Author Topic: A Tank that Gishes.  (Read 6705 times)

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Amaranth

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #20 on: July 31, 2009, 03:39:27 AM »
An Elan Swordsage 2/Wilder 4/Warmind 10/XXXX 4 could go a long way.  This would be good at both evade-tanking and soak-tanking.

Ability priorities: Wisdom, Dexterity, Constitution, Charisma, Strength, Intelligence

Suggested Wilder powers:
1st: Force Screen, Synchronicity
2nd: Damp power
*** Vigor should be your first Warmind power

Early feats:
1st: Enhanced Elan Resilience
B-1: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain)
F-1: Shadow Blade
F-2: Weapon Finesse
3rd: Psionic Meditation
6th: Psicrystal Affinity
9th: Expanded Knowledge (Share Pain)-- To be used with the Vigor/Psicrystal combo

This should give you what you need.  This character can soak an absurd amount of damage, and you can deal quite a hit with a spiked chain (I recommend Island of Blades as you list another melee character in your party-- the swashbuckler).

--Amaranth

Samb

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #21 on: July 31, 2009, 03:50:01 AM »
An Elan Swordsage 2/Wilder 4/Warmind 10/XXXX 4 could go a long way.  This would be good at both evade-tanking and soak-tanking.

Ability priorities: Wisdom, Dexterity, Constitution, Charisma, Strength, Intelligence

Suggested Wilder powers:
1st: Force Screen, Synchronicity
2nd: Damp power
*** Vigor should be your first Warmind power

Early feats:
1st: Enhanced Elan Resilience
B-1: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain)
F-1: Shadow Blade
F-2: Weapon Finesse
3rd: Psionic Meditation
6th: Psicrystal Affinity
9th: Expanded Knowledge (Share Pain)-- To be used with the Vigor/Psicrystal combo

This should give you what you need.  This character can soak an absurd amount of damage, and you can deal quite a hit with a spiked chain (I recommend Island of Blades as you list another melee character in your party-- the swashbuckler).

--Amaranth
Just some suggestions:
1) You need link power in there
2) Change psi meditation for instant clarity since you have ToB.  Instant clarity with psychic renewal is pretty kick ass as well.
3) Wilder to 3 will give you wild surge+2 which should be enough.
4) Consider stand still over EWP (going tripping for control?)

Gods_Trick

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #22 on: July 31, 2009, 07:42:37 AM »

  Thank you all, there's been some amazing suggestions. Some I can't take because of a gentleman's agreement, and some I'm seriously considering.  To get some clarity, I'm looking to draw attacks and survive, with a painful retaliation for the early game (pre 3rd lvl spells). After that I can assume the others wont need the same amount of shepherding, or at least I'm not willing to give it  :P

  After that I want to be able to deal with the Rainbow mage that will be coming for me after 10 levels, which I assume can only be done with another caster. I chacked with my DM and no-go for the Arcane var. Swordsage and Ur-Knight build  :(.

  If a Wilder with Vigor can soak the hits  :thumb how can I retaliate? I was thinking Power Attack since I was going full BAB meleers previously, but I'm a newb at psionics.

  Everyone who's taken the time to post, thanks guys  :). I've seen it done for others, but its a nice feeling to see a community in action.

juton

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #23 on: July 31, 2009, 04:08:00 PM »
Those Cleric nerfs are mean :mad. Someone mentioned Archivist/Crusader/RKV earlier. Listen to that person.

Off the top of my head you'll want to get Anticipate Teleport so that you'll have some time to get your act together if the Warmage decides to teleport in to say hi. If you have LA buy back really consider Vecna Blooded

Samb

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #24 on: July 31, 2009, 04:23:40 PM »

  If a Wilder with Vigor can soak the hits  :thumb how can I retaliate? I was thinking Power Attack since I was going full BAB meleers previously, but I'm a newb at psionics.

  Everyone who's taken the time to post, thanks guys  :). I've seen it done for others, but its a nice feeling to see a community in action.
How to deal with the PSV combo?  It's not that hard to deal lots of damage in one round (ubercharge with deep impact is all kinds of messed up) but the problem is with schism a wilder can get all of it back next round and still blast/hit you.  There is the usual antipsionic methods as well.

It is nice to see the community come together instead of feeding on the trolls we have nowadays.

PhaedrusXY

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #25 on: July 31, 2009, 04:38:52 PM »
I don't have a lot of time to go into details, but an Ardent can do what you want very well, from level 1 onward, and still get 9th level powers. If you can nab any kind of full manifesting psionic cohort at all, you can also increase the available powers known to just about anything in the game.

Check here for Ardent "tank" build ideas: http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=346.msg130786#msg130786

and here for "tricks" on how to gain temporary access to just about any psionic power as a "known" power: http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=642.msg173967#msg173967
« Last Edit: July 31, 2009, 04:40:31 PM by PhaedrusXY »
[spoiler]
A couple of water benders, a dike, a flaming arrow, and a few barrels of blasting jelly?

Sounds like the makings of a gay porn film.
...thanks
[/spoiler]

Corania

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #26 on: July 31, 2009, 05:39:42 PM »
So, to answer your original question, I think I agree with the suggestions to do a crusader/cloistered cleric entry into RKV. Very solid tank there.

However, upon thinking about it more, I think I would focus just on making a good tank and recommend that you ignore (or even make yourself susceptible to) the predations of the Rainbow fellow. The reason being that you are in this situation because you made some solid choices with your previous character and screwed up Baron VonBadass's plans for you. The DM obviously can't handle you beating his DMPC so I would suggest letting him win. Make a solid character that you find fun to play and does his job as a tank well, but lets the other players shine at their own roles (like maybe be a good tank, but not a great damage dealer). This way your character will end his days at the hands of the DMPC and you can go back to a more normal game after this one without the DM gunning for you. (This guy said he would go by the rules, but has already thrown consistently too high of ELs at you in the previous game trying to kill you guys... there are no rules that are fair for him to play by so when he wipes the floor with you, expect it and try to have your character go out in a heroic sacrifice or something).

Sean Mahoney

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #27 on: July 31, 2009, 07:29:02 PM »
Also, if you give your character some huge weakness (such as a terrible terrible fort save), it'll make him easier to deal with if he ends up appearing as an undead villain in the future.

dark_samuari

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #28 on: July 31, 2009, 07:47:35 PM »
XX 2 (Paladin of Tyranny or Barbarian or Dungeon Crasher Fighter, anything with good Fort) /Crusader 3/Ur Priest 2/XX

I've always been partial to Human Paragon 1/Paladin of Tyranny 2/Hexblade 3/Ur-Priest 2/Bone Knight 10/Human Paragon 2 if you're looking to go down that route (which I would advice against as it might be seen as stepping on the toes of your Dread Necromancer companion).

The_Mad_Linguist

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #29 on: July 31, 2009, 08:00:30 PM »
Also, if you give your character some huge weakness (such as a terrible terrible fort save), it'll make him easier to deal with if he ends up appearing as an undead villain in the future.

Fort save might not be the best choice, given how much stuff undead are immune to.
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Anklebite

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #30 on: July 31, 2009, 09:35:28 PM »
just make it a terrible reflex save, and hit him with bands of steel. problem solved.
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Gods_Trick

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #31 on: July 31, 2009, 11:40:10 PM »

  Uggh, building a pure meleer in a game thats going to go high level ....  :plotting I suppose I can try to be the bigger man. No one wins a pissing contest with a GM in game. The more I think on it the more I like it, give him an Achilles heel, hamartia. That godawful flaw that penalises your Ref save and a low Dex. Don't take Vecna-Blooded and I will a sitting duck but maybe it'll make some good fluff. A warrior haunted by an inescapable impending demise. Has promise.

  Since a well-built caster will clean my clock without mindblank of Vecna-blooded protecting me I may as well optimise for fun, the ideas you guys had are way to fun not to try  :D

  Something like a Primal Half-Giant Crusader 1/ Wilder 4/ Crusader 2/ Slayer 10/ Crusader 4 
  A ML of 13 (17 with Practised Manifester), 6th powers known, IL of 12 which gives me a 5 lvl manuevers. Decently good early on, and starts petering out fast past 7th level - but sets up for the impending doom. Lots of options which I like a lot.

  Obviously this can be improved on, maybe Ardent and Anarchic Initiate as Phaedrus suggested.

Gods_Trick

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #32 on: August 01, 2009, 06:36:31 AM »

  The original ideas been so changed that I'm going to get a new topic for this character. It's due to RP reasons and not screwing the opti-pooch as someone put it  :D. Thanks to everyone who helped on this one.

SorO_Lost

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #33 on: August 01, 2009, 11:13:24 AM »
Fun? Play another Bard, this time without Sublime Chord.
Human Bard 5 / Master of Masks 1 / Chameleon 10 / Mindbender 1 / Anything 3
MoM's Gladiator mask grants proficiency with all exotic weapons, just pick up some odd weapons you know are useful but never really use often. Like Bolas, Harpoons, Glots, Quickrazors, Sharktooth Staffs, Nets, etc.



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4: Partial casters. Adapt, Hexblade, Paladin, Ranger, Spelltheif.
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Bastian

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #34 on: August 01, 2009, 11:15:16 PM »
To fill the tank role you could do something similar to what I am doing in my game. I am playing a psion/constructor which makes for a very good summoning focused character. You end up having a large army of constructs to take and deal damage for the party. Also you can tank yourself with the share pain power combined with a psicrystal and vigor. Allowing you to get effectively 10 bonus hp for each pp expended. The required powers also work well with a warforged as you can heal yourself much more efficiently then the cleric could.
Didn't Complete Psionics make so you can only have one Astral Construct at a time?

InnaBinder

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #35 on: August 01, 2009, 11:44:03 PM »
To fill the tank role you could do something similar to what I am doing in my game. I am playing a psion/constructor which makes for a very good summoning focused character. You end up having a large army of constructs to take and deal damage for the party. Also you can tank yourself with the share pain power combined with a psicrystal and vigor. Allowing you to get effectively 10 bonus hp for each pp expended. The required powers also work well with a warforged as you can heal yourself much more efficiently then the cleric could.
Didn't Complete Psionics make so you can only have one Astral Construct at a time?
[sarcasm]They published Complete Psionics?  :o[/sarcasm]
Yes, according to ComPsi, your manifester can only one Astral Construct at a time.  Apparently manifesters Can't Have Nice Things, either.   :p
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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #36 on: August 01, 2009, 11:50:13 PM »
To fill the tank role you could do something similar to what I am doing in my game. I am playing a psion/constructor which makes for a very good summoning focused character. You end up having a large army of constructs to take and deal damage for the party. Also you can tank yourself with the share pain power combined with a psicrystal and vigor. Allowing you to get effectively 10 bonus hp for each pp expended. The required powers also work well with a warforged as you can heal yourself much more efficiently then the cleric could.
Didn't Complete Psionics make so you can only have one Astral Construct at a time?

A large number of people simply ignore that prohibition, along with many other things from Complete Psionic.

Havok4

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #37 on: August 02, 2009, 01:24:59 AM »
To fill the tank role you could do something similar to what I am doing in my game. I am playing a psion/constructor which makes for a very good summoning focused character. You end up having a large army of constructs to take and deal damage for the party. Also you can tank yourself with the share pain power combined with a psicrystal and vigor. Allowing you to get effectively 10 bonus hp for each pp expended. The required powers also work well with a warforged as you can heal yourself much more efficiently then the cleric could.
Didn't Complete Psionics make so you can only have one Astral Construct at a time?

A large number of people simply ignore that prohibition, along with many other things from Complete Psionic.

And in the case I mentioned it is not a complete disaster as the multisummoning augment gained from constructor allows having multiple constructs anyway. It still would significantly limit the build if that incredibly stupid rule was implemented.

Samb

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #38 on: August 03, 2009, 05:37:56 PM »
Why all the CPsi hate?  I have found that it has more good stuff than bad.

Races:
synad is my favorite psi race thanks to a built in schism, +1 to all saves, and oracle has won me many a match in arena.

Classes:
ardent a very interesting psi cleric with a mechanism that favors multiclassing. Mantles make them very well suited to extensive customization.

Powers:
dimensional hop: teleporting as a swift action at level 1 is a lot better than you think. It almost makes dimensional door and slide obsolete.

Dimensional door: hey you can blind people as you go now, lower the cost to teleport a smaller distance.

Stygian powers: drain levels. Deal with undead that are immune to many mind affecting powers. Much needed area of improvement.

Cranial deluge: make someones head explode. Not that great but cool nonetheless.

Adrenaline boost: great power to link.

Syncronicity: you know you love it as much as me.   

Feats
linked power: enuff said
xeph celerity: gain extra attacks at full BAB. Only cost use of burst which can be boosted now.
Metapsionics: free extend power, play astral construct cheaper and better with linked power.


PrC
Anarchic initate: psywar and psion's can now gain wild surge without worrying about lose of ML or BAB. Could almost make wilder obsolete. 


Not too bad of a list considering that was all off the top of my head.   

Havok4

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Re: A Tank that Gishes.
« Reply #39 on: August 03, 2009, 06:25:23 PM »
I did not say that CPsi as a whole is entirely stupid, but it does contain some incredibly stupid rules that mess up psionics users for readily apparent reason. Also a great deal of its rule are mostly useless. It is like a cake made of good cake batter mixed with the contents of the septic system, it has some perfectly good cake in it but there is also a great deal of excrement, and people will remember the excrement.