Author Topic: 10th Level Homebrew Paladin, need advice on character and gear  (Read 1669 times)

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tallan

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I'm joining a new campaign in a few months. The hopeful initial setting is a sandbox, living world. PC action will have definite outcomes and can change the world for better or worse.  The setting at the start will be a fairly stable world where things are generally pleasant but the threat of evil and chaos lurks.  It's the player's job to change that.

Character:  I'm looking to play a Warforged paladin on this varianthttp://wiki.faxcelestis.net/index.php?title=Paladin. I'd like to keep that for 20 but am interested in other ideas.  He's the sort of guy who sees that the world around him is a mess and he needs to step in. Alignment is LN. Leadership is a focus but he needs to be able to thrive on the battlefield too. I like inherent features over depending on outside sources.  Stats are: 16 Str, 16, Con, 17 Dex, 18 Wis, 14 Int, 18 Cha before modifiers.

Equipment:  For gear we are allowed 49k and an heirloom, something with a good story that can be fairly overpowered.  I've asked about using my cohort as a artificer/crafter to help out, so there might be some leeway. 

All books are allowed at present. DM is lenient on many thing as long as it promotes fun and make sense for RP.

This is my first post on CO boards after a few months of checking here and learning what I can.  I'm not sure how well homebrew classes are recieved but I'm interested in seeing what comes of this.
Deep in the tomb of indelible gloom, an angel waits to die.
High on the peak, where only fools seek, a dragon tried to get high.
To which one we go, well f*ck if I know, the point is to question why.

tallan

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Re: 10th Level Homebrew Paladin, need advice on character and gear
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2009, 06:44:43 PM »
Here's some of what I've go so far:
Admiral's Bicorne, Cloak of Charisma +4, Ring of Protection +2, Gloves of Dexterity +2, Enveloping Pit, Amulet of natural armor (added to cloak), +2 Plating, +2 Buckler, Ring of Mind Shielding, Amulet of Health (added to Cloak). Heirloom item is going to be his weapon, a sentient bow based on the energy bow with some improvements. Some suggestions would be nice on what these should be.

Feats: Mithral Body, Landlord, Leadership, Ecclesiarch

He is building/taking over a city from the inside, letting his cohort and followers doing the work off screen.  His goal is to promote Warforged rights by gathering them under his protection and working them into positions in the city.

Right now I'm focusing on archery for combat purposes.
Deep in the tomb of indelible gloom, an angel waits to die.
High on the peak, where only fools seek, a dragon tried to get high.
To which one we go, well f*ck if I know, the point is to question why.

GawainBS

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Re: 10th Level Homebrew Paladin, need advice on character and gear
« Reply #2 on: July 20, 2009, 07:23:25 PM »
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The_Mad_Linguist

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Re: 10th Level Homebrew Paladin, need advice on character and gear
« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2009, 03:15:59 PM »
First: The DM will have someone assault your building.  It's too big and obvious for that not to happen.
To deal with that:
-Get a bard follower who can play a lyre of building.  30 minutes of complete invulnerability for your castle will help a lot
-Make your castle flying.  Because it's far more difficult to assault, and takes off 5% of the cost.  Add in teleportation 2/day, and never worry about ambushes again.
-Look in the DMG II for spell turrets.  Because they're pretty solid, even at high levels, and can easily be used for utility (buff 'n stuff)
-If possible, get an ice weird or snow weird or a similar creature to take up residence there.  Forewarned is forearmed, and unlimited scrying rocks.

Second: Those mantles as a whole don't look that useful, and you can get screwed over quite easily on the ones that are.   For example, you can pass a Paladin of Honesty a counterfeit bill made out of cardboard scribbled on by a crayon, and if he doesn't accept it immediately he'll lose his vow by making a forgery check.  And patience mantle is just lame.  Grey guard seems like an answer to the latter, though I'm not entirely sure how much of that flavor you want... and you're LN, which normally isn't allowed for the paladin variant.

Basically

Alliance: Just badly converted.  I don't see how the atonement fits with the ability. 
Conviction: Meh, there are better ways of overcoming DR.
Diligence: Subpar abilities.  Vague requirements.  Pass.  I mean, I guess detect evil is OK, but given how much alignment concealing magic is going around, and the fact that you're supposed to be serving law, not good, I'm not sure exactly how much mileage you'd be getting out of it.
Honesty: See previous statement regarding taking counterfeit bills.  Abilities aren't particularly useful.
Honor: Cha to attack rolls is nice, and there isn't anything about not being able to GIVE flanking, so this is actually great for fueling power attack.
Justice: Double smite damage.  But your DM can easily screw you over with dumb laws.  Depends on the DM.
Patience: Normally, mostly worthless.  For you, entirely worthless.
Perseverance: Decent.  Not spectacular, but decent.
Piety: Given that your party will be sleeping eight hours a day, the five hours of prayer isn't that much of a hindrance.  Since you're your own ally, getting either a quarter of your level or your cha mod to saves is excellent.  Oh, and you extend your save bonus to the party.  A++++, would take again.
Zeal: Combine with justice.  Duels can be to first blood, so atonement is easy peasy.

I doubt you'll find more than three or four mantles that you actually want, and there are other ways to get smiting progression, so a good breakpoint would be seventh or tenth level.  Divine Champion using the Transformation Domain would be an excellent choice if you break at tenth level - you get shapechange 1/day at level 19, which would let you keep up with krazy kasters.


Third: Heirloomwise, have you looked at founding a Weapon of Legacy?
« Last Edit: July 23, 2009, 03:38:50 PM by The_Mad_Linguist »
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tallan

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Re: 10th Level Homebrew Paladin, need advice on character and gear
« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2009, 04:02:58 PM »
First: I'm sure it will be assaulted and I'll have to look into those options. An idea I had, albeit a bit grandiose, was using the resources of Landlord along with the small army of untiring followers to bolster the local settlements defenses and essentially treat it as my stronghold. After all, a waforged needs no bed, not kitchen, no garderobe. In this way I receive free guards, builders, and stewards to see to my holdings while I adventure. My majordomo cohort acting as my proxy, of course.

Second: I guess I may simply be naive to the wonders that can be accomplished with proper optimization, but that is why I'm here.  My thought with the mantles was to focus on those that best made use of CHA. The four I was eyeing are Piety, Pride, Discretion, and Survival. These would give me my CHA bonus to AC, Saves, and Ranged Attacks as well as evasion. Those around me would likewise gain save bonuses, ranged bonuses, and evasion to a lesser extent.  It is true that I might be screwed out of some of these, but aren't the benefits worth it until then?

I am interested in better ideas though. I'm new to indepth optimization, and to be frank, rusty at 3.5.  I'll look at your suggestions here too, though where is Grey Guard? Haven't heard of it.

Third: I had considered exactly that, though I'm shaky on the specifics of how to do so. I've been considering a construct themed bow. The intelligent weapon tables look pretty interesting too, special purpose power Waves of Exhaustion sounds like the perfect thing to give the wielder and advantage over meddling meatbags...ahem, I mean foes.
Deep in the tomb of indelible gloom, an angel waits to die.
High on the peak, where only fools seek, a dragon tried to get high.
To which one we go, well f*ck if I know, the point is to question why.

The_Mad_Linguist

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Re: 10th Level Homebrew Paladin, need advice on character and gear
« Reply #5 on: July 23, 2009, 05:14:20 PM »
I was under the impression you could only take mantles that were in concordance with your alignment - is that not the case?

Greyguard is from complete scoundrel, and lowers the amount of your vows you actually have to keep.
Linguist, Mad, Unique, none of these things am I
My custom class: The Priest of the Unseen Host
Planetouched Handbook
Want to improve your character?  Then die.

Negative Zero

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Re: 10th Level Homebrew Paladin, need advice on character and gear
« Reply #6 on: July 23, 2009, 05:33:00 PM »
An Ardent can take any mantle. It even says that some Good Ardents take the Evil mantle so they can understand their foes better.

The_Mad_Linguist

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Re: 10th Level Homebrew Paladin, need advice on character and gear
« Reply #7 on: July 23, 2009, 05:36:55 PM »
An Ardent can take any mantle. It even says that some Good Ardents take the Evil mantle so they can understand their foes better.
This isn't an ardent, though, this is a variant paladin.
Linguist, Mad, Unique, none of these things am I
My custom class: The Priest of the Unseen Host
Planetouched Handbook
Want to improve your character?  Then die.

tallan

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Re: 10th Level Homebrew Paladin, need advice on character and gear
« Reply #8 on: July 23, 2009, 05:59:46 PM »
Ah, right. Pride and Survival are evil. Well, perhaps I should be LE... It would open up more options if nothing else. Or maybe another class would be better.

I agree that a lot of the mantles, evil ones especially are over the top. Good for BBEG, not so much for PCs. I've talked my DM into considering me my own ally for the mantles so that is very nice. 

Deep in the tomb of indelible gloom, an angel waits to die.
High on the peak, where only fools seek, a dragon tried to get high.
To which one we go, well f*ck if I know, the point is to question why.

Negative Zero

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Re: 10th Level Homebrew Paladin, need advice on character and gear
« Reply #9 on: July 23, 2009, 08:12:15 PM »
An Ardent can take any mantle. It even says that some Good Ardents take the Evil mantle so they can understand their foes better.
This isn't an ardent, though, this is a variant paladin.


Durr, I should read the topic I'm posting in. It's in the frigging title. Jeez. My bad, anyway.