Author Topic: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?  (Read 6739 times)

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The_Mad_Linguist

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #20 on: January 04, 2011, 11:04:06 PM »
I actually suggested something similar to Evil Hat in Dresden playtesting, back when they were using a different health system.
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Bozwevial

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #21 on: January 04, 2011, 11:18:27 PM »
I actually suggested something similar to Evil Hat in Dresden playtesting, back when they were using a different health system.
Probably carries a little more weight there, since it changes one of your aspects.

Unbeliever

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #22 on: January 05, 2011, 12:04:15 AM »
I've always been tempted by a Sunder Natural Weapon type feat or option.  There was one in a 3rd party supplement once upon a time.  I think it eliminating the attack entirely might be a bit much, but perhaps debuffing it would work -- significant (scaling?) penalty to hit and/or damage might be the way to go.  That way the effects of the sunder scale well -- enemies w/ one very powerful attack react different to the sunder than ones w/ an array of weaker attacks, and so forth.

Bloody Initiate

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #23 on: January 05, 2011, 12:55:08 AM »
Quote
About the sunder thing... have you thought about a mechanic to sunder body parts?? As in, you make a sunder attack, monster makes a save, if monster fails the save, it loses an arm/leg/wing/whatever... I don't know, I have been trying to make sense out of something like that, it would give melee characters some control capacity (it flies, you cut his wings before it takes off or something) in the other hand, monsters have more attacks than a PC of the same level. I don't know, food for thought.

We did this for a guy who wanted to sunder limbs. Since there was not a mechanic present I looked at the Hydra.

Basically your limbs have as many hitpoints as [Your total hitpoints/(number of limbs your possess)]. I don't remember if we made them harder to hit than a wielded weapon (If we didn't I would now), but if you lost a limb you simply lost as many hitpoints as the limb took and were limited accordingly (No two-handed weapons etc.).

Of course the guy who wanted it changed his concept and our efforts became unnecessary.

Also a couple people have posted why this would be a problem. I just thought I'd share the houserule work we did because it sure as hell isn't getting used.
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The_Mad_Linguist

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #24 on: January 05, 2011, 12:58:23 AM »
I actually suggested something similar to Evil Hat in Dresden playtesting, back when they were using a different health system.
Probably carries a little more weight there, since it changes one of your aspects.
I'm not sure if I relaly had that much of an influence, but I did have a conversation with one of the designers where I suggested that it would be an interesting mechanic for the players to choose when they got consequences.
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Bozwevial

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #25 on: January 05, 2011, 01:02:31 AM »
I actually suggested something similar to Evil Hat in Dresden playtesting, back when they were using a different health system.
Probably carries a little more weight there, since it changes one of your aspects.
I'm not sure if I relaly had that much of an influence, but I did have a conversation with one of the designers where I suggested that it would be an interesting mechanic for the players to choose when they got consequences.
I meant more that the consequence carries more weight in the Dresden Files since it becomes part of who you are, but it sounds like you had a fair bit of influence.

Endarire

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #26 on: January 05, 2011, 03:29:01 AM »
1.1 is up.

Sunic, thank you for your positive influence on my house rules!  Your positive critique makes me feel like what I did was right.  And this quote will probably be sigged.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2011, 03:32:10 AM by Endarire »
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Speaking of which:
Don't even need TO for this.  Any decent Hood build, especially one with Celerity, one-rounds [Azathoth, the most powerful greater deity from d20 Cthulu].
Does it bug anyone else that we've reached the point where characters who can obliterate a greater deity in one round are considered "decent?"

jeco

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #27 on: January 05, 2011, 04:17:02 AM »

Finally, you can Disarm, Sunder, Pin, and Trip with ranged weapons.



!!!9: Melee martial strikes may be used with ranged weapons.
I've had bad experiences playing an archer.  Life seems so hard and blah.

Why not let martial strikes work with ranged attacks, such as bow shots, sling bullets, and thrown weapons?

X-Codes

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #28 on: January 05, 2011, 04:28:32 AM »
There's a pixie savage progression somewhere.  SS I think.

Bozwevial

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #29 on: January 05, 2011, 12:13:50 PM »
Thing is, ranged characters are already at a disadvantage there. Swords don't need ammunition, they don't need to blow a feat just so they don't take a penalty to hit someone in combat (a feat with a mediocre prerequisite, I might add), it's easier for melee weapons to deal massive damage...Ranged weapons excel in numbers of attacks, but that's not great without some punch behind the attacks. I'd say it's perfectly fine to let them use those maneuvers. (There's a list of maneuvers that work with ranged weapons floating around out there anyway.)

That said, since Endarire seems comfortable with allowing homebrewed material, there are a lot of homebrewed ranged disciplines.

Sunic_Flames

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #30 on: January 05, 2011, 01:57:13 PM »
About the sunder thing... have you thought about a mechanic to sunder body parts?? As in, you make a sunder attack, monster makes a save, if monster fails the save, it loses an arm/leg/wing/whatever... I don't know, I have been trying to make sense out of something like that, it would give melee characters some control capacity (it flies, you cut his wings before it takes off or something) in the other hand, monsters have more attacks than a PC of the same level. I don't know, food for thought.

And then enemies cripple the beatstick for life.
I guess it gives Regenerate a use. That said, fighters really don't need another big helping of poo added to their plate while the casters are smugly sipping bourbon and will probably never have to deal with the sundering of body parts.

Which is higher level than Raise Dead, and the same level as Resurrection. Which means it is literally a fate worse than death. As befits Sundertards.
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Sunic_Flames

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #31 on: January 05, 2011, 02:02:25 PM »
1.1 is up.

Sunic, thank you for your positive influence on my house rules!  Your positive critique makes me feel like what I did was right.  And this quote will probably be sigged.

Well what I actually said was maneuvers only on the first attack, not on any attack (which would allow multiple strikes a round). Granted, it probably wouldn't break anything to do it that way instead but it isn't what I recommended.

Also, ignoring the rest of the stuff about Sundertards. And if you want beatsticks to remain relevant you will too.
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[spoiler]
Sunic may be more abrasive than sandpaper coated in chainsaws (not that its a bad thing, he really does know what he's talking about), but just posting in this thread without warning and telling him he's an asshole which, if you knew his past experiences on WotC and Paizo is flat-out uncalled for. Never mind the insults (which are clearly 4Chan-level childish). You say people like Sunic are the bane of the internet? Try looking at your own post and telling me you are better than him.

Here's a fun fact: You aren't. By a few leagues.
[/spoiler]

X-Codes

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #32 on: January 05, 2011, 06:56:54 PM »
Probably add a Lesser Regenerate spell at 3rd level.  1d8+CL (max +15) HP healing and removes penalties for damaged limbs.  Raise Dead also repairs such damage, and the Reincarnate spell will remove penalties from severed limbs as well (given that the character is getting a completely new body).

Phoenix00

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #33 on: January 05, 2011, 09:23:11 PM »
A level 10 Factotum that has been polymorphed into an Arrow Demon (with two bows that possess the splitting enchantment) would love this ruleset.

All he needs is a bard cohort with sonic dragonfire inspiration to make all those arrows into sonic volleys of death

Endarire

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #34 on: January 06, 2011, 03:31:13 AM »
And that sounds like a team working together!
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Speaking of which:
Don't even need TO for this.  Any decent Hood build, especially one with Celerity, one-rounds [Azathoth, the most powerful greater deity from d20 Cthulu].
Does it bug anyone else that we've reached the point where characters who can obliterate a greater deity in one round are considered "decent?"

Unbeliever

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #35 on: January 06, 2011, 01:14:50 PM »
A level 10 Factotum that has been polymorphed into an Arrow Demon (with two bows that possess the splitting enchantment) would love this ruleset.

All he needs is a bard cohort with sonic dragonfire inspiration to make all those arrows into sonic volleys of death
And the house rules changed this really how?  I guess there's the standard action thing, but if I were making a volley factotum he'd probably have some UMD/UPD and have Hustle or even just the chronocharm.

Havok4

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #36 on: January 06, 2011, 01:43:21 PM »
The house rules make it so the factotum can get multiple full attacks out in a round.

RobbyPants

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #37 on: January 06, 2011, 03:33:58 PM »
2: Everyone automatically gets Combat Expertise and Power Attack.
These are simply modes anyone can activate, but are slightly changed:

-Combat Expertise has no BAB cap.

-Power Attack also works on light weapons at +1 damage per -1 accuracy.
I like this, but I'd also add the caveat that a one-handed weapon gets +2 damage per -1 to hit.  That puts it on par with a two-hander, so the real change for using a shield is just in the base damage plus half your Str mod.  One for one makes sense on light weapons since you get two of them.

Now, you just have to decide if you're cool with a longsword and short sword user effectively getting 3:1, or if you want to cap all weapons at 1:1 if using multiple.
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Echoes

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Re: What are the most likely ramifications of these house rules?
« Reply #38 on: January 06, 2011, 04:20:15 PM »
2: Everyone automatically gets Combat Expertise and Power Attack.
These are simply modes anyone can activate, but are slightly changed:

-Combat Expertise has no BAB cap.

-Power Attack also works on light weapons at +1 damage per -1 accuracy.
I like this, but I'd also add the caveat that a one-handed weapon gets +2 damage per -1 to hit.  That puts it on par with a two-hander, so the real change for using a shield is just in the base damage plus half your Str mod.  One for one makes sense on light weapons since you get two of them.

Now, you just have to decide if you're cool with a longsword and short sword user effectively getting 3:1, or if you want to cap all weapons at 1:1 if using multiple.

It would make TWF worth a damn without sneak attack, so that's a plus. I've no problem with TWF fucking people up, because it costs a lot to do. You need to spend several feats (or 1 feat and an item if you only want two off-hand attacks), have decent Dex (unlike THF, where you can dump everything except Str and rock face), and you take attack penalties on top of it. You also spend twice as much cash to keep your weapons relevant when you already have money problems. In short, TWF needs to either have it's costs brought down a lot, or it needs to be awesome to make up for it.

As is, the only viable non-sneak attacking (or other bonus damage-stacking) TWF build is a Revenant Blade, and that's only because they get to go 2-for-1 with their double weapon. Another nice thing is that these changes don't make the Revenant Blade obsolete, simply less awesome, which is fine.
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