Dice Practicality

[Bauglir]

Okay, this thread would more properly belong in The Kitchen Sink, but that board gets fuckall traffic as far as I can tell so I'm posting it here.

I'm designing a system whose central mechanic involves rolling 3 dice. Right now, they're d6s, matching up roughly to D&D's RNG spread, if not the likelihood of rolling each result. This also has an advantage in the ubiquity of d6s; it's no problem to get a bunch of them.

However, I'm considering switching it to d10s. It makes other numbers scale more easily, because I can have increments of 5 rather than increments of 3, and it's a lot easier to run those numbers on the fly quickly. For a variety of reasons related to other mechanics, I think it's important that success increments step by roughly the average result of the die, so just accept that as axiomatic here. The problem is that expecting people to have 3 d10s is  more demanding than 3 d6s. You pretty much have to buy at least 2 sets of dice, and you won't use any but the d10s except in rare circumstances so it's kind of a waste unless you're already playing other systems enough to have done that.

So, what I'm wondering here is, which practicality value is more important? The practicality of easy gameplay, or the practicality of getting materials for playing in the first place?

[SneeR]

With 3d6, a +1 is a really big deal. With 3d10, you can more generously hand out bonuses.

Now on to your question.
How often will you need 3d10?
Will you need more than 3 d10s?
What other dice will you need? Because if you need 3d10 and d4s and d6s, People might as well purchase whole dice sets, so you shouldn't be shy about using odd dice.

If most of the other dice used are d6s, have you considered using 5d6? Adds up to 30, only d6, still has a bell curve, though more dispersed (if I am correct...).

[awaken DM golem]

The thing that 4e unintentionally "proved" was
even trying to make the game linear isn't good enough.
Trying hard also isn't good enough.
Mix in too much stuff and the game can't be linear.

What exactly this has to do with dice?
If you're trying for linear, I don't think the dice matter. It ain't happening.
If you aren't trying for linear, then:
a) ... GOOD !!
b) ... idk the math to help (silly me).

[amalcon]

Whitewolf games have historically used lots of d10s.  On that basis, it should be possible to come up with large numbers of them.

[kurashu]

Whitewolf games have historically used lots of d10s.  On that basis, it should be possible to come up with large numbers of them.

This. And bulk dice aren't as hard to come by as a lot of people think either.

[Bauglir]

You'll need 3d10 (or 3d6) anytime you'd need a d20 in D&D, which is to say often. Regardless of the choice I make, certain special abilities will let you roll extra dice (some will only let you roll extra and take the best 3 or whatever, but still). I don't know of anything that will require any other die size off the top of my head, but I want to leave things open for things like variable damage bonuses or something (the base rules have fixed damage if you successfully hit though).

That's a good point about the bonus magnitude, though. Between that and reassurances that bulk d10s aren't as rare as I assume, I'll probably go with that. For the sake of ease of math, everything'll be calibrated from 15 being the "unmodified average" that 10 is in D&D, so everything'll be slightly likelier to succeed than fail since the actual value is 16. I wonder if that gives too much advantage to offense, though.

Thanks for the help.

[SneeR]

d10s are easier to spin like a top than d6, so it'll give players something to do when the going gets slow... 

[X-Codes]

Honestly, d10's in general are about as common as d20's, and if you can buy one you can almost as easily buy 3...

5d6 will significantly normalize the "d20" rolls in your game, although the 3d10's will only normalize it slightly.  2d12 will very slightly normalize it, and the middle 90% of your die rolls will still consist of 18 different values.

In any case except the 2d12, a +1 will actually matter more, since the number of different results you can get in the middle 90% of a "d20" roll is smaller.

[radionausea]

I don't know what it's like in the States but any games shop here in the UK has boxes of loose dice of all number of sides, usually for about 20p. 
Is it that different elsewhere?

[The_Mad_Linguist]

Bah, d11s are where it's at.

[Jackinthegreen]

If you're trying to emulate a d20, 2d10 ups the average roll from 10.5 to 11 and keeps the rest of the rules pretty much in line.  Crit ranges don't have to be modified like with changing it to anything but max 20.

[Caelic]

Concerns about the difficulty of getting dice might have applied in 1975 or so, but frankly, anyone who can't figure out how to find d10's in the Ebay era probably isn't going to be able to figure out your rules system, either.

[Bauglir]

It was more of a concern of convenience than strict availability, but I take your point.

[Caelic]

It was more of a concern of convenience than strict availability, but I take your point.

Well, think of it this way:

1. Anyone who is interested in your system is interested in roleplaying games.

2. Anyone who is interested in roleplaying games is likely to have the dice commonly associated with roleplaying games.

3. Therefore, for the vast majority of individuals interested in your system, there will be no inconvenience at all.


It just seems to me that, in general, you can do more with d10's than d6's--percentiles come to mind immediately.

[Bauglir]

Definitely true. If I wanted to optimize for convenience, I'd leave it at 2d10. Dice sets already come with 2, so you only need to have bought one. Still, I like the increased spread from a third, and it smooths the bell curve to about the level I find good.

[Sjappo]

If all you are worried about is availability of dice I would stop worrying.

Everybody who has a dice set already has 2. Most gamers I know have more than 1 set, so at least 4 dice. They can share.
Gameshops sell individual die, at least around here.
You only need 1 die freak/WoD player to be drowning in d10. You probably already have one such player. Maybe you are such a player.
This. Just an example. Dice are cheap. Buying 10 d10 as a GM will make you able to help 3 to 10 players and are way cheaper than buying yet an other book.

[McPoyo]

I swapped to using 3d6 for a game one time to try it out, the math went something like a 0.6% chance to roll a 3 or an 18, and the vast majority of the rolls fell in the 9-13 range. It worked pretty well for that game, since it was incredibly low-magic, and so I could hand out nice things like really well made stuff for +1's and 2's without worrying about whether or not it was trivial to the players because of how much it counted for with their rolls.

[SorO_Lost]

I'm thinking 10d2, because screw 1d20, 2d10, 3d6, and preemptively do so for the 5d4.

10d2 ftw, wide ranging odds be damned.

[Caelic]

I'm thinking 10d2, because screw 1d20, 2d10, 3d6, and preemptively do so for the 5d4.

10d2 ftw, wide ranging odds be damned.

D02: Know No Limit!

[Bauglir]

Fuck, why am I even bothering writing something? Game over, man, game over! I was beaten before I started! This D02 system is a triumphant expression of everything good about roleplaying, not to mention a glorious throatpunch to the cancer that has been killing tabletops. Not tabletop games, I'm referring to actual table surfaces.