Battlefield Control Mage Help .. how do you REALLY do it?

[sir_argenon]

im looking for help in doing some of those BFC spell tricks that you guys frequently talk about..  for instance.. fog cloud. everyone talks about how helpful this spell is.. but i just dont get it. its basically only concealment.. and your opponent can just walk right on through. useful vs archers though.. but in close combat, its just as much of a hindrance to you, as it is the enemy. glitterdust and grease though, i totally get.. but the others im lost.

if possible, can you guys compile a list of your favorite, most powerful/useful BFC spells, now this is the important part: with examples of how you use them in-game.  thanks.. 

[Treantmonklvl20]

Yes it just grants concealment.

You are right, against archers is where it works best.  However, there are other uses as well.

I play a summoner - I enjoy using the fog cloud for concealment while popping out summoned creatures.  If Dire Bats (SM III) or any of the spiders are an option for your level - you can use blindsense and tremorsense to your advantage.  Either way - you are basically invisible - except see invisibility won't work.

Also a good way to keep the enemies that like to rush past the party fighter at the handsome and brilliant wizard from doing so.  If they don't know where you are, they are basically running blind.

It also works well against spring attackers, or flyby attackers - if they leave melee - they are basically wandering blind.

Also good against enemy casters that are relying on targeted spells, or spells that require any kind of aim.

[Bozwevial]

handsome and brilliant wizard with a Charisma of 8 to 10

Fixed that for you. 

I'm personally fond of Web. Even if you don't fail the save, you're still entangled--except better!

[sir_argenon]

Yes it just grants concealment.

You are right, against archers is where it works best.  However, there are other uses as well.

I play a summoner - I enjoy using the fog cloud for concealment while popping out summoned creatures.  If Dire Bats (SM III) or any of the spiders are an option for your level - you can use blindsense and tremorsense to your advantage.  Either way - you are basically invisible - except see invisibility won't work.

Also a good way to keep the enemies that like to rush past the party fighter at the handsome and brilliant wizard from doing so.  If they don't know where you are, they are basically running blind.

It also works well against spring attackers, or flyby attackers - if they leave melee - they are basically wandering blind.

Also good against enemy casters that are relying on targeted spells, or spells that require any kind of aim.

im seeing where defensively that helps, but in all of those examples.. YOU are still virtually blind too.  they cant see me.. but i cant see them either. how do you overcome that to make any type of offensive actions?

[bearsarebrown]

summon or have a way to beat your own concealment

[Bozwevial]

summon or have a way to beat your own concealment

A really fun trick to play on creatures that have True Seeing is to cast Fog Cloud modified by the Invisible Spell metamagic feat. No slot adjustment, either.

[PhaedrusXY]

He already told you.

Yes it just grants concealment.

You are right, against archers is where it works best.  However, there are other uses as well.

I play a summoner - I enjoy using the fog cloud for concealment while popping out summoned creatures.  If Dire Bats (SM III) or any of the spiders are an option for your level - you can use blindsense and tremorsense to your advantage.  Either way - you are basically invisible - except see invisibility won't work.

Also a good way to keep the enemies that like to rush past the party fighter at the handsome and brilliant wizard from doing so.  If they don't know where you are, they are basically running blind.

It also works well against spring attackers, or flyby attackers - if they leave melee - they are basically wandering blind.

Also good against enemy casters that are relying on targeted spells, or spells that require any kind of aim.

im seeing where defensively that helps, but in all of those examples.. YOU are still virtually blind too.  they cant see me.. but i cant see them either. how do you overcome that to make any type of offensive actions?

[DerWille]

Favorite BC Spell: GLITTERDUST

That is all.

[altpersona]

im old school, gimme sleep.

[bearsarebrown]

im old school, gimme sleep.

yukk @ HD limit

[Bozwevial]

im old school, gimme sleep.

yukk @ HD limit

It's good at lower levels, though. Actually, scratch that: It's phenomenal at early levels.

[altpersona]

its far from perfect.

but, you dont turn a screw w/ a hammer. its a tool w/ a proper use

[sir_argenon]

thaks guys.. so far we have:

• fog cloud:useful vs archers, and as concealment
• web: entagling even on a failed save
• glitterdust = WIN
• sleep: vs low hd

cool... keep em coming.. those are all common PHB spells, are there any from other sources? SPc? eberron? fr?

[altpersona]

silent image?

[sir_argenon]

silent image?

thats another spell i have trouble with. being that its duration is only concentration, it basically takes you out of the fight as long as it's up.  defensively yes, if i were trying to hide from someone.. but as a BFC ... i dont get it..  can you tell me how that could work, say vs a party of orcs, in a dungeon? 

[altpersona]

it can be a career long spell, if your a shadow crafter...

it can alter the landscape/layout of a dungeon, new walls, cover pits

your familiar can maintain the concentration for you, freeing you up for other stuff

i have always seen it as least wish, where prestidigitation is lesser wish, behind limited wish, wish and miracle.

[sir_argenon]

cool.. good ideas.. im not that imaginative so this is helping a TON, really..

[PhaedrusXY]

Ghost Sound + Silent Image = Minor Image. You can do a lot with that. Fake Walls of Fire, rivers of lava, etc. Even Silent Image can make something like a fake Prismatic Sphere/Wall. Anyone who knows what those are will think twice about trying to pass through it, especially if you have some way to fool spellcraft checks (like False Theurgy).

[JaronK]

Glitterdust is definitely awesome, especially with a tank that can have it dropped on them (for example, one with a Blindfold of True Darkness, or a Paladin of Tyranny/Hexblade with high saves).  Get the enemies to swarm one guy, then blind them all.  Black Sand is handy in a similar way... drop it on a Tomb Tainted or Undead tank so he's healing 1d6/round while enemies take the same in damage, plus dead enemies become permanent sand for later use.  Solid Fog nuetralizes enemies quite nicely, especially when paired with a Cloudkill.  And don't forget the humble Grease spell... enemies are on the ground and virtually all enemies are flat footed with no save.  Again, it's easy to make your people immune... just give them 5 ranks in balance to avoid the flat footed effect.

JaronK

[sir_argenon]

where do i find false theurgy?