Eldritch Glaive Question

[bjornvikingholt]

Eldritch Glaive requires a full round to manifest and attack with. Is this a function of casting time and thus subject to becoming a full attack as a standard action under the effects of supernatural transformation (and does this fall under the "unless otherwise noted" text of all all SU abilities being standard actions?)

If this does not work, what is the best way to get an Ur-Lock into melee as a swift action without using tome of battle or quicken SLA?

[Vicerious]

Eldritch glaive is, essentially, a spell-like ability (not supernatural) with a casting time of 1 full round.  As a result of this casting, you create the glaive and make a number of attacks with it equal to what would normally be allowed by your base attack bonus.

Therefore, anything that reduces that casting time, such as Quicken Spell-Like Ability, would get you that effect in the shorter amount of time.  It's worth noting that eldritch glaive is not a full attack.  It is not affected by the haste spell or any other effect that grants extra attacks on a full attack.

[stranglebat]

There is a 3rd level Cleric spell in SpC called Knights move that allows you to teleport short ranges into a flank position as a swift action. Or The monster manual Quicken SLA to quicken your Flee the scene to teleport in. There are many different verisons of that feat in each of MM 1-4 SS and BoVD check with your dm to see which one is most current.

[CrimsonDeath]

I don't think Warlock invocations qualify for Supernatural Transformation since they're class features.  (At least, I don't think class features would be considered "innate".  Is "innate" defined anywhere?)

From the Magic Item Compendium:

Anklet of Translocation teleports you 10' 2/day as a swift action. (1400gp)

Belt of Battle can give you an extra move action up to 3/day as a swift action, among other uses.  (12000gp)

Chronocharm of the Horizon Walker lets you move up to half your speed as a swift action 1/day, and can be worn with other types of chronocharms.  (500gp)

Outside the MIC...

If your DM lets Use Magic Device trigger psionic items, you could get dorjes (Expanded Psionics Handbook) of Hustle (EPH) or Dimension Hop (Complete Psionic).  (Dimension Hop 750gp, Hustle 4500gp, 50 charges)

If you can get a pair of Master's Shadow Hands (ToB 149-150, variant Crown of the White Ravens) with Shadow Blink, you can use that maneuver once per encounter (or once every five minutes, I believe, if you're not doing anything strenuous).  It lets you teleport 50' as a swift action if you have line of sight and line of effect, and land in an unoccupied space. (45000gp)

There are also a couple of feats:

Hidden Talent (from an optional sidebar in Expanded Psionics Handbook) gives you two power points and a single level 1 power known, which can be manifested at level 1.  Dimension Hop, from Complete Psionic, lets you teleport 10' as a swift action.

Travel Devotion (Complete Champion) can be triggered once per day as a swift action.  For the next minute after that, you can move up to your speed as a swift action.  You can take the feat up to twice (three times if you're a cleric and give up a domain).  If you have turn attempts, you can burn three of them for an extra use per day.  (It's ambiguous whether you lose the turn attempts permanently for extra uses when you take the feat, or burn daily uses when you decide to activate it again that day.  Ask your DM.)

There's probably more.

[Ras F]

I don't think Warlock invocations qualify for Supernatural Transformation since they're class features.  (At least, I don't think class features would be considered "innate".  Is "innate" defined anywhere?)

That bit of requirement is usually countered by:
"Born of a supernatural bloodline, a warlock seeks to master the perilous magic that suffuses his soul. Unlike sorcerers or wizards, who approach arcane magic through the medium of spells, a warlock invokes powerful magic through nothing more than an effort of will. By harnessing his innate magical gift through fearsome determination and force of will, a warlock can perform feats of supernatural stealth, beguile the weak-minded, or scour his foes with blasts of eldritch power."
If I'm making a sufficient Knowledge: (3.5 board lore) check. I don't have the errata on hand however. IIRC it's definitely counter to RAI.

[CrimsonDeath]

I wouldn't say it's definitely counter to RAI since the definition of "innate" is kind of murky.  Half the time, I'm not sure what the writers of Savage Species intended.

[bjornvikingholt]

All, good suggestions, yet limited to "per day" uses (though with turning from UP, devotion seems best). Assuming nighstick stacking is banned, how do i gain enough turning attempts to both persist divine power and delay death while still being able to close to melee range?

Assuming warlock does qualify for supernatural transformation, does the normally full round SLA eldritch glaive become a standard action SU ability, thus negating the need for convoluted shenanigans?

[stranglebat]

Ok how about using the totemist boots soulmeld. Should be able to do unlimited short range teleports a day

[The_Mad_Linguist]

I don't think Warlock invocations qualify for Supernatural Transformation since they're class features.  (At least, I don't think class features would be considered "innate".  Is "innate" defined anywhere?)

That bit of requirement is usually countered by:
"Born of a supernatural bloodline, a warlock seeks to master the perilous magic that suffuses his soul. Unlike sorcerers or wizards, who approach arcane magic through the medium of spells, a warlock invokes powerful magic through nothing more than an effort of will. By harnessing his innate magical gift through fearsome determination and force of will, a warlock can perform feats of supernatural stealth, beguile the weak-minded, or scour his foes with blasts of eldritch power."
If I'm making a sufficient Knowledge: (3.5 board lore) check. I don't have the errata on hand however. IIRC it's definitely counter to RAI.

Designers have said that it wasn't intended, and that "innate" is one of those tricky words that's sometimes used for flavor when it ought not to be - in the case of supernatural transformation it only works on abilities granted by race.

They also said that they were perfectly in favor of people houseruling it to be allowed, since it fits decently flavor-wise and doesn't unbalance anything.

[CrimsonDeath]

All, good suggestions, yet limited to "per day" uses (though with turning from UP, devotion seems best). Assuming nighstick stacking is banned, how do i gain enough turning attempts to both persist divine power and delay death while still being able to close to melee range?

Not sure you can take devotion feats as an Ur-Priest (I'm guessing that's what you meant by UP?) since they're at least flavored if not explicitly ruled as requiring faith in a divine patron.  I know it's a lot of "per day" stuff (except the dorjes, which are non-rechargeable), but that's probably about the best you could hope for.  There are a few of ways to get teleportation at will (Flee the Scene and some celestials/fiends), but I can't think of any that are swift actions.  Fortunately, very few of the items I suggested overlap on body slots, so you could get more than one.

To answer your question, it might help to know what sort of resources and build you're dealing with.  Simple answers would be things like metamagic reducers or Extra Turning, but it seems you already have a build planned out, and I don't know how many of your feats or ability scores are spoken for.

Ok how about using the totemist boots soulmeld. Should be able to do unlimited short range teleports a day

Blink Shirt won't help for multiple reasons, mostly because you can't take any actions after teleporting until your next turn, but also because it's a standard action, and even binding it to your totem only drops that to a move.

Cerulean Sandals won't be much help for different reasons.  First, like Blink Shirt, it works like Dimension Door, which kills your actions until your next turn.  Second, it's limited to 10'/meldshaper level/day in 10' increments.  At least it binds to feet, which means you can bind it without multiclassing, but that still doesn't help.

[bjornvikingholt]

sources allowed include everything short of tome of battle

for the build i was thinking warlock 4/binder 1/Ur-Priest 2/Eldritch Disciple 3/Hellfire Warlock 3/Eldritch Disciple 7

Though since the DM rules Supernatural Transformation works (and so does power attack) with glaive, that solves the problems. given the same restrictions though, in a game with a more strict rule interpretation, how would you all solve the mobility issues?

[skydragonknight]

Cloistered Cleric dip for Knowledge Devotion, Travel Devotion (mobility) and a domain or domain feat of your choice.

[stranglebat]

All, good suggestions, yet limited to "per day" uses (though with turning from UP, devotion seems best). Assuming nighstick stacking is banned, how do i gain enough turning attempts to both persist divine power and delay death while still being able to close to melee range?

Not sure you can take devotion feats as an Ur-Priest (I'm guessing that's what you meant by UP?) since they're at least flavored if not explicitly ruled as requiring faith in a divine patron.  I know it's a lot of "per day" stuff (except the dorjes, which are non-rechargeable), but that's probably about the best you could hope for.  There are a few of ways to get teleportation at will (Flee the Scene and some celestials/fiends), but I can't think of any that are swift actions.  Fortunately, very few of the items I suggested overlap on body slots, so you could get more than one.

To answer your question, it might help to know what sort of resources and build you're dealing with.  Simple answers would be things like metamagic reducers or Extra Turning, but it seems you already have a build planned out, and I don't know how many of your feats or ability scores are spoken for.

Ok how about using the totemist boots soulmeld. Should be able to do unlimited short range teleports a day

Blink Shirt won't help for multiple reasons, mostly because you can't take any actions after teleporting until your next turn, but also because it's a standard action, and even binding it to your totem only drops that to a move.

Cerulean Sandals won't be much help for different reasons.  First, like Blink Shirt, it works like Dimension Door, which kills your actions until your next turn.  Second, it's limited to 10'/meldshaper level/day in 10' increments.  At least it binds to feet, which means you can bind it without multiclassing, but that still doesn't help.

 I should have reread them before opening my big mouth