Author Topic: Wizard Hunting  (Read 20465 times)

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Tr011

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #20 on: October 13, 2011, 08:29:47 PM »
If a high-level mage is the equivalent to Batman than you have to become to D&D equivalent of the Joker.
.
Here you go! (The Joker Bard, not that monk, it gives perfect ideas for playing games with the wizards via plot, you can use that to defeat them imo)

Btw you are really dead if you fight them directly if they have Master Spellthief + 3 times Practised Spellcaster, because it means this means a total CL of HD+17 or something (not quite sure about the prerequirements and that stuff). So you either totally lame them out (pretty hard to do since they sound like Uber-Wizards) or you take their power piece-by-piece.

X-Codes

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #21 on: October 13, 2011, 08:38:39 PM »
Your typical Master Spellthief build, without something like Ur-Priest, Sublime, Chord, Triadic Knight, or whatever other shenanigans like that, isn't going to break CL 40 with meaningful spells.  On the other hand, there are so many divine-only spell boosts that it's just sick.

Juggernaut2889

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #22 on: October 13, 2011, 09:14:56 PM »
Probably Theurgic Specialist, if it's not a homebrew kick in the nuts feat

Theurgic Specialist 
[General]
(DR325 p62)
Specialist Wizard 3rd 
any other spellcasting
class
When you cast spells from your Specialized School of Magic from any of your spellcasting classes, your
effective Caster level is the sum of all your spellcasting classes

NOTE: this is the sum of your CLASSES, not CASTER LEVELS. Not really that impressive when you can just make up lost CLs with Practiced Caster anyways.


AFAIK, Psiotheurgist (arcane + psionics), is the only one that adds up Caster Levels for great power .


There's a PrC in FR that's like Halruuan Magehunter or some such. AMF x/day, good saves. However, it's not full casting progression, which is a downer.

General strategy might be to PrC dip as much as possible for save boosts.

Damp Power psionics power

No familiar I assume due to the easy command of having it prepared with a dispel magic/counterspell.

Divine Defiance immediate action counterspelling

Scrying can be frustrated by Amulet of Deception, Deathglance Locket and Circlet of Convocation. (items from DR319)

That may be the feat he's talking about.  I'm seeing him tonight and I'm going to double check that he knows what he's doing  :p.

Flay Crimsonwind

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #23 on: October 13, 2011, 09:37:39 PM »

Or you could just be a beholder mage/ur-priest/mystic theurge:smirk

FTFY.
Hahaha, this will get a table thrown at you, but basically gets to spell win in the earth's crust from space with the mages magic penis, a spell you'd invent solely for the purpose of writing your name on worlds because you'd gotten bored destroying them.

Can't believe that cleric hadn't occurred to me, though again, anti-magic torc. Cast all your divine spells, kill all their arcane spells. There has to be another way to avoid scrying.

Lycanthromancer

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #24 on: October 13, 2011, 09:42:31 PM »
Build a diplomancer. Convince everyone in the city without immunity to mind-affecting effects to enact a guerrilla war against those who do.

Have your wizard companion start Gating in CR 4000 templated critters, diplomacize them into submission, then send them out to crush.

Alternately, diplomacize the level 1 commoners, build a repeating trap of Mind Seed, wait a week, then have your self-minions go on a (subtle) rampage.
[spoiler]Masculine men like masculine things. Masculine men are masculine. Therefore, liking masculine men is masculine.

I dare anyone to find a hole in that logic.
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Which book is Lycanthromancer in?
Lyca ... is in the book. Yes he is.
 :D
shit.. concerning psionics optimization, lycan IS the book
[/spoiler]

sirpercival

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #25 on: October 13, 2011, 10:48:53 PM »

Or you could just be a beholder mage/ur-priest/mystic theurge:smirk

FTFY.
Hahaha, this will get a table thrown at you, but basically gets to spell win in the earth's crust from space with the mages magic penis, a spell you'd invent solely for the purpose of writing your name on worlds because you'd gotten bored destroying them.

Can't believe that cleric hadn't occurred to me, though again, anti-magic torc. Cast all your divine spells, kill all their arcane spells. There has to be another way to avoid scrying.

I had the fun idea of a supervillain which was an advanced beholder uttercold assault necro: beholder mage 3/ur-priest 2/contemplative 1/true necromancer 9.  CL 20 double 9's.  Who cares if TN drops caster levels if you're building off two fast progression prestige classes? 
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"You... saved me? So I was dismantled? I... thank you, then. I will not incinerate you."

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Tr011

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #26 on: October 13, 2011, 10:52:35 PM »
Rules:
ECL 9
Remember that. So you won't get double 9s.

JaronK

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #27 on: October 13, 2011, 10:59:49 PM »
I'd say just go for stealth and full out offense and hope you catch one by surprise.  This is definitely a time to consider being a Necropolitan... the immunities would REALLY be nice, especially against the Enchanter.  Just remember to disguise yourself as being living... no spell sees through the disguise skill.

JaronK

sirpercival

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #28 on: October 13, 2011, 11:01:17 PM »
Would this be a good scenario for the chicken wight army?
Burn all the microfiche!  Firebomb all the 8-tracks!

I'm not just a druid -- I'm a singing, dancing, Broadway druid.

[spoiler]
Quote from: PhaedrusXY
"You... saved me? So I was dismantled? I... thank you, then. I will not incinerate you."

There's only one character concept worth having, and that's the one you've thrown darts at.
[/spoiler]

BeholderSlayer

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #29 on: October 13, 2011, 11:15:24 PM »
Beholder Mage 9 gets into level 9 spells  :P
Hi Welcome
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Lycanthromancer

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« Last Edit: October 13, 2011, 11:39:28 PM by Lycanthromancer »
[spoiler]Masculine men like masculine things. Masculine men are masculine. Therefore, liking masculine men is masculine.

I dare anyone to find a hole in that logic.
______________________________________
[/spoiler]I'm a writer. These are my stories. Some are even SFW! (Warning: Mostly Gay.)
My awesome poster collection. (Warning, some are NSFW.)
Agita's awesome poster collection.
[spoiler]
+1 Lycanthromancer
Which book is Lycanthromancer in?
Lyca ... is in the book. Yes he is.
 :D
shit.. concerning psionics optimization, lycan IS the book
[/spoiler]

Solo

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #31 on: October 13, 2011, 11:33:41 PM »
Have you considered playing monks?

"I am the Black Mage! I cast the spells that makes the peoples fall down!"

The Legend RPG, which I worked on and encourage you to read.

Ikeren

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #32 on: October 14, 2011, 01:23:38 AM »
Clearly we're working on the premise that it's obvious that real success is non-optional; so we want the most reasonable build that will survive the plot and be cool and fun to play.

I suggest monk.

JaronK

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #33 on: October 14, 2011, 04:24:53 AM »
Would this be a good scenario for the chicken wight army?

ALL scenarios are good for the chicken wight army.

JaronK

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #34 on: October 14, 2011, 04:50:36 AM »
+1 to playing a Monk. The DM wants to throw BBEG Ultimate Maguses (-as?) at you and ban some options because he wants to rape your character. Make him play down to your character's level or end the campaign in the first session, either way it is the only victory you will ever get out of him.
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[spoiler]Tiers break down into who has spellcasting more than anything else due to spells being better than anything else in the game.
6: Skill based. Commoner, Expert, Samurai.
5: Mundane warrior. Barbarian, Fighter, Monk.
4: Partial casters. Adapt, Hexblade, Paladin, Ranger, Spelltheif.
3: Focused casters. Bard, Beguiler, Dread Necromancer, Martial Adapts, Warmage.
2: Full casters. Favored Soul, Psion, Sorcerer, Wu Jen.
1: Elitists. Artificer, Cleric, Druid, Wizard.
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Bester

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #35 on: October 14, 2011, 05:20:27 AM »
+1 to playing a Monk. The DM wants to throw BBEG Ultimate Maguses (-as?) at you and ban some options because he wants to rape your character. Make him play down to your character's level or end the campaign in the first session, either way it is the only victory you will ever get out of him.

Make sure somebody plays a RAW truenamer.  Make sure all the monks are VoP.  I can see this approach working.  He's expecting optimization, hit him with the opposite.  "I hit it with my fist." is supposed to be a valid tactic in 3.5 after all.

SneeR

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #36 on: October 14, 2011, 05:46:58 AM »
The question "How high-level are they?" is chief here. Even the Evoker will be a threat if he is ECL 13+.

But I would definitely say go after the evoker first. Not only will it be a cool and flashy battle, but if you stock up on elemental immunities, he won't be able to even scratch you.

The Diviner is second-highest priority, highest if he is at a reasonable level.
The answer to everything:
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SneeR
[spoiler]
I don't know if the designers meant you to take Skill Focus for every feat.
Sounds a little OP.

The monk is clearly the best class, no need to optimize here. What you are doing is overkill.

It's like people who have no idea what a turn signal is. They ruin it for everyone else.
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Mixster

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #37 on: October 14, 2011, 06:07:04 AM »
I support Beholder Mage 2/Rainbow Servant 7.
Yeah sure, at ECL 9 you will only have 9th level spells and 3 domains to choose from, but in 3 levels bam, dual 9s on your Int score.
Remember to be a Divine Minion elf Necropolitan (or ghost) with Aberrant Wild shape, that way you qualify for Faeries mysteries initiate with D12 HD.

Alternatively I hear good things about Illithid Savant Thrallherds.
Monks are pretty much the best designed class ever.

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X-Codes

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #38 on: October 15, 2011, 12:02:22 AM »
Clearly we're working on the premise that it's obvious that real success is non-optional; so we want the most reasonable build that will survive the plot and be cool and fun to play.

I suggest monk.
Success is optional.  CLERIC.

Juggernaut2889

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #39 on: October 15, 2011, 03:47:26 AM »
We need a better definition of "high level," not to mention how long it's going to be until you're actually expected to take on these guys.

Basically, you want to be a Cleric.  Clerics can juice their CLs better than any Wizard ever, even without Master Spellthief (the feat I believe your DM is giving these Wizards).  Check this out:

Level 13 Cleric:
Adept Spirit spell (Cleric 2, MoI): +1 CL
Orange Ioun Stone: +1 CL
Masterwork Holy Symbol: +1 CL (something that will boost a Necromancy [Death, Evil] spell)
Elder Giant Magic Feat: +3 CL
Agony: +2 CL
Necromancer Domain: +1 CL
Ankh of Ascention: +4 CL
Bead of Karma: +4 CL
Divine Spell Power Feat: +4 CL

Use this and DMM to cast a CL 34 Persistent Greater Consumptive Field in the morning, then walk through a hamlet, making your CL cap out at 51.  That's a CL of 51 at level 13 (well, you have to kill 38 critters within the area in order to get the full bonus, but still, just walk into a densely-populated area).  Your other persistent spells can also benefit from a number of these abilities again, pumping their CLs to 64, 68, or maybe even 70.  If these spells are 10 min/level, you don't even need to bother with Persistent Spell, they're lasting over 10 hours already, unextended.  Oh, and you can even Persist a Spell Resistance spell for SR 80.  When it's that ridiculously high, then it actually kinda matters.

Check out the resource here for even more potential boosts: http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19872350/Raising_Caster_Level

I think I'm going to go with this plan, go Cleric1 of Orcus(Evil and Necromancy Domains)/Archivist8.  Since I'm only level 9 I'm going to have to settle for the standard Consumptive Field, maybe I'll max my Diplomacy and offer to "help out" at a local hospital.  After getting the necessary amount of kills I'll immediately cast Spell Resistance.  Maybe I'll send some Giant Vermin (40HD Scorpions) enhanced with Venomfire (d6/CL no cap acid damage with tail) over to one of the schools, but not before casting Detect Scrying and Greater Invisibility and having my left over turn attempts be used for Divine Defiance.