Author Topic: Summon Nature's Ally  (Read 7195 times)

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Akkristor

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Summon Nature's Ally
« on: January 20, 2010, 12:11:04 AM »
I'm currently playing a Druid, and I have to admit, Summon Nature's Ally and Summon Monster never really interested me that much, but i'm trying to change that.  I'm beginning to realize the usefulness of SNA, but I'm noticing something that is bothering me a bit.

So much more love is given to Summon Monster in other sourcebooks than to Summon Nature's Ally.

I'm only able to find a few creatures in other sourcebooks that can be added to SNA:

Elementite Swarms (Planar Handbook)
Storm Elementals (MMIII)
Fetid Fungus (MMV)

I'm looking for tips on how to use SNA more effecitvely, and other books that may add critters to SNA.  So far, I'm not sure i'm doing it too well.  Only 6th level druid, more focused on Wild Shape, and so far the most I've really done with it is summon a pack of wolves to help flank, and I needed a Thoqua to get stuff out of a burning ship.

snakeman830

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2010, 12:15:52 AM »
Moonspeaker (Races of Eberron) is a prestige class that adds options to SNA (and also several other useful spells).  How would you like to spend a 7th level spell summoning 7th level druid casting?  Yup.  Moonspeaker adds Nymph as an option.  Shifter only, though, so that might make things more difficult.
I am constantly amazed by how many DM's ban Tomb of Battle.  The book doesn't even exist!

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deuxhero

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2010, 01:53:14 AM »
Use SNA 4 to summon a unicorn. Great healing.

telehax

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2010, 02:38:02 AM »
If you want to invest the feats, here's a list from the Druid Handbook:
Quote
  • Summoning Related Feats
    • Augment Summoning: +4 bonus to strength and dexterity is a good bonus, but the problem is that it requires a useless feat, spell focus (conjuration). Luckily for us, there are ways around that (like initiate of malar or the 7th half-orc substitution level).
    • Greenbound SummoningLEoF: Very powerful feat, especially at low levels. It's so good, it's cheesy. Most DMs will ban this outright.  The only downside is that you can't use your animal buffs on your summons anymore.
    • Rashemi Elemental SummoningUE: Lets you turn your air elemental summons into orglashes with 3/day cone of cold and earth elemental summons into thomils that engulf.
    • AshboundECS: Doubles the duration of summons and gives them a luck bonus to attack.
    • Beckon the FrozenFrost: +1d6 cold damage on all your summoned critters' attacks. Good for summoning specialists. Just be careful; your BtF-enhanced summons will be vulnerable to fire. Not available if you bypass the Spell Focus (Conjuration) prereq of Augment Summoning, as the Spell Focus is specifically called out in this feat's prereqs.
    • Imbued SummoningPHB2: Essentially a free Quicken for low-level buffs on Summoned creatures. (Personally, I suggest Greater Magic Fang or the ridiculously good Venomfire.) It's not terribly useful on spontaneously-cast Summons, though.
    • Initiate of MalarPGtF: Gives animal-only Augment Summoning for free, and also gives some pretty lame extra spells. You have to worship Malar, though, which conflicts mechanically with Exalted feats (seeing as Malar is evil and all) and thematically with Rashemi Elemental Summoning. (The Hathrans do not often teach their secrets to followers of Malar.)
In addition, Ring of the Beast allows you to get more mileage out of summoning.

CannibalSmith

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2010, 02:44:57 AM »
SNA doesn't need help from sourcebooks. It's awesome already.

SNA II: Hippogriffs. Order them to pick up enemies and fly up. Or use them to help you cover chasms.
SNA III: Gian Eagles. Same as hippogriffs.
SNA IV: Unicorn. Healing.
SNA V: Janni. Enlarge Person, Invisibility, Etherealness(!!).

cru

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2010, 07:05:52 AM »
The Druid Handbook lists the preferred options: http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=1354.0
Also, consider alternative spells, like Conjure Ice Beast series from Frostburn, at least at lower levels (my fave forms are Ice beast wolfs with cold aura and Ice beast huge monstrous centipede with breath weapon).
At level 9 you can cast Animal Growth and your animal friends suddenly become much better!

Akkristor

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2010, 02:50:35 AM »
Oi, no Forgotten Realms stuff.  Eberron is OK, but no FR.  That means no Greenbond, Rashemi Elementals, or Initiate of Malar.  :/

Thanks for the ideas so far.

NiteCyper

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2010, 03:25:10 AM »
Summon Elemental [Reserve] feat from Complete Mage. Scouting purposes.
Caveat: I edit my posts, ever and anon after.

Surreal

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2010, 07:05:24 AM »
Summon Elemental [Reserve] feat from Complete Mage. Scouting purposes.
And meatshield, trap sniffer, occasional transport, phallus, battering ram, pack mule, babysitter...
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Havok4

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2010, 12:36:46 PM »
Summon Elemental [Reserve] feat from Complete Mage. Scouting purposes.
And meatshield, trap sniffer, occasional transport, phallus, battering ram, pack mule, babysitter...
In other words rather useless for combat but wonderful for utility.

snakeman830

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2010, 01:42:30 PM »
Summon Elemental [Reserve] feat from Complete Mage. Scouting purposes.
And meatshield, trap sniffer, occasional transport, phallus, battering ram, pack mule, babysitter...
In other words rather useless for combat but wonderful for utility.
Even in combat, the Air and Earth elementals can be extremely handy.  Earth Elementals make excellent meatshields (they're tough for their CR) and if you can't guess the power of an air elemental's vortex, I don't know if you're trying.  However, it is a better idea to use your in-combat actions for other things.
I am constantly amazed by how many DM's ban Tomb of Battle.  The book doesn't even exist!

Quotes:[spoiler]
By yes, she means no.
That explains so much about my life.
hiicantcomeupwithacharacterthatisntaghostwhyisthatamijustretardedorsomething
Why would you even do this? It hurts my eyes and looks like you ate your keyboard before suffering an attack of explosive diarrhea.
[/spoiler]

If using Genesis to hide your phylactry, set it at -300 degrees farenheit.  See how do-gooders fare with a liquid atmosphere.

NiteCyper

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #11 on: January 21, 2010, 02:17:47 PM »
phallus
I only know that word in one sense, and I'm gonna let you explain to me what you meant by it here.
Caveat: I edit my posts, ever and anon after.

PhaedrusXY

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #12 on: January 21, 2010, 02:21:59 PM »
phallus
I only know that word in one sense, and I'm gonna let you explain to me what you meant by it here.
Just use your imagination.
[spoiler]
A couple of water benders, a dike, a flaming arrow, and a few barrels of blasting jelly?

Sounds like the makings of a gay porn film.
...thanks
[/spoiler]

NiteCyper

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #13 on: January 21, 2010, 02:34:30 PM »
phallus
I only know that word in one sense, and I'm gonna let you explain to me what you meant by it here.
Just use your imagination.
Fuck.
Caveat: I edit my posts, ever and anon after.

Akkristor

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #14 on: January 21, 2010, 04:13:55 PM »
Hmm..

Interesting.

I was thinking about taking Augment Elemental at 9th level, but now I don't know if I should take that, or the Summon Elemental reserve feat.

I think at 12th i'm taking Dragon Wild Shape, but It might be a bit redundant as i'm going Planar Shepard, giving me the ability to shape into Good outsiders (Yeah, it's odd, an Eberron game with Greyhawk cosmology, but i'm not complaining).

snakeman830

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #15 on: January 21, 2010, 05:10:17 PM »
Summon Elemental also gives a +1 competence bonus to caster level with summoning spells.  Really, it's pretty close to a must-have feat for a summoner.
I am constantly amazed by how many DM's ban Tomb of Battle.  The book doesn't even exist!

Quotes:[spoiler]
By yes, she means no.
That explains so much about my life.
hiicantcomeupwithacharacterthatisntaghostwhyisthatamijustretardedorsomething
Why would you even do this? It hurts my eyes and looks like you ate your keyboard before suffering an attack of explosive diarrhea.
[/spoiler]

If using Genesis to hide your phylactry, set it at -300 degrees farenheit.  See how do-gooders fare with a liquid atmosphere.

veekie

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #16 on: January 21, 2010, 08:59:35 PM »
The mind transcends the body.
It's also a little cold because of that.
Please get it a blanket.

I wish I could read your mind,
I can barely read mine.

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sonofzeal

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Re: Summon Nature's Ally
« Reply #17 on: January 21, 2010, 10:28:18 PM »
The Child of Winter feat (ECS) deserves mention, as it adds a whole bunch of SNA options.  Mostly Vermine, but it's still decent.