Author Topic: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24  (Read 5415 times)

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awaken DM golem

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Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« on: October 25, 2008, 05:08:07 PM »
Planar Metropolis in Epic, doesn't have the Level 20 cap on the townspeople running around. While this doesn't do anything to almost all of the classes, it does send the Commoner and the Expert well into Epic ... possibly. The numbers are:

Commoner ... 4d4+12 levels
Expert ............. 3d4+12 levels

So, somewhere out in the Deep Astral, there's a level 28 Commoner and somewhere else a level 24 Expert.
And you know ... sooner or later they'll have a testosterone contest. Which one is better ??

Akalsaris

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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2008, 05:18:59 PM »
I'd vote for the epic expert, since he can pick up some mad iajutsu and truenaming stuff.  And UMD, so he can rock out with epic spell-casting items.  It would actually be pretty fun to play I think, like a really weak factotum.

Still, that's 4 levels more of wealth for the commoner, which is quite a gap to cover.

JaronK

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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2008, 05:34:48 PM »
Expert all the way.  A level 24 character with the various power skills is REALLY good.

Unless, of course, the Commoner has Infested with Chickens.

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skydragonknight

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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #3 on: October 25, 2008, 06:28:21 PM »
Unless, of course, the Commoner has Infested with Chickens.

Chicken-Infested explains 28th level character wealth on a commoner. He co-owns a fast food restaurant chain in Sigil along with a dragonfire adept. Flame-broiled!
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SixthDeclension

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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2008, 06:33:12 PM »
Probably really close, but I think it would come down to the experts skills.
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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #5 on: October 25, 2008, 06:35:12 PM »
The expert has at best 12 more ranks in any skill.  12 ranks versus four levels of epic wealth... do the math.
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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2008, 06:35:42 PM »
Unless, of course, the Commoner has Infested with Chickens.

Chicken-Infested explains 28th level character wealth on a commoner. He co-owns a fast food restaurant chain in Sigil along with a dragonfire adept. Flame-broiled!
KFC Sigil, I've always wanted that.

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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #7 on: October 25, 2008, 09:09:09 PM »
Epic wealth gives the commoner an edge. A +30 item of UMD means he can use the caster goodies as well as the expert... from then on a lot depends on luck.
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skydragonknight

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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #8 on: October 25, 2008, 10:29:37 PM »
Hmm...as much as I love the power of the KFC commoner, the expert has an easier time making certain knowledge checks *cough*Pazuzu*cough* and could possibly learn all the relevant information needed for Ascension without even resorting to metagaming(yes, I dare invoke the M word on these boards!)
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awaken DM golem

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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #9 on: October 26, 2008, 04:06:39 PM »
Good stuff.


I'm thinking the Commoner could blow the entire 28th level of exp, on items or whatever, and still retain the one extra feat.

Obviously, Commoner has the advantage if Leadership is allowed.

Commoner's skill points are so thin, that even the extra moolah doesn't buy enough items, to keep up with Expert's skills.

I remember a thread on the TO-board just before the g.0. fiasco, that got spellcasting on to non-spell casters.
Race to Epic Spells anyone ??

woodenbandman

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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #10 on: October 26, 2008, 11:20:14 PM »
I'd go commoner, since they are single attribute dependent (money), while Experts are MAD.

plus the commoner can boost his UMD up to where it's not a problem and have enough left over for 10 scrolls of gate/timestop. And probably more.

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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #11 on: October 27, 2008, 03:37:50 PM »
But... but... the expert can learn Truespeak!
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JaxGaret

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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #12 on: October 27, 2008, 03:46:53 PM »
Do Epic levels even have a set WBL, particularly for NPCs?

Regardless, are these two schmoes just popping out of nothingness, ready to duel, or are they organic characters? If the latter, then you wouldn't necessarily go by any WBL chart.

For instance, would you give a 25th level Batman Wizard NPC the same wealth as a 25th level Soulknife NPC? If so, where the heck did the Soulknife get all that coin?
« Last Edit: October 27, 2008, 03:49:18 PM by JaxGaret »
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skydragonknight

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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #13 on: October 27, 2008, 04:29:59 PM »
For instance, would you give a 25th level Batman Wizard NPC the same wealth as a 25th level Soulknife NPC? If so, where the heck did the Soulknife get all that coin?

From the Wizard by using an Antimagic Torc and manifesting his mind blade in an AMF(which you can, given a check). ;)
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Ubernoob

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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #14 on: October 27, 2008, 04:35:13 PM »
Do Epic levels even have a set WBL, particularly for NPCs?
Yep.
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skydragonknight

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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #15 on: October 27, 2008, 05:14:42 PM »
The chart stops at 40 and then you have to have the formula to go further. Both PC and NPC charts are based on a formula, though I've never seen the NPC formula posted before.
But for the purposes of this the table should be enough.
Hmm..I don't see it in the SRD. *dusts off book copy*
Hmm. Correction. The NPC chart only goes to 30. Just far enough.

24th level 320,000
28th level 470,000

So the Commoner has almost 50% more wealth. +30 skill items cost 90,000 while +20 cost 40,000 and +10 cost 10,000, so for uber skill checks the Expert is more cost-effective.
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Ubernoob

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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #16 on: October 27, 2008, 11:56:52 PM »
Once you get into epic you start using more than one bonus type anyways.  They both make any fixed DCs there are.
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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #17 on: October 28, 2008, 12:32:32 AM »
i say commoner, it has more panache...
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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #18 on: October 28, 2008, 10:18:10 AM »
whoever wins initiative.
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Tshern

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Re: Commoner 28 vs. Expert 24
« Reply #19 on: October 28, 2008, 11:48:11 AM »
Epic wealth if you want to use PC wealth:
21st 975,000 gp 31st 4,900,000 gp
22nd 1,200,000 gp 32nd 5,600,000 gp
23rd 1,500,000 gp 33rd 6,300,000 gp
24th 1,800,000 gp 34th 7,000,000 gp
25th 2,100,000 gp 35th 7,900,000 gp
26th 2,500,000 gp 36th 8,800,000 gp
27th 2,900,000 gp 37th 9,900,000 gp
28th 3,300,000 gp 38th 11,000,000 gp
29th 3,800,000 gp 39th 12,300,000 gp
30th 4,300,000 gp 40th 13,600,000 gp

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