Another Polymorph Fix (peach)

[Farodin]

Hi, while working on a level 18 Wizard yesterday I thought of an easy Polymorph/Shapechange fix, on which I'd like to hear your input.

With Polymorph or Shapechange you can only take on forms with a maximum CR of your character level - x, where x is somewhere between 2 and 5 depending on power level of the campaign.

the boundaries can be changed of course, depending on what is appropriate.

It does not limit you to a few specific forms; the versatility and the fact that you can change into whatever you like are still there, but the combat power of the spells is more acceptable (it will remain impressive, but more managable).

It does not fix problems like negating expensive spell components, creating spawn or an ooze's split ability, but those can still be ruled to work differently for a shapechanging character, based on common sense, withouth altering or banning the entire spells.

If I'm not the first one to think of this (quite likely), my apologies. Input on the idea or a link to a previous discussion would still be appreciated.

[RobbyPants]

It helps, but I'm not sure it's a perfect fix.  I guess it depends on each DM's stance on players gaining monster abilities.

CR is certainly a better metric than HD, but it's not perfect.  When you look at CR, it guages a monster's strength.  When you look at LA, you get an (inflated) idea of the strength the monster's abilities give to a PC.  Note how often the two aren't in line.

So, when you use CR to see what forms a PC can pick, there are always going to be a few that slip by this filter.  I'd have to look at it more to give you some examples.

Take the remorhaz, for example.  It has both 7 HD and is CR 7.  Now, it's a very powerful form for a 7th level caster (or to be put on a 7th level ally).  If we set X at 2, then you can still access swallow whole and 8d6 fire damage a level 9.  It's not as bad, but how bad is too bad?

You might find a safer fix by actually limiting certain abilities to caster level.  Swallow whole isn't the awesomest thing around, but at lower levels it's pretty strong.

[JaronK]

Also, it still needs the "and no, you can't use this to get spells" change.

JaronK

[veekie]

Also, it still needs the "and no, you can't use this to get spells" change.

JaronK

I prefer the "you can get this, this and these abilities from the polymorph, nothing else"
Specifically spell out exactly what the spell can grant, staggering in the abilities by caster level.

[JaronK]

That works too, but either way, any fix needs to close that particular hole.  Making the spell about what's allowed instead of about what's not makes this easier, but just saying "can't do that!" is a nice quick and dirty fix.

JaronK

[Farodin]

(Sorry for not responding for so long.)

Making a complete list for everything you can do is a bit too much work I fear, especially since every second monster in MM 4-5 gets its own unique special ability. I would like to make a list of things that should definitely be changed though:

• You can not create spawn, duplicate yourself in any way, or otherwise produce/summon creatures.
• You do not gain any spellcasting ability of the creature.
• To use an ability which mimics a spell with expensive material or xp component, you must still pay the component. A material component could either just have to be on your person to use, or you could pay 1/5 of its value in xp.
• You cannot produce any magic items with any of the abilities of the creature. Expensive nonmagical items do not last longer than they would if made with Major Creation.

What other things should definitely be ruled to work differently?

[veekie]

Making a complete list for everything you can do is a bit too much work I fear, especially since every second monster in MM 4-5 gets its own unique special ability. I would like to make a list of things that should definitely be changed though:

You wouldn't need every unique special ability represented though, just break each ability down to what it really does. Immune/resists X when Y? Deals X damage of Y type when Z?(breath weapons, auras, stat attacks, poisons)The exceptions to this sort of specials tend to be things that probably shouldn't be that easily obtainable via polymorph, since they probably didn't have PC use in mind during design.