Author Topic: Plz Evaluate these Builds  (Read 1604 times)

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geniussavant

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Plz Evaluate these Builds
« on: December 11, 2010, 06:21:58 PM »
Each of the builds was based on a concept for the ultimate party, all are gestalt, and use all WotC books. I would like to keep both the concepts the same and races almost have to stay the same, including the massive racial hd+La of The Heavy. They are designed for a campaign were pure spell casters are not in existence(ex no wizards, druids, sorcerers. clerics, and the like). I would like suggestions as to how to improve upon their overall effectiveness as a party

The Leader
[spoiler]Human w/ Devil Bloodline
Factotum 20//Savage Bard 3+ Fighter 2+ Heartfire Fanner 5+ War Chanter 10
1.Skill Focus: Perform[Oratory(Command)], Negotiator, Font of Inspiration(f:Shaky), Font of Inspiration(f:Inattentive)
2.Dodge(DB)
3.Master of Poisons
4.Combat Expertise(F)
5.Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Locking Garrote(F)
6.Dragonfire Inspiration
9.Weapon Focus(Locking Garrote)
12.Font of Inspiration
13.Alertness(DB)
15.Font of Inspiration
18.Font of Inspiration[/spoiler]

Almost everything he does personally is based off int, and most of his buffs are cha based. Designed to be the ultimate 5th wheel, he uses dragonfire inspiration and heartfire fanner to buff the entire party. He can also step into any of the 4 party rolls for short periods of time, and can also act as a general skill monkey and get rid of any traps. He can also use a locking garrote to assassinate or take an enemy out of the battle for good.


The Heavy
[spoiler]Half-Minotaur Hunched Giant(Maur) Stoneboned Mineral Warrior (Stoneboned and Mineral Warrior were acquired after the first LA was bought off [ELC 18])

Racial HD 12 + LA 8(It should be 9, but the Stoneboned and Mineral Warrior template were added after the first LA was bought off, at 18) // Barbarian 5 + Fighter 2 + Frenzied Berserker 10 + Fist of the Forest 3

1. Power Attack, Cleave (f:Shaky),  Destructive Rage(f:Vulnerable)
3.  Instantaneous Rage
6. Intimidating Rage, Improved Bull Rush (F)
7. Shock Trooper(F)
9. Imperious Command
12. Improved Unarmed Strike
15. Great Fortitude
18. Large and in Charge[/spoiler]

Designed to strike fear into all comers, he wades into melee and drops anything that gets too close without being dropped himself. (I need a way to keep him from killing the party after he drops everyone else.)



The Sniper
[spoiler]Warlock 7+ Hellfire Warlock 3+ Legacy Champion 10//Rogue(fighter feat variant) 1+  Psychic Warrior 1+ Scout 1 Psychic Warrior 1(Psychic Warrior level 2)+ Scout 3(scout levels 2-4)+ Ranger 1+ Binder 1+ Ranger 11(levels 2-12)
muckdweller
1.Point Blank Shot, Mounted Combat(R), Precise Shot(f:Noncombative), Mounted Archery(f:Vulnerable), Weapon Finesse(B)
2.Psionic Shot(PW)
3.Ride-By-Attack
4.Psychic Meditation(PW)
6.Least Legacy
9.Swift Hunter
12.Greater Psionic Shot
15.Improved Critical
18.Improved Precise Shot[/spoiler]

Designed to take out enemies after they have been softened up, he uses Eldritch Blast 5d6+Hellfire Blast 22d6+Greater Psionic Shot 4d6+Skirmish +4d6=35d6 for =~=122.5 damage per round, every round infinitely, and uses Binder to bind Naberius for fast ability healing 1 to negate Con damage from Hellfire Warlock. He rides on the back of The Heavy for mobility. Skirmish ruled to work while mounted.
(This is the build I think is the weakest, as he is supposed to be able to drop an enemy in a single ranged shot, and yet he only does an average of 123 damage a round.)


The Artillery
[spoiler]muckdweller
Dragonfire Adept 20//Dragon Shaman 20

1. Entangling Exhalation, Power Surge(f:Noncombative), Clinging Breath(f:Vulnerable)
3. Lingering Breath
6. Recover Breath
9. Quicken Spell-like Ability
12. Rapid Breath
15. Double Draconic Aura
18. Mounted Combat
[/spoiler]
Designed to provide battle field control and to soften up enemies for both The Heavy and The Sniper, he uses dragonfire adept breath to control the enemy and dragon shaman auras to keep the party at the top of their game. He rides alongside The Sniper on top of The Heavy for mobility.

« Last Edit: December 11, 2010, 06:32:44 PM by geniussavant »
[spoiler]
I see that you want to solve problems. Not problems like, "What is beauty?," because that would fall within the purview of your conundrums of 'philosophy'. You want to solve practical problems. F'r instance, how are you gonna stop some big, mean Mother Hubbard from tearing you a structurally superfluous new behind? The answer: Use a gun. And if that don't work? Use more gun.
And if that fails try this


 
[/spoiler]

X-Codes

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Re: Plz Evaluate these Builds
« Reply #1 on: December 11, 2010, 07:39:18 PM »
Leader: Solid character.  I'd rather see 2x more Font of Inspiration instead of Proficiency/Focus with the Locking Garrote.  If memory serves, a regular garrote is more than satisfactory for most needs, and since they make a special attack roll it's not really necessary to even obtain proficiency to use them well.

Heavy: Shit Will save.  Absolutely needs Steadfast Determination, and really should have a better base Will save, too.  Fighter really isn't giving you anything that Overwhelming Assault Monk won't.  Those two changes will radically improve your Will save.

Sniper: Yes, it is the weakest.  EB isn't something you try to do damage with, it's something you use when you've got nothing better to do.  Warlocks have tons of Battlefield Control options available, and should use them in preference to EB.

Artillery: Honestly, calling this Artillery is silly.  For this one, I think I'd actually prefer some manner of small Anthropomorphic animal for a race.  Take Dragon Shaman on one side for it's general benefits, and boost it's healing abilities with Stigmata.  In a low-magic game, don't rely on finding those wands of Lesser Vigor people love so much.  For the other side, consider the weaknesses of the Dragon Shaman class: a skill money with low skill points, a front-liner with medium BAB, a support character with few feats to augment it's abilities.  Pair it with something that has more skill points, full BAB, and is relatively feat-intensive to use properly.  Warblade, Barbarian, and Ranger all come to mind.  Given that you don't have any strong ranged attackers, Ranger might be preferable.  Combine with Scout for Swift Hunting goodness.

geniussavant

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Re: Plz Evaluate these Builds
« Reply #2 on: December 11, 2010, 09:10:34 PM »
Leader: I have to have weapon focus as a perquisite for war chanter, and I couldn't think of anything better to do with the fighter bonus feat then weapon proficiency. suggestions?

Heavy: OwA Monk looks good here's what I came up with, stedfast determination too

Race 20// Overwhelming Attack monk 2 + Barbarian 5 + Frenzied Berserker 10 + Fist of the Forest 3

1. Endurance, Power Attack(M), Cleave (f:Shaky),  Destructive Rage(f:Vulnerable)
2. Improved Bull Rush (M)
3.  Instantaneous Rage
6. Intimidating Rage
9. Imperious Command
12. Iron Will
15. Great Fortitude
18. Steadfast Determination

I'd like to get steadfast determination sooner, but I don't see how I can.

Sniper: I can deviate from warlock(it was just for unlimited ranged attacks, maybe using an infinite quiver would be better), but his main purpose will be to do massive damage at range, maybe an archer with swift hunter and sneak attack, I'm really not sure how to do massive at range amounts of damage...

Artillery: Your right the name isn't very fitting, he should be called something like the Controller, as his job is to lock the battle field down long enough for the rest of the party to mop the floor with the NPC's & monsters. Dropping dragon shaman for something else would fit the concept better. What are the real drawbacks of Dragonfire Adept?

Edit: fix feats, he took IUS twice... I replaced it with Iron will
« Last Edit: December 11, 2010, 10:50:03 PM by geniussavant »
[spoiler]
I see that you want to solve problems. Not problems like, "What is beauty?," because that would fall within the purview of your conundrums of 'philosophy'. You want to solve practical problems. F'r instance, how are you gonna stop some big, mean Mother Hubbard from tearing you a structurally superfluous new behind? The answer: Use a gun. And if that don't work? Use more gun.
And if that fails try this


 
[/spoiler]

X-Codes

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Re: Plz Evaluate these Builds
« Reply #3 on: December 11, 2010, 09:19:14 PM »
DFA and Warlock are both very similar.  If there's a difference, it's that DFA is a *little* more Control oriented while Warlock is a *little* more damage oriented.  Dragon Shaman, on the other hand, easily has the best innate healing abilities out of any of the non-casters, and will be valuable for that, especially if you are unable to count on grabbing wands of whatever spell you like (sounds to me like that will be an issue).

Maybe instead of Warlock you could use DFA, and then match it up with something to help it's ability to lockdown a battlefield.  Then, on the other character, you'd have Dragon Shaman//Swift Hunter for sniper abilities and overall support.

geniussavant

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Re: Plz Evaluate these Builds
« Reply #4 on: December 11, 2010, 09:37:20 PM »
Sniper: How about something like this?
Dragon Shaman20//Fighter1+  Psychic Warrior 1+ Scout 1 + Psychic Warrior 1(Psychic Warrior level 2)+ Scout 3(scout levels 2-4)+ Ranger 13(Champion of the Wild variant)
muckdweller
1.Point Blank Shot, Mounted Combat(F), Precise Shot(f:Noncombative), Mounted Archery(f:Vulnerable), Weapon Finesse(B)
2.Psionic Shot(PW)
3.Ride-By-Attack
4.Psychic Meditation(PW)
6.Greater Psionic Shot
9.Swift Hunter, Rapid Shot(R)
11. Ranged Pin(CotW)
12. Weapon Focus: long bow
13. Manyshot(R)
15. Greater Manyshot, Improved Rapid Shot(CotW)
18.Dead Eye, Improved Precise Shot(R), Ranged Sunder(CotW)

I had to sacrifice double draconic aura for weapon focus so he could take Dead Eye, but I think it is worth it, because with a base 18 in dex, he would have 18+6(muckdweller)+5(levels)+5(tome)+4(magic Item)=38(a bonus of 14 damage to each attack)

Artillery(from now on the Controller): Remove Dragon shaman, and replace with something that has a good reflex same and better that d8 HD, any suggestions for a class?
Edit: Controller: Maybe Scout for reflex and skirmish to breath weapon
« Last Edit: December 11, 2010, 10:46:19 PM by geniussavant »
[spoiler]
I see that you want to solve problems. Not problems like, "What is beauty?," because that would fall within the purview of your conundrums of 'philosophy'. You want to solve practical problems. F'r instance, how are you gonna stop some big, mean Mother Hubbard from tearing you a structurally superfluous new behind? The answer: Use a gun. And if that don't work? Use more gun.
And if that fails try this


 
[/spoiler]

geniussavant

  • Bi-Curious George
  • ****
  • Posts: 402
Re: Plz Evaluate these Builds
« Reply #5 on: December 13, 2010, 07:33:56 PM »
Does anyone have any suggestions for a fighter feat to replace the weapon proficiency feat the Leader has currently, or a better feat progression/build for the sniper, or a second half of the Dragonfire adept who is the controller?
[spoiler]
I see that you want to solve problems. Not problems like, "What is beauty?," because that would fall within the purview of your conundrums of 'philosophy'. You want to solve practical problems. F'r instance, how are you gonna stop some big, mean Mother Hubbard from tearing you a structurally superfluous new behind? The answer: Use a gun. And if that don't work? Use more gun.
And if that fails try this


 
[/spoiler]