Author Topic: Psicrystals and "Telepathic Speech:" one-way or two-way communication?  (Read 4894 times)

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Saeomon

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My DM and I frequently do not see eye-to-eye when it comes to the rules. I tend to interpret rules expansively, with ambiguities decided in favor of the player. She tends to interpret rules narrowly, with ambiguities decided in favor of the DM.

That said, we got in another argument, today. This time about the Telepathic Speech ability that a Psicrystal gains when its master reaches 5th level.

She ruled that Telepathic Speech is simply speech. The Psicrystal can talk INTO the target creature's mind, but the creature cannot talk back into the Psicrystal's "mind." Any response must be verbalized.

Her ruling is based on the following. One, the name of the ability. It does say telepathic speech. Two, the difference in the wording between the Telepathic Speech ability and the Telepathic Link ability, which specifically refers to the Mindlink power.

I attempted to counter her ruling by citing to the following. First, that the text of the ability says, "the psicrystal can communicate telepathically with," not "can speak telepathically to." The use of the words "communicate" and "with" implies a shared experience with a back-and-forth/give-and-take. Second, that the text of the ability is virtually identical to that of the Telepathy special ability, as well as the Mindlink power.

Now, as always, what the DM says goes, blah, blah, blah. But I want to know: am I off-base, here, or is she? How do others play with this ability, and is there anything to which I could turn which would bolster my argument?

As an aside, I have the sense that she's ruled this way at least in part to keep the party from being able to easily communicate with a shy, mute Half-Giant NPC in an innocuous manner. This non-evil NPC has been forced to work for the bad guys and thus has a ton of information about them.

Regardless, I'm getting tired of all these narrowly-construed rules.

Emo_Duck

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Re: Psicrystals and "Telepathic Speech:" one-way or two-way communication?
« Reply #1 on: December 18, 2010, 09:29:12 AM »
Personally, I'd be more inclined to agree with the more limited interpretation. It just makes more sense to me that the psicrystal has the ability to project its thoughts, whereas normal, nonpsionic creatures don't have that ability.

My current DM seems to agree more with you, however. I think it's ambiguous enough to be read either way, so I'd just let the DM have her way. :P

Psithief

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Re: Psicrystals and "Telepathic Speech:" one-way or two-way communication?
« Reply #2 on: December 18, 2010, 10:13:55 AM »
It's nearly pointless to have it one way. A psicrystal can already speak a language.

Also I think you have a mean DM.

Kajhera

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Re: Psicrystals and "Telepathic Speech:" one-way or two-way communication?
« Reply #3 on: December 18, 2010, 11:52:00 AM »
I've always interpreted it as one-way communication ... and had to remind my DM that communicating telepathically between it and another takes a standard action.

Hence my psicrystal usually just talks.

sir_argenon

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Re: Psicrystals and "Telepathic Speech:" one-way or two-way communication?
« Reply #4 on: December 18, 2010, 12:02:14 PM »
Quote
he psicrystal can communicate telepathically with any creature that has a language and is within 30 feet of the psicrystal

my bold.  "with" is a joint action. meaning all parties are involved.  if it was only 1-way communication, "to" would have been used instead.

Shiki

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Re: Psicrystals and "Telepathic Speech:" one-way or two-way communication?
« Reply #5 on: December 18, 2010, 12:07:51 PM »
Quote from: SRD
Telepathic Speech (Ex)

If the owner is 5th level or higher, the psicrystal can communicate telepathically with any creature that has a language and is within 30 feet of the psicrystal, while the psicrystal is also within 1 mile of the owner.

Quote from: SRD

Seems obvious to me that it's a "limited form of telepathy" but works nonetheless.
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Kajhera

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Re: Psicrystals and "Telepathic Speech:" one-way or two-way communication?
« Reply #6 on: December 18, 2010, 12:20:15 PM »
Mmkay, I'll attempt to use it that way in the future, then. It's just never really come up before.  :)

PhaedrusXY

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Re: Psicrystals and "Telepathic Speech:" one-way or two-way communication?
« Reply #7 on: December 19, 2010, 12:00:45 AM »
I don't think it's actually obvious that even full-blown telepathy lets the creatures reply, unless they themselves also have telepathy. I interpret it that way as a DM (that they can reply), but nothing actually specifically stands out as unambiguously declaring that in the description, IMO. So I could see why a DM would rule the other way.
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nijineko

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Re: Psicrystals and "Telepathic Speech:" one-way or two-way communication?
« Reply #8 on: December 19, 2010, 03:50:26 AM »
many telepathic creatures are able to pluck basic communication type surface thoughts out of any being that they are attempting to communicate with. while this concept may not carry over into d&d rules, it is a very common one.
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Shiki

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Re: Psicrystals and "Telepathic Speech:" one-way or two-way communication?
« Reply #9 on: December 19, 2010, 04:43:20 AM »
I guess it does not explicitly say in the first sentence that the person you are communicating with can reply, though the second one implies it, kind of. Conversations are hardly "one way" usually.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2010, 05:06:37 AM by Shiki »
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Saeomon

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Re: Psicrystals and "Telepathic Speech:" one-way or two-way communication?
« Reply #10 on: December 19, 2010, 05:14:16 AM »
Based off of the responses I've received, DMs do interpret the ability in many different ways.

I don't think it's actually obvious that even full-blown telepathy lets the creatures reply, unless they themselves also have telepathy. I interpret it that way as a DM (that they can reply), but nothing actually specifically stands out as unambiguously declaring that in the description, IMO. So I could see why a DM would rule the other way.

This is exactly why I decided her ruling was fair, if far narrower than I'd have ruled were I running the game.

PhaedrusXY

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Re: Psicrystals and "Telepathic Speech:" one-way or two-way communication?
« Reply #11 on: December 19, 2010, 08:05:37 PM »
I guess it does not explicitly say in the first sentence that the person you are communicating with can reply, though the second one implies it, kind of. Conversations are hardly "one way" usually.
I agree, and rule it that way personally, but I don't think it is so iron-clad that I couldn't see someone interpreting it the other way.
[spoiler]
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Sounds like the makings of a gay porn film.
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nijineko

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Re: Psicrystals and "Telepathic Speech:" one-way or two-way communication?
« Reply #12 on: December 22, 2010, 05:28:39 AM »
she's definitely within 'fair ruling' clause. i would have ruled that anyone trying to communicate back mentally would be able to converse, but it would likely be a requires concentration standard action for non psionic types and a (maybe) swift action for psionic types.
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ShriekingDrake

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Re: Psicrystals and "Telepathic Speech:" one-way or two-way communication?
« Reply #13 on: December 23, 2010, 01:09:47 AM »
I'll note that the srd, when talking about telepathy acknowledges a conversation.  I make this point only to say that at least some of the time telepathy means two-way communication.  While this may not be the case with psicrystals, it certainly can be in other circumstances, RAW.