or level). As for dragonborns, no ritual. Shortcut. You're born as one as if it were 4th ed.

[kevin_video]

And just found the feat Magic in the Blood. There's a 99.9% chance that he won't allow it because it's regional.

[Prime32]

And just found the feat Magic in the Blood. There's a 99.9% chance that he won't allow it because it's regional.

Dude, you have way more magic in your blood than wherever those guys live.

I'm going to repeat "Sharn Sharn Sharn!" in case you missed my edit.

[kevin_video]

And just found the feat Magic in the Blood. There's a 99.9% chance that he won't allow it because it's regional.

Dude, you have way more magic in your blood than wherever those guys live.

I'm going to repeat "Sharn Sharn Sharn!" in case you missed my edit.

lol Oh I know. This character's entire family line has been some sort of magic user. I even consider the shadow dancer to be such because you "summon" the shadow. At the very least it will mean me being elf because nothing else qualifies me. Not planetouched even though daddy is an outsider (half water elemental), or will he be a half celestial at the very beginning. Not spirit folk, dwarf, or gnome either. The problem that I'm seeing is the "SLA" vs "PLA". I can see him calling foul on that. 

And Gundam is awesome.

[Prime32]

At the very least it will mean me being elf because nothing else qualifies me. Not planetouched even though daddy is an outsider (half water elemental), or will he be a half celestial at the very beginning. Not spirit folk, dwarf, or gnome either.

Regional feats list those races because in the standard Forgotten Realms setting those are the only races living in places where they... sell magic syringes or something. Obviously things are different in your setting.

The problem that I'm seeing is the "SLA" vs "PLA". I can see him calling foul on that.  

Transparency.

[Havok4]

Well your DM is forcing this monstrosity on you you might as well try to make some use of the various templates you will likely be saddled with. Given that most of those seem to be focused on CHA you might want to try being a binder  to gain some use out of that it even works if you lose a lot of class levels. Also you continue to set the golden standard for best DM horror stories.

[Prime32]

Consider a lesser celadrin^DR350 - they're part elf and part celestial already, and get a Cha bonus along with bonuses to Cha-based skills.

[kevin_video]

Fair enough. I know when I started DMing I removed what was in brackets, but I still kept the prereqs (except allowed half races to count as the full race).

Transparency?

Well your DM is forcing this monstrosity on you you might as well try to make some use of the various templates you will likely be saddled with. Given that most of those seem to be focused on CHA you might want to try being a binder  to gain some use out of that it even works if you lose a lot of class levels. Also you continue to set the golden standard for best DM horror stories.

lol "The golden standard". That's a cute title. I don't know that I should take it as a compliment though.

But your line of thinking was what I had planned on doing. Use the templates to my advantage. The problem was I had no idea how to go about it. I mean, most of them were also going for INT too, so I thought Swashbuckler/Factotum/Warblade at one point. I'll have to look into the binder class though.

@ Prime32 -- Can't go lesser celadrin because I'm not celestial yet. That part will get added AFTER the kid is born.

[Nunkuruji]

What if your character becomes a necropolitan? Most of his templates don't apply to undead.

On phrenic, note that PLAs are automatically augmented as if you spent a total number of pp equal to your character level (ie. a 12th-level character using a body adjustment PLA would be treated as if he spent 12pp on it, and can choose which augments to use that for).

Think its based on HD, not ECL

Additionally, most/(all even?) of the offensive powers require saves, so Cha certainly becomes important.

[kevin_video]

Just updated the OP post guys. I've got more to choose from now.

EDIT: And yes Prime32, I did miss most of your edits. I'm going over the entire thread now to read the new info.

[Nunkuruji]

Just updated the OP post guys. I've got more to choose from now.

An Illithid Savant as a PC would be fun, for the sheer entertainment. LA is too prohibitive to make it an option in most games.

[kevin_video]

Just updated the OP post guys. I've got more to choose from now.

An Illithid Savant as a PC would be fun, for the sheer entertainment. LA is too prohibitive to make it an option in most games.

I've looked into that actually, the DM has no problem with me taking it. The only problem is that it all depends on whether or not we do an evil campaign or not. Considering this character's dad is becoming a demi-god, his grandfather is a cleric outsider of Celestia, and his great grandfather is a wizard god-like being, him being evil might have some major repercussions. And that's not even including mom, grandma, and great grandma who are even scarier (accomplished deity wizard, great wyrm gold dragon, medusa rogue).

[kevin_video]

EDIT: Here's an idea - have you suggested to your DM that characters get a separate progression of monstrous/bloodline feats instead of templates?

For instance, at odd levels you get normal feats, at even levels you get a feat which must be something like Illithid Heritage or Celestial Bloodline. He could homebrew some stuff for more exotic lineages. Even if you don't get him to fully convert, if you show him some of these you're a step closer to getting Spheres.

No. You can access those feats thanks to those templates, but you can't take those feats in exchange for the templates. You can take the original template, or the bloodline variant from UA.

What if you were a sharn? They have a special ability which means their form cannot be changed from its base by any means (so even gods can't apply templates to you), and they cannot interbreed with other creatures (in fact, it is physically impossible to turn into a sharn or disguise yourself as a sharn). Pretty powerful to boot.

Sharn is not an option I'm afraid.

[Hallack]

If you are still considering UM at all you could consider Beguiler for the Spontaneous side for more Int synergy.

But you said no main book classes didn't you, so wizard is out. :\

How well do you think you will be able to avoid the death/template additions?

A well made caster certainly has better long term options in that regard if you can live long enough.  When the time becomes appropriate try to get Craft contingency  for the awesome cover your butt fun.  Of course I realize that could be huge hurdle for you given you could end up with ECL over 20 in short order but with Caster Levels nowhere near the needed 11 for that feat.