Author Topic: Retraining the Ultimate Magus  (Read 2632 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

pfooti

  • Bi-Curious George
  • ****
  • Posts: 531
  • Pants are for Suckers
    • /castrandom - even we don't know what it's about
    • Email
Retraining the Ultimate Magus
« on: May 27, 2008, 04:21:24 PM »
I asked this question in the "simple question" thread, although it's not really a simple question.

Here's the situation:
Beguiler 2 / Wizard 4 / Ultimate Magus 10, with Practiced Spellcaster (Beguiler). This causes the 3 single-progression UM levels to push the wizard side each time. (as an aside, it's best to delay beguiler-2 until right before UM-7).

Anyway, at some point after UM-7, this character retrains away Practiced Spellcaster (Beguiler), changing his caster level on the beguiler side.

Under normal conditions, if you retrain a feat that provides a prereq to another feat, the second feat is just disabled, dead weight. If you retrain weapon focus, it means you don't get to use weapon specialization. But this is different, retraining a feat that affected decisions you made while gaining other levels.

According to all the RAW I can find, it seems like a valid (ab)use of the retraining rules. It's definitely an AYDM situation, and I'm quite frankly afraid to even ask (I've already got a rep at my table as an optimizer). Still and all, it seems to work.

Dan2

  • Honorary Moderator
  • Hong Kong
  • *
  • Posts: 1024
  • Wizicist
Re: Retraining the Ultimate Magus
« Reply #1 on: May 27, 2008, 04:44:56 PM »
Well, the retraining class features rules say that after retraining, the choices change retroactively, but there is no such clause for the retraining feats rules.

RAW, I'm pretty sure it works!  (RAI, no way though)

Sinfire Titan

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 5697
  • You've got one round to give a rat's ass.
    • Email
Re: Retraining the Ultimate Magus
« Reply #2 on: May 27, 2008, 06:05:48 PM »
I don't see that going past many DMs, but at the same time it doesn't look like it is game-breaking to use that interpretation. It is a boost, but not one of considerable impact.


[spoiler][/spoiler]

DaveTheMagicWeasel

  • Barbary Macaque at the Rock of Gibraltar
  • ***
  • Posts: 188
  • If you optimize it, they will come
    • Email
Re: Retraining the Ultimate Magus
« Reply #3 on: May 27, 2008, 06:26:48 PM »
RAW it probably works (or rather, it's undefined).

RADBDM (Rules As Decided BY DM) I doubt it.

And personally I'd rather keep the +4 CL to the Beguiler - for durations, etc.