Author Topic: Armored caster Tank  (Read 3013 times)

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RealMarkP

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Armored caster Tank
« on: May 17, 2010, 02:24:31 PM »
I'm looking at a character whose main role is to be the party tank. So lots of AC, decent HP, full plate + shield, and the Goad feat. What I'm debating is making him a caster, so that he could do nothing but touch attacks while tanking. Any suggestions for a build like this?

Here is my first stab at this build:

Build: Human, Cleric 1/Fighter 2/Ordained Champion 5/Cleric 12
Flaw: ??
Feat Ideas (Not in order): Goad, Combat Casting, Shielded Casting, Shield Specialization, Shield Ward, Maximize Spell, DMM (Maximize), Divine Power and Righteous Might.
« Last Edit: May 17, 2010, 02:34:13 PM by RealMarkP »

Littha

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Re: Armored caster Tank
« Reply #1 on: May 17, 2010, 02:30:58 PM »
In all reality cleric works fine like this on its own, i was working on a build using some PRCs from dragonlance the other day that did something similar.

Cleric 4/Fighter 1/Barbarian (Lion) 1/Knight of the Crown 1/Knight of the Sword 3/Knight of the Rose 10
Ends up with 18 BAB and 9th level spells, has a bit of a lagg on casting between 4 and 7 though still playable.

really the best use of spells for this kind of character isnt touch attacks and is more along the lines of buffs, if you lose caster levels anywhere your save DCs wont be so good.

Maximize isn't the best metamagic you can get, even for touch attacks.

juton

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Re: Armored caster Tank
« Reply #2 on: May 17, 2010, 04:20:25 PM »
Ordained Champion is insanely good, especially if you can get AMF on your list at a lower level, because you can channel it. Fist of Raziel and Knight of the Raven are good choices for a Cleric/Fighter, if you end up taking this route your total number of Cleric levels will be small so you could use Archivist which give you more versatility as a caster.

Havok4

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Re: Armored caster Tank
« Reply #3 on: May 17, 2010, 04:26:51 PM »
Bone knight (7N) might be a good choice as well but it lends it self more towards undead army creation than buffing, although it makes you nigh unkillable as an added bonus.

Endarire

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Re: Armored caster Tank
« Reply #4 on: May 17, 2010, 06:42:58 PM »
Hood has an arcane 'tank' build called the Trancer.  It's build #8.
Hood - My first answer to all your build questions; past, present, and future.

Speaking of which:
Don't even need TO for this.  Any decent Hood build, especially one with Celerity, one-rounds [Azathoth, the most powerful greater deity from d20 Cthulu].
Does it bug anyone else that we've reached the point where characters who can obliterate a greater deity in one round are considered "decent?"

Ivory Knight

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Re: Armored caster Tank
« Reply #5 on: May 17, 2010, 07:24:43 PM »
Just to have it mentioned: Dwarves make decent arcane tanks too.
Wizard 2/Duskblade 3/ Runesmith 4(advancing Wizard)/ Abjurant Champion 5(advancing Duskblade at 1 Level, to get casterlevel = BaB)/ anything you like 6(I'd prefer Knight Phantom: Ride a Phantom Steed and channel your Spells through a Lance)

BaB is 11 by ECL 14
Casterlevel(both classes) = BaB, may get higher for wizard if you get 3/4 or 1/2 BaB from your last 6 levels.
Spellprogression is only Wizard 10 at ECL 14, so no 9th level Spells :banghead

Can someone check, if Duskblades can get into Sublime Chord?
I tried to avoid using it, because it's MAD and also requires you to use Dream or Gold Dwarf(for -2 Dex instead of -2 Cha; Dream Dwarves are better than PHB-Dwarves anyway) :rollseyes

RealMarkP

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Re: Armored caster Tank
« Reply #6 on: May 17, 2010, 07:47:57 PM »
Just to have it mentioned: Dwarves make decent arcane tanks too.
Wizard 2/Duskblade 3/ Runesmith 4(advancing Wizard)/ Abjurant Champion 5(advancing Duskblade at 1 Level, to get casterlevel = BaB)/ anything you like 6(I'd prefer Knight Phantom: Ride a Phantom Steed and channel your Spells through a Lance)

BaB is 11 by ECL 14
Casterlevel(both classes) = BaB, may get higher for wizard if you get 3/4 or 1/2 BaB from your last 6 levels.
Spellprogression is only Wizard 10 at ECL 14, so no 9th level Spells :banghead

Can someone check, if Duskblades can get into Sublime Chord?
I tried to avoid using it, because it's MAD and also requires you to use Dream or Gold Dwarf(for -2 Dex instead of -2 Cha; Dream Dwarves are better than PHB-Dwarves anyway) :rollseyes

Ohh I like the idea. Isn't there a dwarf sub-race that grants a first level feat, just like a human? Also, there is a dwarf subrace, which is in one of the DR magazines, which tries to mimic the dwarf from world of warcraft. I think it makes a nicer tank, IMO. I just need to find the correct issue...

Littha

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Re: Armored caster Tank
« Reply #7 on: May 17, 2010, 08:23:25 PM »
Exiled Dwarves, Dragon 320. From Warcraft III

lose:
Darkvision
Stonecunning
Stability
Resist Poison
Resist Magic

Gain:
Feat
extra +1 vs orcs and goblins (now +2)
extra +2 AC vs giants  (now +6)
Favored Class: Barbarian

RealMarkP

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Re: Armored caster Tank
« Reply #8 on: May 17, 2010, 09:00:57 PM »
Bah, never mind. I recalled it being beefier than that.

Ivory Knight

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Re: Armored caster Tank
« Reply #9 on: May 18, 2010, 10:41:37 AM »
@Exiled Dwarves:
Not bad, opens up 2 options:
Lion Totem Barbarian(CC) for pounce
Titan Fighting(RoS) for +6 against anything Large or larger

For this build, I'd call it a loss.

With PHB-Dwarves Wizard 4/Dwarf Fighter 1(Sublevel from RoS) can get 9th Level Spells at ECL 19+, but loses the duskblade's channel spell feature(1/day channel could be gained from Spellsword 1).

carnivore

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Re: Armored caster Tank
« Reply #10 on: May 18, 2010, 11:09:39 AM »
first ...what is the starting level?

I'm looking at a character whose main role is to be the party tank. So lots of AC, decent HP, full plate + shield, and the Goad feat. What I'm debating is making him a caster, so that he could do nothing but touch attacks while tanking. Any suggestions for a build like this?

Here is my first stab at this build:

Build: Human, Cleric 1/Fighter 2/Ordained Champion 5/Cleric 12
Flaw: ??
Feat Ideas (Not in order): Goad, Combat Casting, Shielded Casting, Shield Specialization, Shield Ward, Maximize Spell, DMM (Maximize), Divine Power and Righteous Might.

even with a Build like this .... what equipment would you have?

answer these questions ... and i will give you something interesting to think about :flutter


 :D

Mixster

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Re: Armored caster Tank
« Reply #11 on: May 18, 2010, 12:02:53 PM »
Why combat casting?

Also, don't forget to take a level of prestige paladin somewhere in there, it's insane, especially if you can sub the level. Comtemplative on the high levels might also be a good idea.
Monks are pretty much the best designed class ever.

JaronK

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Hallack

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Re: Armored caster Tank
« Reply #12 on: May 18, 2010, 12:17:12 PM »
What about replacing some of the levels with Ruby Knight Vindicator?
Placeholder - T'tosc

RealMarkP

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Re: Armored caster Tank
« Reply #13 on: May 18, 2010, 01:39:35 PM »
So for items it would be something to the order of Full plate plus shield. Either unarmed, punching dagger or long sword (with the ability to channel touch spell) to deliver touch attacks.

EDIT: I'm actually looking into the RKV class. It seems like a definite win.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2010, 01:44:29 PM by RealMarkP »

carnivore

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Re: Armored caster Tank
« Reply #14 on: May 18, 2010, 02:19:43 PM »
you dont need Armor to be a Tank .... notice:

Full Plate gives +8 Armor and +1 Max Dex

+5 Mithral Full Plate(+13 Armor bonus w/ +3 max Dex) and +5 Animated Large Shield(+7 Shield Bonus) = including Dex of 16 ..... +23 to AC

as opposed to this:

Monks Belt and +8 Bracers of Armor with 30 Wis and 16 Dex = +21 to AC

2 points of AC wont make too much Difference .... but the Cost will 83000gp vs 77000gp

the other advantage..... its easy to conceal the fact that you are fully prepared for combat at all times when you only need a Belt and bracers.... many think you will be an easy target(to thier surprise) and wont give you much thought .... better to look like a Servant or noncombatant ... more fun also

 :D


Freshums

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Re: Armored caster Tank
« Reply #15 on: May 18, 2010, 02:29:51 PM »
you dont need Armor to be a Tank .... notice:

Full Plate gives +8 Armor and +1 Max Dex

+5 Mithral Full Plate(+13 Armor bonus w/ +3 max Dex) and +5 Animated Large Shield(+7 Shield Bonus) = including Dex of 16 ..... +23 to AC

as opposed to this:

Monks Belt and +8 Bracers of Armor with 30 Wis and 16 Dex = +21 to AC

2 points of AC wont make too much Difference .... but the Cost will 83000gp vs 77000gp

the other advantage..... its easy to conceal the fact that you are fully prepared for combat at all times when you only need a Belt and bracers.... many think you will be an easy target(to thier surprise) and wont give you much thought .... better to look like a Servant or noncombatant ... more fun also

 :D



Magic Vestment ;)