Author Topic: Changeling half-fey useelie fey (gestalt) Rogue ACF 3//Marshal 1 (Read 7022 times)

Anarchy_Kanya · « **on:** February 10, 2011, 04:45:58 PM »

Hello all!

I need some input on making this build not suck too much. As iin the title, it's a changeling half-fey useelie fey (gestalt) Beguiler 3//Marshal 1.
Primary partyface, secondary a spy.
Abilities (32 pb): Str 8, Dex 14, Con 10, Int 18, Wis 10, Cha 20.
Feats: Force of Personality (CAdv), Versatile Spellcaster (RoTD), Skill focus (Diplomacy) (marshal). Got two free (1st and 3rd level).
I choose Winter Chill from unseelie fey. That gives me -5 debuff to saves to all non-fey creatures in 5ft reach

. This + good Cha + Charm Person at will =

I've also got Assume Quirk and Conceal Spellcasting skill tricks.

Is there anything I can do to make it work better?

BeholderSlayer · « **Reply #1 on:** February 10, 2011, 04:54:24 PM »

What exactly do you mean by "spy?"

Honest question, since that might make a difference in the recommendations.

Anarchy_Kanya · « **Reply #2 on:** February 10, 2011, 04:57:36 PM »

Infiltration via Disguise & Bluff.

RelentlessImp · « **Reply #3 on:** February 10, 2011, 04:59:08 PM »

Check with your DM and see if Extra Spell from Complete Arcane needs to come off your class list. If not, take it once for Glibness (Bard 2).

Anarchy_Kanya · « **Reply #4 on:** February 10, 2011, 05:03:00 PM »

Quote from: RelentlessImp on February 10, 2011, 04:59:08 PM

Check with your DM and see if Extra Spell from Complete Arcane needs to come off your class list. If not, take it once for Glibness (Bard 2).

Beguiler 3 doesn't have 2nd level spells yet. Or I'm missing soomething.
And his got Glibness at 3rd spell level, so it would be kinda a waste. Again, if I'm not missing something.

And BTW. RelentlessImp. Sorry for calling you a fanboy and a bitch. I know it's internet, but is such rude behavior necessary? I think not, because you and Sunic are smart and going personal just because someone has diffrent opinion than you is so idiotic... It just irritated me. Sorry again. Nevermind, you're not wort it.

RelentlessImp · « **Reply #5 on:** February 10, 2011, 05:13:22 PM »

Well, technically, if you took the Spellgifted (Enchantment) Trait, you could cast your 2nd level spells of the Enchantment school by blowing 2 1st level slots. Also, didn't know that about the Beguiler list; I rarely touch any of those niche classes besides Dread Necromancer.

BeholderSlayer · « **Reply #6 on:** February 10, 2011, 05:15:46 PM »

Quote from: Anarchy_Kanya on February 10, 2011, 05:03:00 PM

And BTW. RelentlessImp. Sorry for calling you a fanboy and a bitch. I know it's internet, but is such rude behavior necessary? I think not, because you and Sunic are smart and personal is so idiotic... It just irritated me. Sorry again.

Most of us have thick skin. Others do not, and like to spam the Report Post button on various forums. The question is, which would you rather be?

Anarchy_Kanya · « **Reply #7 on:** February 10, 2011, 05:20:38 PM »

Quote from: RelentlessImp on February 10, 2011, 05:13:22 PM

Well, technically, if you took the Spellgifted (Enchantment) Trait, you could cast your 2nd level spells of the Enchantment school by blowing 2 1st level slots. Also, didn't know that about the Beguiler list; I rarely touch any of those niche classes besides Dread Necromancer.

Hm... I don't know if my DM will allow it. Is it RAW?
And the -1 to other schools is a little painful.

Quote

Most of us have thick skin. Others do not, and like to spam the Report Post button on various forums. The question is, which would you rather be?

Wasn't me, I swear!

The reaction from the Mod surprised me. It thought that there's total anarchy in here.

RelentlessImp · « **Reply #8 on:** February 10, 2011, 05:23:15 PM »

It's RAW, but it's an understanding most people don't understand. Hidden away in the PHB (and by "hidden away", I mean "in the totally relevant section on spellcasting") is a line that states you can't cast a spell if you don't have an appropriate caster level to cast it - that means 2nd level spells would be open to Wizards (who can totally scribe those spells at first level)s. at first level if they had 2nd level slots.

This line makes it possible because the Beguiler "automatically knows all spells on their class list", wording that leads to Rainbow Servant shenanigans, but nevermind that. Once you hit caster level 4, you know your 2nd level spells. You don't have slots, but Versatile Spellcaster takes care of that.

Anarchy_Kanya · « **Reply #9 on:** February 10, 2011, 05:25:35 PM »

Int 18. 1 bonus slot at 2nd spell level. Doesn't that count?

RelentlessImp · « **Reply #10 on:** February 10, 2011, 05:29:57 PM »

No. In the ability scores and spellcasters section in the PHB (page 22ish, I think), it explains that the bonus spell slots don't matter if you don't have slots already. Let me see if I can find the relevant text...

Quote from: SRD

The ability that governs bonus spells depends on what type of spellcaster your character is: Intelligence for wizards; Wisdom for clerics, druids, paladins, and rangers; or Charisma for sorcerers and bards. In addition to having a high ability score, a spellcaster must be of high enough class level to be able to cast spells of a given spell level.

This doesn't invaldiate the earlier. Let me locate the corresponding text that makes it work...

BeholderSlayer · « **Reply #11 on:** February 10, 2011, 05:31:19 PM »

In order to get bonus spells from an ability score, you need to have at least a zero in the spells/day column/row/whateveritis for that spell level at your current level.

I get what RI is saying, but I'm not totally convinced it's worth trying to get this early unless this campaign isn't going to take you very far.

Anarchy_Kanya · « **Reply #12 on:** February 10, 2011, 05:33:56 PM »

2-3 levels top. Maybe, MAYBE more.

RelentlessImp · « **Reply #13 on:** February 10, 2011, 05:38:02 PM »

Quote from: Anarchy_Kanya on February 10, 2011, 05:33:56 PM

2-3 levels top. Maybe, MAYBE more.

Then no, not worth pulling it off. If you were going further, and wanted to pull some early entry shenanigans, it'd be worth it. Though Versatile Spellcaster + Heighten Spell (and possibly Sanctum Spell, for Rainbow Servant shenanigans) is usually enough for that.

You don't have a 14+ Con. Remedy that. You can stand losing a few points in Charisma for it. LIVING is more important.

I'd really suggest the Season's Power that gives magic circle against nature over the -5 saves within 5ft. Unless you plan to fight a lot of what are excluded by it, most of which are immune to the majority of your spells.

The_Mad_Linguist · « **Reply #14 on:** February 10, 2011, 05:38:18 PM »

Quote from: BeholderSlayer on February 10, 2011, 05:31:19 PM

In order to get bonus spells from an ability score, you need to have at least a zero in the spells/day column/row/whateveritis for that spell level at your current level.

To put it another way, bonus spells add to your class progression.

Just as with having a -- constitution, getting a bonus to -- spells doesn't change shit.

Anarchy_Kanya · « **Reply #15 on:** February 10, 2011, 05:51:53 PM »

Quote from: RelentlessImp on February 10, 2011, 05:38:02 PM

You don't have a 14+ Con. Remedy that. You can stand losing a few points in Charisma for it. LIVING is more important.

Con 14 -4 (half-fey and useelie fey).

I want high Cha. I know it might be stupid, but for me it's a too big sacrifice.

Quote

I'd really suggest the Season's Power that gives magic circle against nature over the -5 saves within 5ft. Unless you plan to fight a lot of what are excluded by it, most of which are immune to the majority of your spells.

Now that you say it... it is kinda good, but... will my spell DC's be good enough?

RelentlessImp · « **Reply #16 on:** February 10, 2011, 06:10:26 PM »

Yes. You might want to help that by taking the otherwise worthless Spell Focus feats for Enchantment or Illusion (I recommend Illusion over anything else).

Anyways, if the party level is actually above 4 (you never stated), drop half-fey. The vast majority of what you get from it you also get from Unseelie Fey; the good parts, anyways (flight, etc). This gives you more levels to play around with, and class levels are always, always better than level adjustment.

Give us more to work with. Give us books allowed, starting level, any houserules, etc.

Anarchy_Kanya · « **Reply #17 on:** February 10, 2011, 06:19:46 PM »

3rd level, gestalt. Beguiler 3//Marshal 1+2 LA.
Books any but anything too fishy must be inspected by the DM (like Dragon and Dungeon Magazines).
I like the half-fey template. The unseelie fey template is just a "free" addon.

The_Mad_Linguist · « **Reply #18 on:** February 10, 2011, 08:11:33 PM »

Quote from: Anarchy_Kanya on February 10, 2011, 05:51:53 PM

Quote from: RelentlessImp on February 10, 2011, 05:38:02 PM
You don't have a 14+ Con. Remedy that. You can stand losing a few points in Charisma for it. LIVING is more important.
Con 14 -4 (half-fey and useelie fey).
I want high Cha. I know it might be stupid, but for me it's a too big sacrifice.

If you're doing dirty tricks, you might want to consider faerie mysteries initiate for int to hp instead of con.

RelentlessImp · « **Reply #19 on:** February 10, 2011, 08:20:14 PM »

Quote from: The_Mad_Linguist on February 10, 2011, 08:11:33 PM

Quote from: Anarchy_Kanya on February 10, 2011, 05:51:53 PM
Quote from: RelentlessImp on February 10, 2011, 05:38:02 PM
You don't have a 14+ Con. Remedy that. You can stand losing a few points in Charisma for it. LIVING is more important.
Con 14 -4 (half-fey and useelie fey).
I want high Cha. I know it might be stupid, but for me it's a too big sacrifice.
If you're doing dirty tricks, you might want to consider faerie mysteries initiate for int to hp instead of con.

I keep forgetting that damn feat. It does require you to have sex with a fey every day... and I'm not seeing the downside.

News:

Author Topic: Changeling half-fey useelie fey (gestalt) Rogue ACF 3//Marshal 1 (Read 7022 times)