Author Topic: remember the iron siege?  (Read 33314 times)

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Anklebite

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remember the iron siege?
« on: February 27, 2009, 10:03:30 AM »
A while ago, someone was running a PbP where you had to try and kill dispater.... personally, after thinking about it for a bit, i have a rough sketch of a character that might manage it.  if anyone has any improvements or suggestions, or wants to post a dispater slayer idea of thier own, please do.  :D

personally, i would have gone with a DR 18 diety called "the liberator" or something freedom based.  goes swiftblade, takes argent savant, dips paladin of freedom, takes obtain familiar+wild cohort, and takes the "supermount" stacking feats.  as for the mount, since it should have almost as many HD as you, takes spell stowaway(time stop), knockback and dire charge, and is a light warhose.   a warblade dip for iron heart surge is required for this char to work.

in addition, the char grabs sun school, as does the mount, and does the following:

walk 5 feet into dis.

uses iron heart surge to shout a challenge to dispater.  iron heart surge breaks the "no-teleport" and all the other dispater disables.

the char then either:
A) greater teleports, along with his mount, into dispater's jail and frees everyone, especially the shadow sun ninjas. uses diplomacy, and leads the assault on dispater with an army.

B) quickened greater teleport into dispater's chamber, along with mount, and has mount charge.  at the end of the mounted charge, jumps off horse and casts a gate in mid-air, which leads to the chaotic good heaven, making the gate directly behind dispater.  the horse then full attack knockbacks(or bull rushes) dispater through the gate, and you activate innervated speed.  this is an (Ex) ability that functions akin to timestop, but dispater cannot use spell stowaway on it.  you move through gate, disable dispater's ability for extradimensional travel, and start beating him up with the help of the celestial hordes. now, dispater will respawn in dis in about 90 years or something. during this time, you completely dismantle(har!) dis, and prepare an ambush of epic(har again!) proportions.  hell (again, har!), you will probably at this point have the assistance of half the lower planes, who are trying to claim dis' domain(s)(heh, i did it again) for thier own.  this completes the requirements of the challenge, which are to kill dispater in dis.  nothing in the rules requires you to kill him is dis FIRST, so the twice-slaughter is quite a good workaround.  :D


i think that the best way to kill dis, is to simply use unique abilities granted by obscure sources to bypass dis defences.  swiftblade, i believe, is possibly the best ever made workaround for fighting dispater.  just persist a swift haste in the begining of the day, and you gain extra actions and an (Ex) freedom of movement. you can even run across molten iron and lava, and you have time stop as an (Ex) ability that cannot be stowawayed.


any thoughts? did i forget something important?

and please, I would really like to see what others have thought of to beat the crap out of the iron lord  :D

edit: keep in mind, kicking him into the heavens lowers his divine rating by two, and you can grant your familiar/mount/companion horse DR 0 to deal with most problems.
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skydragonknight

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2009, 02:04:08 PM »
Won't work. Simply because you lack the ability to actually locate Dispater.
It always seems like the barrels around here have something in them.


PhaedrusXY

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #3 on: February 27, 2009, 02:39:57 PM »
That's pretty funny. Tshern is still running it on 339, and he's waiting for a new contender. You should step up to the plate. :D
[spoiler]
A couple of water benders, a dike, a flaming arrow, and a few barrels of blasting jelly?

Sounds like the makings of a gay porn film.
...thanks
[/spoiler]

bogsnes

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #4 on: February 27, 2009, 03:01:52 PM »
Can you use IHS that way?

Operation Shoestring

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #5 on: February 27, 2009, 03:21:01 PM »
Can you use IHS that way?

No, but it's still funny.

IHS was intended to let you cure your own status effects.  Thanks to the loose wording, people try to use it for EVERYTHING.

BowenSilverclaw

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #6 on: February 27, 2009, 03:33:17 PM »
With a ROAR OF EFFORT! :P
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Anklebite

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #7 on: February 27, 2009, 03:44:59 PM »
locating him isn't a problem, just use innervated speed, and spend two minutes finding out where he is....

or, yanno, just greater teleport to him.  "teleport to infront of dispater".  or behind, if you want the double-hoofed knockback kick from the horse to be extra funny....
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Bozwevial

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #8 on: February 27, 2009, 06:39:34 PM »
Quote from: SRD
You must have some clear idea of the location and layout of the destination or a reliable description of the place to which you are teleporting. If you attempt to teleport with insufficient information (or with misleading information), you disappear and simply reappear in your original location.

So "in front of Dispater" wouldn't work. And as for scrying techniques, you don't think that Dispater won't have some sort of misdirection set up? Also, Anticipate Teleportation gives Dispater ample warning in any case.

Tshern is vastly more knowledgeable about this than I am, of course, but he's not giving anything away. ;)

Anklebite

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #9 on: February 27, 2009, 07:39:54 PM »
well, you could just teleport around everywhere til ya find him.... or, you could try and IHS the scrybreaker  :D

but mainly, i was assuming that the arrogant prick would be sitting on his toi- i mean throne, and you could just teleport to "dispater's throne room, in the iron tower".

and, if none of that works..... well, you could either make an epic scry spell, or go with option 1): (un)civil uprising. by RAW, dispater has alot of good aligned shadow sun ninjas that killed themselves with their capstone ability, and they probably hate dispater by now. if doing all that fails to reveal the guys location, then just scour the city top to bottom.  yes, i know it is infinite.... but so are the amount of your astral projections  :D
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PhaedrusXY

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #10 on: February 27, 2009, 08:50:18 PM »
Dispater is not known for his arrogance. Quite the opposite, he is known as the most paranoid being in the universe. And he's millions of years old, and has basically infinite wealth and servants that can travel through time...
[spoiler]
A couple of water benders, a dike, a flaming arrow, and a few barrels of blasting jelly?

Sounds like the makings of a gay porn film.
...thanks
[/spoiler]

Veneratorial

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #11 on: February 27, 2009, 10:03:43 PM »
As an alternative, you could spend all your levels on factotum, pump diplomacy as high as possible, then enter Dis, talk to Dispater and convince him to kill himself by adding your factotum level to your check.
Something along the lines of "Hey Dispater, remove your head and give it to me so I can use it as a football and play a game in your tower (without you interupting or trapping anyone/anything ever again, ever)" "Uh, ok".
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bogsnes

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #12 on: February 28, 2009, 07:20:09 AM »
As an alternative, you could spend all your levels on factotum, pump diplomacy as high as possible, then enter Dis, talk to Dispater and convince him to kill himself by adding your factotum level to your check.
Something along the lines of "Hey Dispater, remove your head and give it to me so I can use it as a football and play a game in your tower (without you interupting or trapping anyone/anything ever again, ever)" "Uh, ok".

You are aware of that noone has ever even gotten to dispater, right?

:Off topic: Why is it actually dispater you should kill, and not one of the others? /Off topic

Tshern

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2009, 07:46:06 AM »
I indeed still am the DM of the challenge. I'll analyze your stuff when in a bit.

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Tshern

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #14 on: February 28, 2009, 08:07:23 AM »
A while ago, someone was running a PbP where you had to try and kill dispater.... personally, after thinking about it for a bit, i have a rough sketch of a character that might manage it.  if anyone has any improvements or suggestions, or wants to post a dispater slayer idea of thier own, please do.  :D
Let's see how this one fares.

Quote
uses iron heart surge to shout a challenge to dispater.  iron heart surge breaks the "no-teleport" and all the other dispater disables.
Uses Iron Heart Surge to shout a challenge? I don't get your meaning. Also, the teleportortation problem: The most basic problem is the Dimensional anchor effect in the Tower itself. It doesn't effect you, hence it is not a valid target for your Iron Heart Surge. I would even go as far as claiming that other possible limitations like, say, planar conditions are not viable targets for Iron Heart Surge either. Not to mention that you can already teleport to the Tower with a Miracle or Wish.

Quote
the char then either:
A) greater teleports, along with his mount, into dispater's jail and frees everyone, especially the shadow sun ninjas. uses diplomacy, and leads the assault on dispater with an army.
There are absolutely no information regarding any prisoners of Dispater apart from the flavour part of Dispater's entry in the Gates of Hell and that single prisoner is turned into a lemure in the end.

Quote
B) quickened greater teleport into dispater's chamber, along with mount, and has mount charge.  at the end of the mounted charge, jumps off horse and casts a gate in mid-air, which leads to the chaotic good heaven, making the gate directly behind dispater.  the horse then full attack knockbacks(or bull rushes) dispater through the gate, and you activate innervated speed. 
Some small problems you might want to ponder here. You do not know where Dispater is, Dispater cannot be planeshifted (read Locked Within the Gates ability from page 6 of this document) and you might want to find a way to punch through all the excessive defenses of His Iron Grace.

Quote
edit: keep in mind, kicking him into the heavens lowers his divine rating by two, and you can grant your familiar/mount/companion horse DR 0 to deal with most problems.
By three actually. And it's cosmic rank, Dispater only has divine rank 0.

Quote
locating him isn't a problem, just use innervated speed, and spend two minutes finding out where he is....
The plane is of infinite size, you know. Good luck.

Also, keep in mind that you have no idea whatsoever where Dispater's throne room is. None.

Quote from: bogsnes
:Off topic: Why is it actually dispater you should kill, and not one of the others? /Off topic
Because he is easily the biggest challenge along with Asmodeus. The original idea came from a bunch of users who pondered whether or not Dispater could be killed at all. None of the Lords actually lives up to their CRs, but that's what makes the Iron Siege all the more interesting.

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Veneratorial

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2009, 08:15:37 AM »

You are aware of that noone has ever even gotten to dispater, right?


Well, you wouldn't really have to find the man (or whatever) himself, you could just find a way of communicating with him, and then you're all set for the diplomacy part.
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bogsnes

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #16 on: February 28, 2009, 08:30:17 AM »
They don't?

Is it because only Dispater is that paranoid?

Operation Shoestring

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #17 on: February 28, 2009, 08:34:47 AM »
the char then either:
A) greater teleports, along with his mount, into dispater's jail and frees everyone, especially the shadow sun ninjas. uses diplomacy, and leads the assault on dispater with an army.
There are absolutely no information regarding any prisoners of Dispater apart from the flavour part of Dispater's entry in the Gates of Hell and that single prisoner is turned into a lemure in the end.

Uhm, aren't there a bunch of high level Shadow-Sun Ninjas in there according to TOB?

bogsnes

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #18 on: February 28, 2009, 08:37:26 AM »
it is a legend, at least...

Tshern

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Re: remember the iron siege?
« Reply #19 on: February 28, 2009, 08:56:29 AM »

You are aware of that noone has ever even gotten to dispater, right?


Well, you wouldn't really have to find the man (or whatever) himself, you could just find a way of communicating with him, and then you're all set for the diplomacy part.
As mentioned in the thread several times, epic diplomacy doesn't work as written. Moreover, Dispater is immune to becoming a fanatic anyway and he has a decent +150 modifier for his diplomacy too.

Where is the Shadow Sun Ninja legend mentioned? Anyway, Dispater uses the fluff from the Gates of Hell and Fiendish Codex II with the former having precedence over the latter. Tome of Battle is not even on the list of allowed books, but I have allowed every ToB-request so far.

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