Author Topic: Can Pun-Pun Ever Exist?  (Read 5965 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Bauglir

  • Man in Gorilla Suit
  • *****
  • Posts: 2346
  • TriOptimum
Re: Can Pun-Pun Ever Exist?
« Reply #20 on: November 03, 2010, 06:51:06 PM »
I suppose it depends on whether Pun-Pun decides to nab two favors from Sarrukhs, the first being to be granted the ability, "Immune to Deific Detection (Ex)", which makes Pun-Pun undetectable to a deity's ability to sense the future (and thus negates CoP's ability to deliver that information; if necessary, throwing Mind Blank on or something could also be done), and THEN Manipulate Form. Deities couldn't sense anything other than a creature vanishing from their futures, which would be unsettling but probably wouldn't trigger a Wizard's CoP. Properly worded, the deities might not be able to find Pun-Pun to annihilate him in any case.
So you end up stuck in an endless loop, unable to act, forever.

In retrospect, much like Keanu Reeves.

awaken DM golem

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 3294
  • PAO'd my Avatar
Re: Can Pun-Pun Ever Exist?
« Reply #21 on: November 03, 2010, 09:17:07 PM »
hmm ... well if Pun pun get "adjusted" in a way that the Deities would freak out about ...
I think it depends on where he is, and how much power he's already amassed.

Go to Far Realms first, get Manipulate Form 2nd, still not doing anything dangerous.
Of course the Unconscious time is a danger point, but not really in the Far Realms.

Suzerain

  • Bi-Curious George
  • ****
  • Posts: 523
  • is on extended leave
Re: Can Pun-Pun Ever Exist?
« Reply #22 on: November 03, 2010, 10:18:06 PM »
Well I think the "Pun-Pun plugged into J Random Setting" thing won't work.

If gods were as powerful as to forsee Pun-Pun, then one of them would be sure to create the Sarrukh race in the first place and make himself Pun-Pun. Any time any god detects Pun-Pun on his "future radar", Pun-Pun will be created (one way or another).

If they are not that powerful, then they are probably screwed. Pun-Pun works in (I think) 4 rounds "normal time".

Thus, I'm fairly certain that Pun-Pun exists as long as the Manipulate Form ability and "scaled ones of toril" exist in the same setting. Thus, time is pre-empted by Pun-Pun. Thus, he pre-empts any and all settings. Thus, everything that happens follows Pun-Puns will. If another Pun-Pun were to arise, it would be with Pun-Pun's consent.

In campaigns, I'd usually define Pun-Pun as something much larger than the entire setting. If each setting is something on the scale of a meteoroid to a planet, Pun-Pun is on the scale of the universe. Thus, for most intents and purposes, Pun-Pun is irrelevant to the setting. Which tends to be the case in most games that are actually played. I'm aware that Phaedrus is playing "Pun-Pun" (i.e. his interpretation of Pun-Pun) in a campaign right now, though.

Prime32

  • Administrator
  • Organ Grinder
  • *
  • Posts: 7534
  • Modding since 03/12/10
Re: Can Pun-Pun Ever Exist?
« Reply #23 on: November 04, 2010, 09:51:47 AM »
I'm aware that Phaedrus is playing "Pun-Pun" (i.e. his interpretation of Pun-Pun) in a campaign right now, though.
I would like to point out that Pun-Pun is the villain of the campaign, not a PC.
My work
The tier system in a nutshell:
[spoiler]Tier 6: A cartographer.
Tier 5: An expert cartographer or a decent marksman.
Tier 4: An expert marksman.
Tier 3: An expert marksman, cartographer and chef who can tie strong knots and is trained in hostage negotiation or a marksman so good he can shoot down every bullet fired by a minigun while armed with a rusted single-shot pistol that veers to the left.
Tier 2: Someone with teleportation, mind control, time manipulation, intangibility, the ability to turn into an exact duplicate of anything, or the ability to see into the future with perfect accuracy.
Tier 1: Someone with teleportation, mind control, time manipulation, intangibility, the ability to turn into an exact duplicate of anything and the ability to see into the future with perfect accuracy.[/spoiler]

Suzerain

  • Bi-Curious George
  • ****
  • Posts: 523
  • is on extended leave
Re: Can Pun-Pun Ever Exist?
« Reply #24 on: November 04, 2010, 10:11:57 AM »
I'm aware that Phaedrus is playing "Pun-Pun" (i.e. his interpretation of Pun-Pun) in a campaign right now, though.
I would like to point out that Pun-Pun is the villain of the campaign, not a PC.

Well, yes. My point was that it's actually a campaign where Pun-Pun is featured in some major way. "The Fall of Pun-Pun" kind of indicates what the campaign is about ;)

PhaedrusXY

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 8022
  • Advanced Spambot
Re: Can Pun-Pun Ever Exist?
« Reply #25 on: November 04, 2010, 11:50:48 AM »
I'm aware that Phaedrus is playing "Pun-Pun" (i.e. his interpretation of Pun-Pun) in a campaign right now, though.
I would like to point out that Pun-Pun is the villain of the campaign, not a PC.

Well, yes. My point was that it's actually a campaign where Pun-Pun is featured in some major way. "The Fall of Pun-Pun" kind of indicates what the campaign is about ;)
It is possible to interpret Pun-Pun's capabilities and ascension in many different ways. I have implemented a few house rules and interpretations which act to limit his power a bit, and which could also act to limit the ability of deities to detect and prevent his ascension before it occurred. Some of these might be known to the PCs, but some aren't yet. So I won't go into the details here... Of course if the PCs tried to take him on directly, they'd get pimp-slapped like that ho' Mystra did. ;)
[spoiler]
A couple of water benders, a dike, a flaming arrow, and a few barrels of blasting jelly?

Sounds like the makings of a gay porn film.
...thanks
[/spoiler]

Bozwevial

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 4497
  • Developing a relaxed attitude to danger.
Re: Can Pun-Pun Ever Exist?
« Reply #26 on: November 04, 2010, 02:46:29 PM »
I'm aware that Phaedrus is playing "Pun-Pun" (i.e. his interpretation of Pun-Pun) in a campaign right now, though.
I would like to point out that Pun-Pun is the villain of the campaign, not a PC.

Well, yes. My point was that it's actually a campaign where Pun-Pun is featured in some major way. "The Fall of Pun-Pun" kind of indicates what the campaign is about ;)
It is possible to interpret Pun-Pun's capabilities and ascension in many different ways. I have implemented a few house rules and interpretations which act to limit his power a bit, and which could also act to limit the ability of deities to detect and prevent his ascension before it occurred. Some of these might be known to the PCs, but some aren't yet. So I won't go into the details here... Of course if the PCs tried to take him on directly, they'd get pimp-slapped like that ho' Mystra did. ;)
Why do I get the feeling that we're going to get to the end of the campaign and then just die horribly because Pun-Pun was just fucking with us the whole time? :P

PhaedrusXY

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 8022
  • Advanced Spambot
Re: Can Pun-Pun Ever Exist?
« Reply #27 on: November 04, 2010, 05:34:17 PM »
I'm aware that Phaedrus is playing "Pun-Pun" (i.e. his interpretation of Pun-Pun) in a campaign right now, though.
I would like to point out that Pun-Pun is the villain of the campaign, not a PC.

Well, yes. My point was that it's actually a campaign where Pun-Pun is featured in some major way. "The Fall of Pun-Pun" kind of indicates what the campaign is about ;)
It is possible to interpret Pun-Pun's capabilities and ascension in many different ways. I have implemented a few house rules and interpretations which act to limit his power a bit, and which could also act to limit the ability of deities to detect and prevent his ascension before it occurred. Some of these might be known to the PCs, but some aren't yet. So I won't go into the details here... Of course if the PCs tried to take him on directly, they'd get pimp-slapped like that ho' Mystra did. ;)
Why do I get the feeling that we're going to get to the end of the campaign and then just die horribly because Pun-Pun was just fucking with us the whole time? :P
That sounds like an interesting plot twist. I'll be sure to consider it.  :P
[spoiler]
A couple of water benders, a dike, a flaming arrow, and a few barrels of blasting jelly?

Sounds like the makings of a gay porn film.
...thanks
[/spoiler]

Bozwevial

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 4497
  • Developing a relaxed attitude to danger.
Re: Can Pun-Pun Ever Exist?
« Reply #28 on: November 04, 2010, 05:53:30 PM »
I'm aware that Phaedrus is playing "Pun-Pun" (i.e. his interpretation of Pun-Pun) in a campaign right now, though.
I would like to point out that Pun-Pun is the villain of the campaign, not a PC.

Well, yes. My point was that it's actually a campaign where Pun-Pun is featured in some major way. "The Fall of Pun-Pun" kind of indicates what the campaign is about ;)
It is possible to interpret Pun-Pun's capabilities and ascension in many different ways. I have implemented a few house rules and interpretations which act to limit his power a bit, and which could also act to limit the ability of deities to detect and prevent his ascension before it occurred. Some of these might be known to the PCs, but some aren't yet. So I won't go into the details here... Of course if the PCs tried to take him on directly, they'd get pimp-slapped like that ho' Mystra did. ;)
Why do I get the feeling that we're going to get to the end of the campaign and then just die horribly because Pun-Pun was just fucking with us the whole time? :P
That sounds like an interesting plot twist. I'll be sure to consider it.  :P
It's not a plot twist if we've been expecting it the entire time. :P

awaken DM golem

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 3294
  • PAO'd my Avatar
Re: Can Pun-Pun Ever Exist?
« Reply #29 on: November 04, 2010, 07:16:03 PM »
HEATHENS ... HERETICS ...  :flame

You're no longer in the club (sulk/whimper).


Anyways ... the other assumption was that Pun-pun is totally neutral.
And therefore not a threat to anything.