Author Topic: Wizard Hunting  (Read 19946 times)

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Juggernaut2889

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Wizard Hunting
« on: October 13, 2011, 04:19:49 AM »
So in the current campaign, our goal is to kill the "Circle of 8", which are the 8 rulers of the continent.  Each ruler is a high level Ultimate Magus, one specializing in each school of magic, and their own school of wizards.  We'll be fighting (hopefully) these guys one at a time, since essentially they each have their own city.  Also, they each have some feat that I feel like I should have heard of that stacks their Sorcerer and Wizard caster level for any spell cast to just about anywhere it would apply.  So I'm trying to think of an optimal character for this game.  SR becomes effectively useless, can't always rely on saves for dealing with no-save magic, a caster will have a rough time do to the number of dispels they would face along with the level it could be cast at.  Also I have no clue what the 8 may have for companions.

Rules:
ECL 9
No Sorcerers (Campaign Rule)
No Familiars (See Above)
No Vecna-Blooded
No Factotum
No BoED

These are the rules I've gotten so far, the rest generally needs DM's approval.  Your thoughts?

Littha

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #1 on: October 13, 2011, 04:23:54 AM »
Basically you are screwed

Flay Crimsonwind

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #2 on: October 13, 2011, 07:19:34 AM »
Basically you are screwed
+1

High level ultimate magus? With a city's worth of people and a school of wizards under them? The only way you'll stand a chance at this current level would be to find a way to make your spells undispellable and go with casters. Might be you could get by with similarly prepared psionics. Otherwise... what level can a character afford an anti-magic torc? Maybe some Locate City Bomb and just blow the fuck out of the whole place before they know they're even being scryed?

Dictum Mortuum

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #3 on: October 13, 2011, 07:35:39 AM »
Basically you are screwed

This.
I lol'ed.
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Nytemare3701

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #4 on: October 13, 2011, 08:21:21 AM »
Go get your self Vecna blooded and pray for some DM intervention. A well played caster will beat you regardless, so it all boils down to how high your DM sets the bar.

OblivionSmurf83

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #5 on: October 13, 2011, 08:26:12 AM »
Go get your self Vecna blooded and pray for some DM intervention. A well played caster will beat you regardless, so it all boils down to how high your DM sets the bar.

Vecna blooded is banned according to the DM.

Plot is all you can count on at this point.

EDIT: According to the OP I should say!

Nytemare3701

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #6 on: October 13, 2011, 08:30:12 AM »
No Vecna-Blooded
[/quote]

Missed that. Sorry. I'd get myself a Tinfoil Hat (shrink item shenanigans). It will go a long way in protecting you.

Mixster

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #7 on: October 13, 2011, 08:50:21 AM »
Cheater of Mystra could be quite effective here. You should basically be living in an anti-magic field.

You still need a way to stop them divining your plan though.

Consider the following:
Cheater of Mystra w/ regeneration (from the fiendish codex thingie), freedom of movement, mind blank, protection from nonlethal damage and AMF up 24/7. Could do relatively well against those casters.
Monks are pretty much the best designed class ever.

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radionausea

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #8 on: October 13, 2011, 09:03:08 AM »
Also, they each have some feat that I feel like I should have heard of that stacks their Sorcerer and Wizard caster level for any spell cast to just about anywhere it would apply. 

I'm almost entirely certain that there is no such feat - which is why you haven't heard of it. A needlessly cruel homebrew feat given you're already going to be up against an (entire city + wizard school + much higher level than you NPC) x8.
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Endarire

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #9 on: October 13, 2011, 09:26:30 AM »
Maybe Psions will work if you play it as "Psionics are different."  Otherwise, I vote Cheater of Mystra who begs Mystra for Deny Weave on these guys.
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Don't even need TO for this.  Any decent Hood build, especially one with Celerity, one-rounds [Azathoth, the most powerful greater deity from d20 Cthulu].
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Cagemarrow

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #10 on: October 13, 2011, 09:39:56 AM »
Lucid Dream assassin may have a slight chance, if the wizards sleep instead of using lesser restoration and meditation instead.

Without the ability to prevent divination from tracking down you or your associates you don't stand a chance. There are just too many ways for a caster to protect themselves, especially if they have advanced knowledge of your arrival.

OblivionSmurf83

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #11 on: October 13, 2011, 10:40:56 AM »
Is your DM just an arse? The fact that he's specifically banned Vecna blooded suggests he wants you to be able to be found by the Wizards. So, either you've got no chance at all, or you're going to win through plot means. Either way, no amount of optimisation will save you.

With that in mind, I suppose Cheater of Mystra is your best bet.

Nunkuruji

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #12 on: October 13, 2011, 12:38:31 PM »
Probably Theurgic Specialist, if it's not a homebrew kick in the nuts feat

Theurgic Specialist 
[General]
(DR325 p62)
Specialist Wizard 3rd 
any other spellcasting
class
When you cast spells from your Specialized School of Magic from any of your spellcasting classes, your
effective Caster level is the sum of all your spellcasting classes

NOTE: this is the sum of your CLASSES, not CASTER LEVELS. Not really that impressive when you can just make up lost CLs with Practiced Caster anyways.


AFAIK, Psiotheurgist (arcane + psionics), is the only one that adds up Caster Levels for great power .


There's a PrC in FR that's like Halruuan Magehunter or some such. AMF x/day, good saves. However, it's not full casting progression, which is a downer.

General strategy might be to PrC dip as much as possible for save boosts.

Damp Power psionics power

No familiar I assume due to the easy command of having it prepared with a dispel magic/counterspell.

Divine Defiance immediate action counterspelling

Scrying can be frustrated by Amulet of Deception, Deathglance Locket and Circlet of Convocation. (items from DR319)

Rebel7284

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #13 on: October 13, 2011, 12:52:34 PM »
Runescarred Berserker can cast a few spells including AMF too.

High concentration with those save-replacing maneuvers is good to have too.
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dark_samuari

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #14 on: October 13, 2011, 04:33:27 PM »
Why not actually go with a plot-heavy offense?

You can't possibly hope to win via strict mechanics so any solution has to recognize this. Also, assuming your DM is somewhat reasonable he'll want you to win. It is, ideally, his hope, is for you guys to succeed or else he is frankly a poor DM.

So what does this leave, intrigue. I propose you try to turn the wizards against each other. After all, at least from what I have almost always seen in the character optimization communities, high level wizards are the most paranoid. You in turn must use this to your advantage (because honestly it is one of only a few you really have...) and capitalize on it. Disruption of their infrastructure is the next vital step. If you make them so busy handling a structural collapse of their city (be it economic or however) than you can have a sense of chaos to hide behind.

Now, how do you go about this? Well it jumps out at me that the first thing is you have to eliminate the 'divination expert.' He is your biggest obstacle and is the one that can really screw with your whole operation. Now, without Venca-Blooded you'll have some difficulty but there are other ways to hide oneself. I think the Joker Bard over at GitP explains to a greater deal how one may go about this.

Now, you have a focus but you can continue to do more. Now this is going to rely more on you but how do you go about destroying the infrastructure of the city? Start pumping out drugs throughout the city (which is cheap, addictive & deadly)? Bomb the city banks or government offices? Target the police/militia/city guard?

If a high-level mage is the equivalent to Batman than you have to become to D&D equivalent of the Joker.

X-Codes

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #15 on: October 13, 2011, 06:37:00 PM »
We need a better definition of "high level," not to mention how long it's going to be until you're actually expected to take on these guys.

Basically, you want to be a Cleric.  Clerics can juice their CLs better than any Wizard ever, even without Master Spellthief (the feat I believe your DM is giving these Wizards).  Check this out:

Level 13 Cleric:
Adept Spirit spell (Cleric 2, MoI): +1 CL
Orange Ioun Stone: +1 CL
Masterwork Holy Symbol: +1 CL (something that will boost a Necromancy [Death, Evil] spell)
Elder Giant Magic Feat: +3 CL
Agony: +2 CL
Necromancer Domain: +1 CL
Ankh of Ascention: +4 CL
Bead of Karma: +4 CL
Divine Spell Power Feat: +4 CL

Use this and DMM to cast a CL 34 Persistent Greater Consumptive Field in the morning, then walk through a hamlet, making your CL cap out at 51.  That's a CL of 51 at level 13 (well, you have to kill 38 critters within the area in order to get the full bonus, but still, just walk into a densely-populated area).  Your other persistent spells can also benefit from a number of these abilities again, pumping their CLs to 64, 68, or maybe even 70.  If these spells are 10 min/level, you don't even need to bother with Persistent Spell, they're lasting over 10 hours already, unextended.  Oh, and you can even Persist a Spell Resistance spell for SR 80.  When it's that ridiculously high, then it actually kinda matters.

Check out the resource here for even more potential boosts: http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19872350/Raising_Caster_Level

Mixster

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #16 on: October 13, 2011, 07:48:21 PM »
Also, they each have some feat that I feel like I should have heard of that stacks their Sorcerer and Wizard caster level for any spell cast to just about anywhere it would apply.

I'm almost entirely certain that there is no such feat - which is why you haven't heard of it. A needlessly cruel homebrew feat given you're already going to be up against an (entire city + wizard school + much higher level than you NPC) x8.

Master spellthief.

If a high-level mage is the equivalent to Batman than you have to become to D&D equivalent of the Joker.
Here you go!
« Last Edit: October 13, 2011, 07:51:21 PM by Mixster »
Monks are pretty much the best designed class ever.

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X-Codes

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #17 on: October 13, 2011, 08:04:41 PM »
MIXTER, WHY!?  Why must you tempt the unholy creature into this thread!?  The being that makes Pazuzu tremble with a concussion (from facepalming).

Read: You don't want to be a Monk.  You want to be a Cleric.  Badly.  The more evil, the better.  Evil wins D&D.

BeholderSlayer

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #18 on: October 13, 2011, 08:13:41 PM »
This all depends on how high the level that you will be is.

As I always suggest in a high optimization game, you can be godlike as a Wizard/Hathran/Incantatrix. Miracle up an Acorn of Far Travel, or use persistent Unfettered Heroism. Abuse Simulacrum heavily, and utilize Unfettered Heroism or your acorn to persist as many spells as you like as well as cast any spell you know spontaneously. You'll have to memorize spells you want to quicken. CL 40 tossing 20th level spells spontaneously from a massive spellbook is always a force to be reckoned with.

Or you could just be a beholder mage.  :smirk
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sirpercival

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Re: Wizard Hunting
« Reply #19 on: October 13, 2011, 08:18:26 PM »

Or you could just be a beholder mage/ur-priest/mystic theurge:smirk

FTFY.
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