Author Topic: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review  (Read 5606 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Bozwevial

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 4497
  • Developing a relaxed attitude to danger.
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #20 on: August 21, 2011, 07:25:17 PM »
I highly recommend the rules used in the Call of Cthulhu D20 book, they were basically the same as the other CoC's but i think it is a really good system. also, please tell me "lowest mental stat" doesn't include CHA, i can't imagine that affecting sanity.
Charisma isn't beauty; it's force of personality, persuasiveness, and the like. Plenty of dragons, mind flayers, and the like have it in spades, and they aren't exactly paragons of attractiveness.

Mister Lamp

  • Ring-Tailed Lemur
  • **
  • Posts: 32
  • Ia Ia Cthulhu Fhtagn
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #21 on: August 21, 2011, 09:35:57 PM »
I highly recommend the rules used in the Call of Cthulhu D20 book, they were basically the same as the other CoC's but i think it is a really good system. also, please tell me "lowest mental stat" doesn't include CHA, i can't imagine that affecting sanity.
Charisma isn't beauty; it's force of personality, persuasiveness, and the like. Plenty of dragons, mind flayers, and the like have it in spades, and they aren't exactly paragons of attractiveness.

I still cannot imagine it affecting sanity. I have horrible people skills, and I'm only slightly less sane than the next guy. and that's because of the Cthulhu Mythos.
That was somewhat misleading on my part. Think of it as self-confidence, self-image, the ego, and other such things, not people skills. Someone with a low Charisma who goes insane is probably suffering crippling self-doubt or has a skewed perception of him/herself (or, given the power of the entities in the Cthulhu mythos, an accurate perception of his or her place in the universe).

Bozwevial

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 4497
  • Developing a relaxed attitude to danger.
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #22 on: August 21, 2011, 10:28:37 PM »
I highly recommend the rules used in the Call of Cthulhu D20 book, they were basically the same as the other CoC's but i think it is a really good system. also, please tell me "lowest mental stat" doesn't include CHA, i can't imagine that affecting sanity.
Charisma isn't beauty; it's force of personality, persuasiveness, and the like. Plenty of dragons, mind flayers, and the like have it in spades, and they aren't exactly paragons of attractiveness.

I still cannot imagine it affecting sanity. I have horrible people skills, and I'm only slightly less sane than the next guy. and that's because of the Cthulhu Mythos.
That was somewhat misleading on my part. Think of it as self-confidence, self-image, the ego, and other such things, not people skills. Someone with a low Charisma who goes insane is probably suffering crippling self-doubt or has a skewed perception of him/herself (or, given the power of the entities in the Cthulhu mythos, an accurate perception of his or her place in the universe).

Low Wisdom can invite insanity in the form of hallucinations, a weak will succumbing to temptation or base desires, whatever. Picture a power-mad cultist trying to complete a ritual to gather enough power to get what he wants or to remove a threat, real or imagined. He's smart and has a firm grasp on himself, but he's vulnerable to the lure of easy rewards or to influence/control from external sources.

Someone with low Charisma is probably going to be more nihilistic in their insanity. Imagine a serial killer plagued by thoughts of how his wife killed their children before killing herself. His self-confidence is shattered, which leads to him taking it out in rather unacceptable methods. Alternatively, he caught a glimpse of something eldritch and massive and now realizes that no matter what he does, it won't matter in the end. He's cunning and has the will to carry his acts of depravity through, even though he's still insane and has a crippled psyche.

Low Intelligence is probably the hardest to portray, but it contributes to insanity by not permitting a mind to make sense of what it sees. Someone with a high intelligence naturally tries to analyze and understand events, which can act quite well as a defense against mental trauma. If you're not very bright, you're going to take the brunt of the fear simply because it's a mystery. Things are generally more horrific when they're not clear; the most effective horror films don't explain exactly what the monster is or what it can do. They often won't even show a clear picture of it, because that diminishes the fear. (See the Weeping Angels from Doctor Who as a good example of this--their first appearance is much more effective because we don't know what they can do, what they are, or even what they look like until the climax of the episode. The next time they appear, even the newcomers to the series are told of their abilities in advance, and then they get about five times more screentime. They become the horror equivalent of jumping out and going boo.)

Mister Lamp

  • Ring-Tailed Lemur
  • **
  • Posts: 32
  • Ia Ia Cthulhu Fhtagn
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #23 on: August 21, 2011, 10:53:38 PM »
I highly recommend the rules used in the Call of Cthulhu D20 book, they were basically the same as the other CoC's but i think it is a really good system. also, please tell me "lowest mental stat" doesn't include CHA, i can't imagine that affecting sanity.
Charisma isn't beauty; it's force of personality, persuasiveness, and the like. Plenty of dragons, mind flayers, and the like have it in spades, and they aren't exactly paragons of attractiveness.

I still cannot imagine it affecting sanity. I have horrible people skills, and I'm only slightly less sane than the next guy. and that's because of the Cthulhu Mythos.
That was somewhat misleading on my part. Think of it as self-confidence, self-image, the ego, and other such things, not people skills. Someone with a low Charisma who goes insane is probably suffering crippling self-doubt or has a skewed perception of him/herself (or, given the power of the entities in the Cthulhu mythos, an accurate perception of his or her place in the universe).

Low Wisdom can invite insanity in the form of hallucinations, a weak will succumbing to temptation or base desires, whatever. Picture a power-mad cultist trying to complete a ritual to gather enough power to get what he wants or to remove a threat, real or imagined. He's smart and has a firm grasp on himself, but he's vulnerable to the lure of easy rewards or to influence/control from external sources.

Someone with low Charisma is probably going to be more nihilistic in their insanity. Imagine a serial killer plagued by thoughts of how his wife killed their children before killing herself. His self-confidence is shattered, which leads to him taking it out in rather unacceptable methods. Alternatively, he caught a glimpse of something eldritch and massive and now realizes that no matter what he does, it won't matter in the end. He's cunning and has the will to carry his acts of depravity through, even though he's still insane and has a crippled psyche.

Low Intelligence is probably the hardest to portray, but it contributes to insanity by not permitting a mind to make sense of what it sees. Someone with a high intelligence naturally tries to analyze and understand events, which can act quite well as a defense against mental trauma. If you're not very bright, you're going to take the brunt of the fear simply because it's a mystery. Things are generally more horrific when they're not clear; the most effective horror films don't explain exactly what the monster is or what it can do. They often won't even show a clear picture of it, because that diminishes the fear. (See the Weeping Angels from Doctor Who as a good example of this--their first appearance is much more effective because we don't know what they can do, what they are, or even what they look like until the climax of the episode. The next time they appear, even the newcomers to the series are told of their abilities in advance, and then they get about five times more screentime. They become the horror equivalent of jumping out and going boo.)

makes sense. just two more (unrelated) things. 1:nice profile pic. 2: how do i put a quote in my sig? because that first paragraph makes me happy.
That was somewhat misleading on my part. Think of it as self-confidence, self-image, the ego, and other such things, not people skills. Someone with a low Charisma who goes insane is probably suffering crippling self-doubt or has a skewed perception of him/herself (or, given the power of the entities in the Cthulhu mythos, an accurate perception of his or her place in the universe).

Bozwevial

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 4497
  • Developing a relaxed attitude to danger.
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #24 on: August 22, 2011, 02:23:52 AM »
makes sense. just two more (unrelated) things. 1:nice profile pic. 2: how do i put a quote in my sig? because that first paragraph makes me happy.
Profile==>Forum Profile Information==>Signature. BBCode works in a signature, so quote blocks and hyperlinks are both viable options.

bhu

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 6783
  • Convincing the rich whale fat enemas are healthy
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #25 on: August 22, 2011, 04:16:17 AM »
I'm also fooling about with new rules for a spellcasting system:

Spellcasting Rules

The spells listed here are somewhere between regular d20 spells and skills.  Once a character has learned a spell, he begins with 1 rank in it, and can buy more ranks just like Skills (maximum ranks per level are the same as Skill Points, Skill Points are used to purchase ranks in spells).  He does not need to make a Skill Check to cast a spell (unless noted otherwise), the ranks merely determine how powerful the spells effects are as opposed to his Character Level like normal d20 spells.


Learning A Spell

There are several ways to learn a spell:

Deities: If one is willing to bargain with a Deity, the God can simply impart knowledge of the spell as a Swift Action, and the PC takes the Deific Bargain Flaw while gaining 2 ranks in the spell the Deity chooses to teach him (which will be detailed below).

Spellcasters: If the PC is not willing to bargain with a Deity he can choose to apprentice himself to a more experienced caster, human or not.  This is scarcely less dangerous than bargaining with a God, and you get whatever spells a madman or a supernatural entity wish to give you.  Learning time is half normal since you have someone to show you the way, but you must take the Apprentice Flaw. For both learning a spell via Apprenticeship or Book learning you must attempt to cast it to learn the spell (which can have possible problems if you fail, see Adverse Effects below)

Book Learning: You can hunt down and find scrolls, books, or other means of communication that describe casting a spell and attempt it yourself.  Can be dangerous in the case of some rituals, but you're a free man without ties (unless you screw up).

Spellcrafting: If all else fails, and you have the Spellcrafting ability gained from 10 Levels of Occultist you can attempt to make your own version of a spell from scratch.  Assuming you survive the research.

A typical spell will look like this:

Spell Name
Costs: Sanity or other damage that needs to be taken to cast the spell.
Requirements: If the spell can only be cast in certain places, or times, or when certain events have taken place it will be listed here. 
Components: Necessary components, if any.
Learning Time: How long it takes to learn the spell by experimenting with instructions read from a book.  The time listed is the time you take trying to learn the spell, and the DC listed after is the Knowledge (Arcane) Check you must make to successfully learn it or start over from scratch.
Casting Time: How long it takes to cast.
Range: The range of the spell.
Target, Effect, or Area: What the spell effects, or the area it encompasses.
Duration: How long the spell lasts.
Saving Throw: Saving Throw necessary to shrug off or reduce the effects of the spell.
Adverse Effects: Side effects for long ritual spells that are cast incorrectly or interrupted (or for failing to learn the spell).


work in progress



bhu

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 6783
  • Convincing the rich whale fat enemas are healthy
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #26 on: August 23, 2011, 01:52:22 AM »
[spoiler][/spoiler]

no thoughts on the casting??

altpersona

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 2939
  • BG forum Emperor Ad Litem
    • Altpersona.net
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #27 on: August 23, 2011, 02:32:06 AM »
i would appreciate it if you didnt post private pictures of my wife.
The goal of power is power. - idk
We are not descended from fearful men. - Murrow

The Final Countdown is now stuck in your head.

Anim-manga sux.


bhu

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 6783
  • Convincing the rich whale fat enemas are healthy
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #28 on: August 23, 2011, 03:52:15 AM »
In my defense she didn't mention she was married.   :D

awaken DM golem

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 3294
  • PAO'd my Avatar
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #29 on: August 23, 2011, 08:38:45 PM »
I don't remember Hillary Clinton having that haircut , but I don't watch that much TV.

bhu

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 6783
  • Convincing the rich whale fat enemas are healthy
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #30 on: August 23, 2011, 09:05:52 PM »
Let us focus on the new spellcastin rules and what I may have done wrong.


Else I shall post the sexay male cthulhu much to everyones consternation.

Mister Lamp

  • Ring-Tailed Lemur
  • **
  • Posts: 32
  • Ia Ia Cthulhu Fhtagn
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #31 on: August 24, 2011, 12:25:09 AM »
Let us focus on the new spellcastin rules and what I may have done wrong.


Else I shall post the sexay male cthulhu much to everyones consternation.

can you post that anyway?  :D
That was somewhat misleading on my part. Think of it as self-confidence, self-image, the ego, and other such things, not people skills. Someone with a low Charisma who goes insane is probably suffering crippling self-doubt or has a skewed perception of him/herself (or, given the power of the entities in the Cthulhu mythos, an accurate perception of his or her place in the universe).

Bozwevial

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 4497
  • Developing a relaxed attitude to danger.
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #32 on: August 24, 2011, 01:23:33 AM »
I'm slightly concerned with how much this will eat into a typical character's skill points compared to how much you'd get out of it, but I suppose I can't really pass judgment on that point right now.

bhu

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 6783
  • Convincing the rich whale fat enemas are healthy
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #33 on: August 24, 2011, 04:14:21 AM »
So scribble out some example spells and then we'll see where it goes from there?

Daniel678

  • Barbary Macaque at the Rock of Gibraltar
  • ***
  • Posts: 199
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #34 on: August 24, 2011, 04:19:41 AM »
Instead of having a new skill for each spell why not instead tie spells to existing skills? It would have the same effect of having spellcasters specialize and it makes sense that, for instance, a good Gather Information check could help someone gather relevant information from a Scrying spell. A haste spell could require everyone to make a tumble roll to make the most of it's effects etc.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2011, 04:22:14 AM by Daniel678 »

bhu

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 6783
  • Convincing the rich whale fat enemas are healthy
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #35 on: August 24, 2011, 03:53:37 PM »
The original idea was that in CoC or even in mythos stories for the most part, knowing one spell doesn't help you in learning any other one, and no one learns very many spells.  The skill point idea seemed like a mechanical way of doing that.

Bozwevial

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 4497
  • Developing a relaxed attitude to danger.
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #36 on: August 24, 2011, 05:08:07 PM »
Plus, spellcasting here isn't meant to be the casual sort of thing it is in D&D. They're (as I understand it) meant to be reserved for dire situations and are probably going to be more along the lines of divinations, abjurations, and the like.

The trick is making the spells useful enough to merit losing out on useful skill points but not so useful that you don't want to spend them on anything else.

Mister Lamp

  • Ring-Tailed Lemur
  • **
  • Posts: 32
  • Ia Ia Cthulhu Fhtagn
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #37 on: August 24, 2011, 07:56:52 PM »
Plus, spellcasting here isn't meant to be the casual sort of thing it is in D&D. They're (as I understand it) meant to be reserved for dire situations and are probably going to be more along the lines of divinations, abjurations, and the like.

The trick is making the spells useful enough to merit losing out on useful skill points but not so useful that you don't want to spend them on anything else.

Summons are probably the best example. in this case, while they are very useful, it costs SAN to cast, and then you most likely lose additional SAN to the creature.

I would say lump all the summons, Byakhee, Mi-Go, Deep One, etc... into one skill. byakhee is extremely important as a summonable flyer, while the mi-go are useless in most situations, the Deep Ones make excellent underwater scouts... but with all the SAN loss, i am not likely to invest in 3 or more different summons.
That was somewhat misleading on my part. Think of it as self-confidence, self-image, the ego, and other such things, not people skills. Someone with a low Charisma who goes insane is probably suffering crippling self-doubt or has a skewed perception of him/herself (or, given the power of the entities in the Cthulhu mythos, an accurate perception of his or her place in the universe).

bhu

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 6783
  • Convincing the rich whale fat enemas are healthy
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #38 on: August 24, 2011, 09:15:39 PM »
plus you have to have the binding spell for each summon

veekie

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 9034
  • WARNING: Homing Miko
Re: Preliminary draft of Sanity rules up for review
« Reply #39 on: August 25, 2011, 03:17:56 AM »
Psh, who needs bindings. You just need to run faster than your victim.
The mind transcends the body.
It's also a little cold because of that.
Please get it a blanket.

I wish I could read your mind,
I can barely read mine.

"Skynet begins to learn at a geometric rate. It becomes self-aware at 2:14 a.m. Eastern time, August 29th. At 2:15, it begins rolling up characters."

[spoiler]
"Just what do you think the moon up in the sky is? Everyone sees that big, round shiny thing and thinks there must be something round up there, right? That's just silly. The truth is much more awesome than that. You can almost never see the real Moon, and its appearance is death to humans. You can only see the Moon when it's reflected in things. And the things it reflects in, like water or glass, can all be broken, right? Since the moon you see in the sky is just being reflected in the heavens, if you tear open the heavens it's easy to break it~"
-Ibuki Suika, on overkill

To sumbolaion diakoneto moi, basilisk ouranionon.
Epigenentheto, apoleia keraune hos timeis pteirei.
Hekatonkatis kai khiliakis astrapsato.
Khiliarkhou Astrape!
[/spoiler]

There is no higher price than 'free'.

"I won't die. I've been ordered not to die."