Author Topic: Ghost Build  (Read 5486 times)

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Mushroom

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Ghost Build
« on: March 03, 2010, 03:42:53 AM »
I'm going to be playing as a ghost in an upcoming campaign. My existence will be tied to my GF's character(mine came back from the dead to protect her) so he'll be damn near unkillable. My DM has ruled I gain HD even when I take LA(lol I dunno if he meant actual HD or just HD for Hp) and he said no template stacking(so no templates other than ghost)

Race:Human
Alignment:(dunno yet)
Stats:
Str 16
Dex 18
Con 0(was 16)
Wis 17
Int 18
Cha 18


I Need help with feats and class suggestions for after Ghost as long as it is non evil(so no Ur Priest and my Dm isn't fond of using the adaptation section)

dark_samuari

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #1 on: March 03, 2010, 04:17:32 AM »
Two questions

1. What ECL or level are you starting at?

2. What type of ghost/character do you want to play?

The_Mad_Linguist

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #2 on: March 03, 2010, 06:20:04 AM »
OK, to avoid being ninjaed.  Ghost Savage Progression: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040117a

You're going to want to get Telekinesis as your ghost power (it's a really awesome spell), and then go into Master of the Unseen Hand.  

As for feats, telekinetic wielder (lords of madness) lets you use telekinesis to activate magic items.

There's a feat in Libris Mortis that lets you see the life force of people - they glow and shed light as a torch, which makes invisibility and other abilities a lot less useful against you.

In addition, you're going to want to take the "ghostly grasp" feat, which lets you manipulate objects as if corporeal if you please.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2010, 06:24:40 AM by The_Mad_Linguist »
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snakeman830

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #4 on: March 03, 2010, 02:01:15 PM »
Ooh, TK Ghost Reaping Mauler XD.

There's a class with such limited uses. It's at it's best augmenting TK XD
I was wondering when we'd find a use for that PrC...
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Mushroom

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #5 on: March 03, 2010, 05:38:18 PM »
OK, to avoid being ninjaed.  Ghost Savage Progression: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040117a

You're going to want to get Telekinesis as your ghost power (it's a really awesome spell), and then go into Master of the Unseen Hand.  

As for feats, telekinetic wielder (lords of madness) lets you use telekinesis to activate magic items.

There's a feat in Libris Mortis that lets you see the life force of people - they glow and shed light as a torch, which makes invisibility and other abilities a lot less useful against you.

In addition, you're going to want to take the "ghostly grasp" feat, which lets you manipulate objects as if corporeal if you please.
Thanks for the feat suggestion

I had already planned on taking Telekinesis and combining it with MotUH

Two questions

1. What ECL or level are you starting at?

2. What type of ghost/character do you want to play?
1.ECL 2(I'm using the progression)
2.I'm open to suggestions

Ooh, TK Ghost Reaping Mauler XD.

There's a class with such limited uses. It's at it's best augmenting TK XD
This is actually a cool idea, I'll definitely consider it

Shadowhunter

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #6 on: March 03, 2010, 07:06:17 PM »
You have insane stats. Good rolling.

Hexblade is any non-good, so it's technically not evil per se.

It has Concentration as a class skill, which Master of the Unseen Hand requires.

It has Arcane Resistance, granting you your CHA to Saves against spells. Oddly enough, even divine spells, despite the name.

It has full BAB, which I'm sure can help for something, somewhere, somehow.

It gets Mettle, which is a good thing. Very good.

And it has that funny little curse, if you feel like de-buff lite.

For a ranged build, using TK with objects, Dragon Magazine is your friend.
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Paladin is always good for some more Cha to Saves/AC (sub. level).
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Havok4

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #7 on: March 03, 2010, 07:25:20 PM »
Be sure to take the ghostly grasp feat that was mentioned earlier as it will allow you to use gear properly.
Another good option for a class would be swordsage for the various defensive maneuvers and some bonus damage on your telekinesis weapon barrages.

The_Mad_Linguist

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #8 on: March 03, 2010, 07:45:32 PM »
Picking up sneak attack isn't a bad idea either - given that violent thrust will give you 12 to 15 attacks which it can apply to.
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Mushroom

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #9 on: March 03, 2010, 07:51:08 PM »
Picking up sneak attack isn't a bad idea either - given that violent thrust will give you 12 to 15 attacks which it can apply to.
My DM seems to think that Sneak attack dice is only applied once



Odd, right?

Black Knight

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2010, 08:00:28 PM »
Picking up sneak attack isn't a bad idea either - given that violent thrust will give you 12 to 15 attacks which it can apply to.
My DM seems to think that Sneak attack dice is only applied once



Odd, right?

Actually.... the answer is that it depends.  If you are invisible and can attack more than once, only the first attack gets the Sneak attack dice. 

But if you are flanking your opponent, then each attack gets the Sneak attack dice.
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PhaedrusXY

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2010, 08:07:27 PM »
Picking up sneak attack isn't a bad idea either - given that violent thrust will give you 12 to 15 attacks which it can apply to.
My DM seems to think that Sneak attack dice is only applied once



Odd, right?

Actually.... the answer is that it depends.  If you are invisible and can attack more than once, only the first attack gets the Sneak attack dice.  

But if you are flanking your opponent, then each attack gets the Sneak attack dice.
That depends on how you are invisible. If it is with Greater Invisibility, attacking doesn't break the effect. So all of your attacks would indeed get SA dice added to them.

If it is with the normal Invisibility spell, the effect ends as soon as you attack once. That's why you don't get the SA dice on your later attacks.

Your DM is probably stuck in the days of 2nd edition. That's how it worked then. A LOT of "old-schoolers" cried OVERPOWERED when they realized that a rogue's "Backstab" applied to all attacks he gets for a round under certain, easy to satisfy, conditions in 3.X.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2010, 08:09:06 PM by PhaedrusXY »
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The_Mad_Linguist

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2010, 08:26:07 PM »
Violent thrust has all the attacks arrive simultaneously.  So if you can get it on one of them, no reason you can't get it on all of them.
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dark_samuari

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2010, 08:27:30 PM »
I'm going to make a plea to consider warlock as your intro-class to Master of the Unseen Hand.

Human Ghost (I don't know how many levels you want from the progression but let's assume 3) Warlock 6 (As to nab your first lesser invocation)/Master of the Unseen Hand 5.

What you'll get from Warlock:
Eldritch Blast +3d6 (a nice ranged weapon to use while you wait for your telekinesis to reload).
Detect Magic at will (Eh... It never hurts to have it and if anything may make it easier to detect/engage the enemy spell caster as they'll have the strongest aura)
Deceive Item (Always nice and useful if used in conjunction with telekinetic wielder)
Invocations: The Dead Walk (instantly create infantry zombies for combat; helps with the whole undead flavor), Summon Swarm (instantly create swarms for combat; also helps with the whole undead flavor), See the Unseen (greatly increases your combat awareness) and Entropic Warding (20% miss chance for all ranged attacks towards you is nothing to scoff at).

All together this pulls off a very undead-flavored ghost who encompasses strong combat capabilities in conjunction with it's ghostly abilities.

Mushroom

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #14 on: March 03, 2010, 09:24:41 PM »


If it is with the normal Invisibility spell, the effect ends as soon as you attack once. That's why you don't get the SA dice on your later attacks.

Your DM is probably stuck in the days of 2nd edition. That's how it worked then. A LOT of "old-schoolers" cried OVERPOWERED when they realized that a rogue's "Backstab" applied to all attacks he gets for a round under certain, easy to satisfy, conditions in 3.X.
A little off topic, but mind finding where something like SA dice is applied more than once in the rules? Me and my group have fought and fought about that

snakeman830

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #15 on: March 03, 2010, 09:27:03 PM »


If it is with the normal Invisibility spell, the effect ends as soon as you attack once. That's why you don't get the SA dice on your later attacks.

Your DM is probably stuck in the days of 2nd edition. That's how it worked then. A LOT of "old-schoolers" cried OVERPOWERED when they realized that a rogue's "Backstab" applied to all attacks he gets for a round under certain, easy to satisfy, conditions in 3.X.
A little off topic, but mind finding where something like SA dice is applied more than once in the rules? Me and my group have fought and fought about that
Quote from: SRD

Right there, actually.  Each attack that fulfills the requirements does the extra damage.  Keep in mind that sneak attack is only ever applied once per attack roll.
I am constantly amazed by how many DM's ban Tomb of Battle.  The book doesn't even exist!

Quotes:[spoiler]
By yes, she means no.
That explains so much about my life.
hiicantcomeupwithacharacterthatisntaghostwhyisthatamijustretardedorsomething
Why would you even do this? It hurts my eyes and looks like you ate your keyboard before suffering an attack of explosive diarrhea.
[/spoiler]

If using Genesis to hide your phylactry, set it at -300 degrees farenheit.  See how do-gooders fare with a liquid atmosphere.

Saxony

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #16 on: March 03, 2010, 09:31:25 PM »
OK, to avoid being ninjaed.  Ghost Savage Progression: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040117a

You're going to want to get Telekinesis as your ghost power (it's a really awesome spell), and then go into Master of the Unseen Hand.  

As for feats, telekinetic wielder (lords of madness) lets you use telekinesis to activate magic items.

There's a feat in Libris Mortis that lets you see the life force of people - they glow and shed light as a torch, which makes invisibility and other abilities a lot less useful against you.

In addition, you're going to want to take the "ghostly grasp" feat, which lets you manipulate objects as if corporeal if you please.

Savage Progressions must be completed without any intervening levels. They are good if your starting ECL is less than the LA of the template (so you can get half of it right away), but the end result is the exact same.
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Saxony

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #17 on: March 03, 2010, 09:32:34 PM »


If it is with the normal Invisibility spell, the effect ends as soon as you attack once. That's why you don't get the SA dice on your later attacks.

Your DM is probably stuck in the days of 2nd edition. That's how it worked then. A LOT of "old-schoolers" cried OVERPOWERED when they realized that a rogue's "Backstab" applied to all attacks he gets for a round under certain, easy to satisfy, conditions in 3.X.
A little off topic, but mind finding where something like SA dice is applied more than once in the rules? Me and my group have fought and fought about that
Quote from: SRD

Right there, actually.  Each attack that fulfills the requirements does the extra damage.  Keep in mind that sneak attack is only ever applied once per attack roll.

Is there an actual example of a Rogue getting multiple sneak attacks per round in Core?
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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #18 on: March 03, 2010, 09:35:28 PM »
OK, to avoid being ninjaed.  Ghost Savage Progression: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040117a

You're going to want to get Telekinesis as your ghost power (it's a really awesome spell), and then go into Master of the Unseen Hand.  

As for feats, telekinetic wielder (lords of madness) lets you use telekinesis to activate magic items.

There's a feat in Libris Mortis that lets you see the life force of people - they glow and shed light as a torch, which makes invisibility and other abilities a lot less useful against you.

In addition, you're going to want to take the "ghostly grasp" feat, which lets you manipulate objects as if corporeal if you please.

Savage Progressions must be completed without any intervening levels. They are good if your starting ECL is less than the LA of the template (so you can get half of it right away), but the end result is the exact same.

The Savage Progressions posted on the Wizards Site specifically say you don't have to take them all in a row.

snakeman830

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Re: Ghost Build
« Reply #19 on: March 03, 2010, 09:39:00 PM »
OK, to avoid being ninjaed.  Ghost Savage Progression: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040117a

You're going to want to get Telekinesis as your ghost power (it's a really awesome spell), and then go into Master of the Unseen Hand. 

As for feats, telekinetic wielder (lords of madness) lets you use telekinesis to activate magic items.

There's a feat in Libris Mortis that lets you see the life force of people - they glow and shed light as a torch, which makes invisibility and other abilities a lot less useful against you.

In addition, you're going to want to take the "ghostly grasp" feat, which lets you manipulate objects as if corporeal if you please.

Savage Progressions must be completed without any intervening levels. They are good if your starting ECL is less than the LA of the template (so you can get half of it right away), but the end result is the exact same.
You're thinking Monster Classes.  Savage Progressions are slightly different and they can indeed be seperated.  (note: Savage Progressions are always of templates)

Is there an example?  Most likely, although not on the SRD.  It is right there in the text of the Sneak Attack ability that it works as we say.  "deals extra damage any time her target would be denied a Dexterity Bonus to AC /or when the rogue flanks the target".  Are the conditions filled?  If so, then the Rogue's atack deals sneak attack damage as well as normal damage.  Note that nowhere in the text does it say it only applies once per round, merely once per attack.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2010, 09:46:37 PM by snakeman830 »
I am constantly amazed by how many DM's ban Tomb of Battle.  The book doesn't even exist!

Quotes:[spoiler]
By yes, she means no.
That explains so much about my life.
hiicantcomeupwithacharacterthatisntaghostwhyisthatamijustretardedorsomething
Why would you even do this? It hurts my eyes and looks like you ate your keyboard before suffering an attack of explosive diarrhea.
[/spoiler]

If using Genesis to hide your phylactry, set it at -300 degrees farenheit.  See how do-gooders fare with a liquid atmosphere.