Things that make you go "Wuh?"

[Endarire]

1:  If simple weapons are so simple, why aren't all classes proficient with all of them?  (See Commoner, Wizard, and Druid.)

[SKRP]

1:  If simple weapons are so simple, why aren't all classes proficient with all of them?  (See Commoner, Wizard, and Druid.)

Because simple weapons are simple to produce, but not that simple to use.

[Midnight_v]

Why is it that almost every class meant for wizard says: "+1 existing spellcasting level"
and yet there is no prc that says something like "+1 fighter level for the purpost of gainig feats?"

"Wuh"  

[Midnight_v]

1:  If simple weapons are so simple, why aren't all classes proficient with all of them?  (See Commoner, Wizard, and Druid.)

Because simple weapons are simple to produce, but not that simple to use.

   

[bearsarebrown]

1:  If simple weapons are so simple, why aren't all classes proficient with all of them?  (See Commoner, Wizard, and Druid.)

Because simple weapons are simple to produce, but not that simple to use.

Ah yes, and Martial weapons are martial to produce... good point.

[PhaedrusXY]

"What if C A T really spelled dog?"

[SKRP]

1:  If simple weapons are so simple, why aren't all classes proficient with all of them?  (See Commoner, Wizard, and Druid.)

Because simple weapons are simple to produce, but not that simple to use.

Ah yes, and Martial weapons are martial to produce... good point.

It also applies to exotic ones, I suppose.

[Agita]

My guess would be that even the simplest of weapons require at least a little training in order to avoid hurting yourself.
For example, the sling is a simple weapon. Have you ever tried to fling a stone with one? If you don't know what you're doing, you're about as likely to whack yourself in the head as the other guy.

[Anklebite]

IMO,  weapon groups from UA make a bit more "sense".




also, why are intelligent undead immune to mind affecting?

[PhaedrusXY]

also, why are intelligent undead immune to mind affecting?

Yeah, that one bugs me, too. I like the House Rules from Dicefreaks that modify this. They have [Mindless] as a subtype there. Intelligent undead by definition don't have it (it gives you Int - ).

[snakeman830]

Plus, there is always the point of Crossbows being simple weapons.  Are you really going to tell me those are easier to make than a longbow?  Simple, Martial, and Exotic are categories of how much training you need to be good with the weapon.

Intelligent Undead I assume are because their mind has been "locked" into it's present state by undeath. Living brians continually adapt and change, evolving in a sense.  Undead...don't.

[PhaedrusXY]

Living brians continually adapt and change, evolving in a sense.

What about living creatures that aren't named Brian?

Also, the Evolved Undead template disagrees with your rationalization.

[Agita]

Intelligent Undead I assume are because their mind has been "locked" into it's present state by undeath. Living brians continually adapt and change, evolving in a sense.  Undead...don't.

Something along these lines was brought up in Libris Mortis, I think, though it wasn't used as a direct justification for being immune to [mind-affecting].

[InnaBinder]

also, why are intelligent undead immune to mind affecting?

Without it you get weirdness like undead falling for the seduction aspect of a bluff check from (IIRC) the Epic rules.

[Surreal]

The price of two poles vs the price of a ladder...

[Midnight_v]

IMO,  weapon groups from UA make a bit more "sense".




also, why are intelligent undead immune to mind affecting?

Frank and K really did the best job of fixing the undead thing but....
I like that, rule actually.

Here's my explanation for this phenomenon.
  The Mind & Soul are gone from that body. What your basically looking at is a negative energy based copy of that system (mind and soul). Which is why traditional mind and sould tricks don't really work on them.
Further this is why they are then able to be rebuked and turned. Thus doing things like "cowering" and being dominated. Its basically an interface problem at that point.
Example:
I have an X-box360 (Cleric with a high rebuke)
You have a Ps3 (Beguiler with dominate monster)
We both purchase a new game "Left 4 dead2"(the undead in question) lets say? If you mistakenly get a 360 version of that game you will never be able to play it on your system ... ever.
Why? It isn't that there's zero information on that disk. Its that your operating system is COMPLETELY DIFFERENT from the needed technology.

Which is why undead even intelligent ones are immune to mind-affecting effects.
They don't have brain patterns they don't have the same inputs, the have the same information sometimes (memories from life etc) but its running on a diffrent format. . . The negative energy standard, format.

 See? Now you can play in good conscience. CO makes everything better.
(just don't ask me where slaymates come from)  

edit: 5 posts were put up as I wrote that explanation out. God I love this stuff. M_V

[Desca]

Example:
I have an X-box360 (Cleric with a high rebuke)
You have a Ps3 (Beguiler with dominate monster)
We both purchase a new game "Left 4 dead2"(the undead in question) lets say? If you mistakenly get a 360 version of that game you will never be able to play it on your system ... ever.
Why? It isn't that there's zero information on that disk. Its that your operating system is COMPLETELY DIFFERENT from the needed technology.

Which is why undead even intelligent ones are immune to mind-affecting effects.
They don't have brain patterns they don't have the same inputs, the have the same information sometimes (memories from life etc) but its running on a diffrent format. . . The negative energy standard, format.

Standing ovation 

[bearsarebrown]

then why can't intelligent undead use mind affecting spells on each other?

[Midnight_v]

*sigh*
Because, them using mind altering effects on each other is still using the format designed to affect "Living things".
This actually behooves them as typically they feed on the living.

  Still the ONLY format that allows you to effect undead is negative and positive energy. It runs off the correct script and if your running the correct script then you can effect whoever.
  Things that eat undead would know the correct script to do so... ala turn undead or command undead on the Necrothanes.

Its about what language you're using
Example:
Say I've recently lost my hearing. (being undead for this example)
I can still speak to you if I need too. (can affect you with mind altering effects)
I wouldn't however understand anything you said unless you wrote it down. (chanelled positive and negative energy) but you would totally understand me saying "dude I'm deaf you need to write it down"

Now if I came across ANYONE else who was *deaf (again the living impaired as mentioned above)
the ONLY way we're going to be able to communicate with each other will be... what?
For one of us to write it down (turning/rebuking) aka negative energy standard.


*(assume no lip reading is going on)

[PhaedrusXY]

*(assume no lip reading is going on)

Or sign language.