Author Topic: Ways to increase spell DC  (Read 31839 times)

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Caelic

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Re: Ways to increase spell DC
« Reply #20 on: April 14, 2009, 10:06:45 PM »
One that people tend to really overlook is Owl's Insight.  It's an insight bonus to Wisdom (so it stacks with enhancement bonuses.)  It's equal to half your caster level (so things that boost CL can get it to a really impressive total.)  It lasts for an hour (plenty of time for the big fight, especially if extended.)

Even at the level where you get it, with no juicing of caster level, it amounts to a +4 to Wisdom, and thus a +2 to DC.  Not bad for a fifth-level spell, and that's the worst-case scenario.


sendmeanewid

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Re: Ways to increase spell DC
« Reply #21 on: April 14, 2009, 10:14:21 PM »
Illumians (Races of Destiny) with the Naenkrau power sigils can increase their spell DCs, and the feats Enhanced Power Sigils and Improved Sigil (Krau) also give a boost.  Some restrictions apply.

The_Mad_Linguist

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Re: Ways to increase spell DC
« Reply #22 on: April 14, 2009, 10:55:15 PM »
One that people tend to really overlook is Owl's Insight.  It's an insight bonus to Wisdom (so it stacks with enhancement bonuses.)  It's equal to half your caster level (so things that boost CL can get it to a really impressive total.)  It lasts for an hour (plenty of time for the big fight, especially if extended.)

Even at the level where you get it, with no juicing of caster level, it amounts to a +4 to Wisdom, and thus a +2 to DC.  Not bad for a fifth-level spell, and that's the worst-case scenario.

Also it doesn't have the caveat that you can't gain new bonus spell slots from it.  Fun!

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woodenbandman

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Re: Ways to increase spell DC
« Reply #23 on: April 14, 2009, 11:03:40 PM »
They're personal range, aren't they?

Akalsaris

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Re: Ways to increase spell DC
« Reply #24 on: April 15, 2009, 01:03:15 AM »
Tainted Scholar PrC from Heroes of Horror. Use 10 + spell level + 1/2 corruption for your spell DCs (amongst other things). And you get 1 point of free corruption point every time you cast an arcane spell (with Will saving throw that you'll want to fail voluntarily). So... say you can cast 20 spells per day, that's +10 permanent bonus to your Spell DC. More the merrier. The PrC even uses 10 + corruption score instead of normal casting ability (Wiz-Int, Sor-Cha etc) to determine extra spells per day.

Of course the character'll be a depraved freak of nature but that's the theme of the class. If you're an undead though (say, Necropolitan) you can ignore all the disadvantages of taints (corruption and depravity) and get all the goodies all you want.

This is why being evil's so much better than being good :)

I've wondered about that myself, as the section on undead in the taint rules is kind of vague.  Are they actually able to gain taint, or are they immune to its effects entirely, and have a nominal "taint" score based solely on their charisma? 

Intuitively, it would seem to me that undead would have a huge taint score and that the charisma-based score is just their starting value, but since that leads itself to near-infinite spell DCs, for game balance and developer intent the second reading seems more likely.

Salt_Crow

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Re: Ways to increase spell DC
« Reply #25 on: April 15, 2009, 04:08:41 AM »
Tainted Scholar PrC from Heroes of Horror. Use 10 + spell level + 1/2 corruption for your spell DCs (amongst other things). And you get 1 point of free corruption point every time you cast an arcane spell (with Will saving throw that you'll want to fail voluntarily). So... say you can cast 20 spells per day, that's +10 permanent bonus to your Spell DC. More the merrier. The PrC even uses 10 + corruption score instead of normal casting ability (Wiz-Int, Sor-Cha etc) to determine extra spells per day.

Of course the character'll be a depraved freak of nature but that's the theme of the class. If you're an undead though (say, Necropolitan) you can ignore all the disadvantages of taints (corruption and depravity) and get all the goodies all you want.

This is why being evil's so much better than being good :)

I've wondered about that myself, as the section on undead in the taint rules is kind of vague.  Are they actually able to gain taint, or are they immune to its effects entirely, and have a nominal "taint" score based solely on their charisma? 

Intuitively, it would seem to me that undead would have a huge taint score and that the charisma-based score is just their starting value, but since that leads itself to near-infinite spell DCs, for game balance and developer intent the second reading seems more likely.


Heroes of Horror page 62, last paragraph reads: "Creatures with the evil subtype and undead creatures are immune to any negative effects from taint. They automatically have effective corruption and depravity scores equal to one-half their Charisma score, +1 for undead or +2 for outsider". Not too shabby, eh?

LimaBeanMage

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Re: Ways to increase spell DC
« Reply #26 on: April 16, 2009, 04:57:49 PM »
Tainted Scholar PrC from Heroes of Horror. Use 10 + spell level + 1/2 corruption for your spell DCs (amongst other things). And you get 1 point of free corruption point every time you cast an arcane spell (with Will saving throw that you'll want to fail voluntarily). So... say you can cast 20 spells per day, that's +10 permanent bonus to your Spell DC. More the merrier. The PrC even uses 10 + corruption score instead of normal casting ability (Wiz-Int, Sor-Cha etc) to determine extra spells per day.

Of course the character'll be a depraved freak of nature but that's the theme of the class. If you're an undead though (say, Necropolitan) you can ignore all the disadvantages of taints (corruption and depravity) and get all the goodies all you want.

This is why being evil's so much better than being good :)

I've wondered about that myself, as the section on undead in the taint rules is kind of vague.  Are they actually able to gain taint, or are they immune to its effects entirely, and have a nominal "taint" score based solely on their charisma? 

Intuitively, it would seem to me that undead would have a huge taint score and that the charisma-based score is just their starting value, but since that leads itself to near-infinite spell DCs, for game balance and developer intent the second reading seems more likely.

I agree with you there. While this might be an awesome way to increase spell DC's at first, it makes more sense that undead and evil subtyped creatures cannot benefit from this method.

Both from a roleplaying and balance stand point. Taint increased power is done gained by a potentially reasonable character sinking into depravity, and gaining the penalties attached with it. The power here is born out of conflict and turmoil. No such turmoil exists for either undead or evil typed creatures that can be harnessed. Heck, pouring a bowl of cereal in the morning is considered an evil act for those guys.

Balance wise, based on the evil cereal method, they get far too much taint by just being evil and thus around evil stuff. It is unbalanced when a character can obtain phenomenal cosmic power by eating corn flakes!

The_Mad_Linguist

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Re: Ways to increase spell DC
« Reply #27 on: April 16, 2009, 05:23:57 PM »
Tainted Scholar PrC from Heroes of Horror. Use 10 + spell level + 1/2 corruption for your spell DCs (amongst other things). And you get 1 point of free corruption point every time you cast an arcane spell (with Will saving throw that you'll want to fail voluntarily). So... say you can cast 20 spells per day, that's +10 permanent bonus to your Spell DC. More the merrier. The PrC even uses 10 + corruption score instead of normal casting ability (Wiz-Int, Sor-Cha etc) to determine extra spells per day.

Of course the character'll be a depraved freak of nature but that's the theme of the class. If you're an undead though (say, Necropolitan) you can ignore all the disadvantages of taints (corruption and depravity) and get all the goodies all you want.

This is why being evil's so much better than being good :)

I've wondered about that myself, as the section on undead in the taint rules is kind of vague.  Are they actually able to gain taint, or are they immune to its effects entirely, and have a nominal "taint" score based solely on their charisma? 

Intuitively, it would seem to me that undead would have a huge taint score and that the charisma-based score is just their starting value, but since that leads itself to near-infinite spell DCs, for game balance and developer intent the second reading seems more likely.

I agree with you there. While this might be an awesome way to increase spell DC's at first, it makes more sense that undead and evil subtyped creatures cannot benefit from this method.

Both from a roleplaying and balance stand point. Taint increased power is done gained by a potentially reasonable character sinking into depravity, and gaining the penalties attached with it. The power here is born out of conflict and turmoil. No such turmoil exists for either undead or evil typed creatures that can be harnessed. Heck, pouring a bowl of cereal in the morning is considered an evil act for those guys.

Balance wise, based on the evil cereal method, they get far too much taint by just being evil and thus around evil stuff. It is unbalanced when a character can obtain phenomenal cosmic power by eating corn flakes!

Undead aren't automatically evil.  For example, ghosts.
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Tohron

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Re: Ways to increase spell DC
« Reply #28 on: April 16, 2009, 05:35:11 PM »


2. Energy Substitution [Cold] + Snowcasting: +1 effective spell level


I know this is rather off-topic, but could a Shadowcraft Mage use that+Earth Spell to imitate spells 2 levels early?