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The Thinktank => Min/Max It! => You Break It, You Buy It => : nijineko September 26, 2010, 09:01:33 PM

: beat infinite dc balance checks at level one with phb rules only....
: nijineko September 26, 2010, 09:01:33 PM
*edited in response to replies*


i noticed a couple of interesting phrasings in some slightly related rules (all movement related, anyway)

abusing the rules as written allows for the exploit.

due to odd phrasing in the 3.5 phb any character can take a 5' movement action (not a 5' step) in any direction, even diagonally, no matter the amount of penalty for doing so. since not mentioned otherwise, the movement could technically be up.


the relevant quotes:

in the phb, under special movement rules is the following:
Minimum Movement: Despite penalties to movement, you can
take a full-round action to move 5 feet (1 square) in any direction,
even diagonally
. (This rule doesn’t allow you to move through im-
passable terrain or to move when all movement is prohibited, such
as while paralyzed.) Such movement provokes attacks of opportu-
nity as normal (despite the distance covered, this move isn’t a 5-foot
step).

also in the phb, from the jump skill:
Action: None. A Jump check is included in your movement, so it
is part of a move action. If you run out of movement mid-jump, your
next action (either on this turn or, if necessary, on your next turn)
must be a move action to complete the jump.


(emphasis mine.)

here are the same rules from the d20srd:

Hampered Movement
Difficult terrain, obstacles, or poor visibility can hamper movement. When movement is hampered, each square moved into usually counts as two squares, effectively reducing the distance that a character can cover in a move.

If more than one condition applies, multiply together all additional costs that apply. (This is a specific exception to the normal rule for doubling)

In some situations, your movement may be so hampered that you don’t have sufficient speed even to move 5 feet (1 square). In such a case, you may use a full-round action to move 5 feet (1 square) in any direction, even diagonally. Even though this looks like a 5-foot step, it’s not, and thus it provokes attacks of opportunity normally. (You can’t take advantage of this rule to move through impassable terrain or to move when all movement is prohibited to you.)

You can’t run or charge through any square that would hamper your movement. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/movement.htm#tacticalMovement)

Action
None. A Jump check is included in your movement, so it is part of a move action. If you run out of movement mid-jump, your next action (either on this turn or, if necessary, on your next turn) must be a move action to complete the jump.

(emphasis mine.)

the srd wording is less supportive of the concept, but one could argue technicality. in effect, if you style your movement upward (or diagonally upward) as a jump, and then use the rule of "moving five feet in any direction no matter the dc", and the rule of "must take a move action if you haven't finished your jump" you could claim to be able to jump across unlikely distances. in slow motion.

this also applies to any movement related action, so one can also apply it to balance checks:

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/balance.htm (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/balance.htm)

and just for laughs, here are some epic level jump dc's:
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/skills.htm#balance (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/skills.htm#balance)

(not to mention any other movement related actions... swim or climb checks anyone?

intended as a fun thought exercise, none of my dm's would allow such a thing, and i would likely be dice'd to death by the rest of the party were i to suggest such a thing.



though you might be able to successfully use this rule exploit on balance checks if you only move 5' per round at low levels. that might be how low level thieves manage second story work.

=D
: Re: beat infinite dc jump checks at level one with phb rules only....
: The_Mad_Linguist September 26, 2010, 09:14:31 PM
Yeah, but there isn't any rule that says you don't fall as normal.  So you end up stuck in an endless loop, unable to act, forever.

In retrospect, much like Keanu Reeves.
: Re: beat infinite dc jump checks at level one with phb rules only....
: Bauglir September 26, 2010, 10:48:46 PM
Yeah, but there isn't any rule that says you don't fall as normal.  So you end up stuck in an endless loop, unable to act, forever.

In retrospect, much like Keanu Reeves.

I'm sigging that.
: Re: beat infinite dc jump checks at level one with phb rules only....
: nijineko September 29, 2010, 03:46:10 AM
i later noticed that since it is a full-round action, not a 1 round action, that you would indeed fall after your turn is over and the next in line begins.

however, handy for making insane balance, swim, and climb checks, if one doesn't mind moving so slowly, or provoking aoo's.
: Re: beat infinite dc jump checks at level one with phb rules only....
: awaken DM golem October 08, 2010, 06:24:05 PM
Avatar of the Omniscificer ?!
: Re: beat infinite dc jump checks at level one with phb rules only....
: nijineko October 09, 2010, 03:41:31 PM
so maybe i should change the title to be "beat infinite balance checks". ^^