Author Topic: How can we optimize Astral Construct?  (Read 6546 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Endarire

  • Man in Gorilla Suit
  • *****
  • Posts: 2171
    • Email
How can we optimize Astral Construct?
« on: October 18, 2010, 09:51:43 PM »
I know of the Mind's Eye Constructor PrC.  I know of Overchannel/Wild Surge.  I know of Durable Construct in Hyperconscious.

How then can we optimize astral construct assuming a Psion (Shaper)/Constructor?
Hood - My first answer to all your build questions; past, present, and future.

Speaking of which:
Don't even need TO for this.  Any decent Hood build, especially one with Celerity, one-rounds [Azathoth, the most powerful greater deity from d20 Cthulu].
Does it bug anyone else that we've reached the point where characters who can obliterate a greater deity in one round are considered "decent?"

Havok4

  • Man in Gorilla Suit
  • *****
  • Posts: 2144
  • It can only be attributable to human error.
Re: How can we optimize Astral Construct?
« Reply #1 on: October 18, 2010, 10:40:51 PM »
Overchannel  is good to get higher level constructs before they would normally be available.

The personal construct ACF is also good as it allows free quickened constructs.

Amechra

  • Man in Gorilla Suit
  • *****
  • Posts: 2328
  • Thread Necromancy a Specialty
Re: How can we optimize Astral Construct?
« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2010, 10:44:57 PM »
If you're allowing Dragon, there is always that feat Dual-Planes Summoning; it's 3.0, but should be easy to upgrade.

Whenever you summon a creature, you can spend half the amount of pp you would spend on an Astral Constructs to get menu options onto that Creature.
[spoiler]Fighter: "I can kill a guy in one turn."
Cleric: "I can kill a guy in half a turn."
Wizard: "I can kill a guy before my turn."
Bard: "I can get three idiots to kill guys for me."

On a strange note, would anyone be put out if we had a post about people or events we can spare a thought for, or if its within their creed, a prayer for? Just a random thought, but ... hells I wouldn't have known about either Archangels daughter or Saeomons niece if I didn't happen to be on these threads.
Sounds fine to me.
probably over on "Off-topic".
might want to put a little disclaimer in the first post.

This is the Min/Max board. We should be able to figure out a way to optimize the POWER OF PRAYER(TM) that doesn't involve "Pazuzu, Pazuzu, Pazuzu".
[/spoiler]

My final project for my film independent study course. It could do with a watching and critiquing

nijineko

  • King Kong
  • ****
  • Posts: 887
  • two strange quarks short of a graviton...
Re: How can we optimize Astral Construct?
« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2010, 11:21:11 PM »
boost construct feat, which you likely are already aware of due to erbauer, the prestige was upgraded to 3.5 in a web article after the mind's eye pdf was released, were you aware of that?

upgrading the various constructor related feats in mind's eye might be useful.

the usual gamut of pp and meta cost reduction... i'm fond of linked power with metapower and use astral construct for your secondary in the linked to benefit further from cost reduction.
arukibito ga michi wo erabu no ka, michi ga arukibito wo erabu no deshou ka?
Never game alone again!
KadoKado! Game for gifts!
The Ultimate Dice Rolling Engine

Phoenix00

  • That monkey with the orange ass cheeks
  • ****
  • Posts: 275
Re: How can we optimize Astral Construct?
« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2010, 12:18:45 AM »
If you're allowing Dragon, there is always that feat Dual-Planes Summoning; it's 3.0, but should be easy to upgrade.

Whenever you summon a creature, you can spend half the amount of pp you would spend on an Astral Constructs to get menu options onto that Creature.
If you allow Dragon the Psiotheurgist feats are awesome for an astral construct master.

Beguiler 1/Shaper 3/Cerbemancer 7/X 9
Feats
1   Precocious Apprentice
1   Spell Focus Conjuration
1   Psiotheurgist Conjuration / Metacreativity
So here are the levels you gain
6 ML at level 5
8 ML at level 6
10 ML at level 7
12 ML at level 8
14 ML at level 9
16 ML at level 10
18 ML at level 11
Throw in some more manifester level booster such as Overchannel+Talented or Practiced Spellcaster Beguiler and you can easily be casting 9th level constructs around level 9 or 10.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2010, 12:30:12 AM by Phoenix00 »

nijineko

  • King Kong
  • ****
  • Posts: 887
  • two strange quarks short of a graviton...
Re: How can we optimize Astral Construct?
« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2010, 03:18:15 AM »
your pp supply will be hard pressed to keep up, though.
arukibito ga michi wo erabu no ka, michi ga arukibito wo erabu no deshou ka?
Never game alone again!
KadoKado! Game for gifts!
The Ultimate Dice Rolling Engine

Phoenix00

  • That monkey with the orange ass cheeks
  • ****
  • Posts: 275
Re: How can we optimize Astral Construct?
« Reply #6 on: October 19, 2010, 01:28:06 PM »
your pp supply will be hard pressed to keep up, though.
Quick answer is yes, long answer is it doesn't matter.

So lets assume this build at level 10, 18 starting Int, your 2 levels ups go into Int, and you have a +4 item for a total of 22 Int
Human with 2 flaws
1   Precocious Apprentice
1   Spell Focus Conjuration
1   Psiotheurgist Conjuration / Metacreativity
3   Boost Construct
6   Linked Power
9   Metapower Linked Power
So at level 10 here is your stats
You have 7 levels of Beguiler with a caster level of 7
You have 9 levels of Psion with a manifester level of 9
Your Conjuration and Metacreativity Spells have a total manifester level of 16

Round 1 You manifested a Psionic Grease (1) with a Linked Power of Astral Construct (17)  for a total of 18pp which Metapower this become 16pp which is exactly your manifester level.
Round 2 While your enemies are struggling with recovering from the grease, the big hulking beat stick shows up.  He has a CR of 10, a Strength of 43, a Grapple of 38, and 3 Menu C Abilities (or 2 Menu C Abilities and 2 Menu B Abilities).  The Slam Attack of the Astral Construct has an attack of +28 and does 2d6+16 damage (before Menu Abilities are factored in).

Now doing this cost 16 pp well here are your pp and spells per day
Psion Base PP of level 9 is 72 pp, bonus PP is 27, thus a total of 99pp or 17% of your daily pp to summon a level 9 construct and gain a grease effect.
You also are a 7th level beguiler with spells of 6 1st 6 2nd 4 3rd, you also have 1 bonus 2nd due to precocious apprentice, and bonus spells of 2 1st 2 2nd 1 3rd.  For a total of 8 1st level spells, 9 2nd level spells, 5 3rd level spells.

Lycanthromancer

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 4003
    • Email
Re: How can we optimize Astral Construct?
« Reply #7 on: October 19, 2010, 06:46:28 PM »
Overchannel and Metapower/Linked Power, of course.

I also recommend asking your DM to see if metamagic rods work the same for metapsionics. Use Magic of Incarnum to open up your hands chakra using psionic open chakra and bind a lesser rod of Extend to it. 3/day increases your ML by 1.

Then either take the feat that allows you to bind your chakra to two different soulmelds/items and wear a pair of arcanist's gloves from the MIC (you can buy multiples if you want to swap them out) or have the gloves reslotted. If the DM says no, then just find a way to take the Magic Mantle to bypass the restricition altogether. Again, +1 to ML for a 1st level power.

Earth Power and a torc of power preservation, to reduce your pp cost by 2, so while you may not be able to use it to pump up your ML, you CAN use it to pump in 2 more pp into your manifestation.

I had a shaper 5/constructor 5 (using that feat that grants you bonus skill ranks, which I later psyref'd out, along with the psionic template (+1 ML, a few pp, and a power known for +1 LA) which I then bought off. I was throwing out 8th level constructs at level 10 with a swift/move/standard action, and I could've gotten that even higher if I'd seriously tried.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2010, 06:52:52 PM by Lycanthromancer »
[spoiler]Masculine men like masculine things. Masculine men are masculine. Therefore, liking masculine men is masculine.

I dare anyone to find a hole in that logic.
______________________________________
[/spoiler]I'm a writer. These are my stories. Some are even SFW! (Warning: Mostly Gay.)
My awesome poster collection. (Warning, some are NSFW.)
Agita's awesome poster collection.
[spoiler]
+1 Lycanthromancer
Which book is Lycanthromancer in?
Lyca ... is in the book. Yes he is.
 :D
shit.. concerning psionics optimization, lycan IS the book
[/spoiler]

awaken DM golem

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 3294
  • PAO'd my Avatar
Re: How can we optimize Astral Construct?
« Reply #8 on: October 19, 2010, 08:04:06 PM »
Constructor 5 gets my vote.

Throw in a race with a HD=CL (sp) ability, on the school / discipline link, like what Ph00 has above.

Lyca is awfully close to a recharge set-up (my standard pimping).


Believe it on not, the woeful Divine Mind has one little AC trick.
The expanded class update is keyed to an astral construct,
not one of those silly restricted forms from CPsi.
So you can stick a Boost Construct on it.
Big deal, the Divine Mind dies the next round anyway (sad).


EDIT - not worth bumping the thread,
but Ectopic Adept PrC doesn't do anything for the above builds.
Only if the CPsi nerf is in use, does it make a difference.
Even then, Constructor is better.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2010, 06:16:18 PM by awaken DM golem »

Endarire

  • Man in Gorilla Suit
  • *****
  • Posts: 2171
    • Email
Re: How can we optimize Astral Construct?
« Reply #9 on: October 23, 2010, 08:27:11 PM »
Where is this psionic template found?
Hood - My first answer to all your build questions; past, present, and future.

Speaking of which:
Don't even need TO for this.  Any decent Hood build, especially one with Celerity, one-rounds [Azathoth, the most powerful greater deity from d20 Cthulu].
Does it bug anyone else that we've reached the point where characters who can obliterate a greater deity in one round are considered "decent?"

Nanshork

  • Man in Gorilla Suit
  • *****
  • Posts: 2146
  • BOO!
    • Email
Re: How can we optimize Astral Construct?
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2010, 11:49:52 PM »
Hyperconcious has some good Astral Construct related crunch if you can use third party material.
My babies - A thread of random builds I've come up with over the years.
Notes to self

Azrael

  • Bi-Curious George
  • ****
  • Posts: 434
    • Email
Re: How can we optimize Astral Construct?
« Reply #11 on: October 23, 2010, 11:56:42 PM »
A 7th level Kalashtar shaper has enough money to buy 5 power-link shards. Combine this with a few boost constructs and you can manifest a level 9 astral construct; which has a CR 3 levels higher than your entire party.

Make it invisible, give it an AC of 41, PR, the ability to teleport, fly, shoot eye lasers, etc...not many things at 7th level can defeat that.

Lycanthromancer

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 4003
    • Email
Re: How can we optimize Astral Construct?
« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2010, 05:08:21 PM »
Where is this psionic template found?
Here.

A 7th level Kalashtar shaper has enough money to buy 5 power-link shards. Combine this with a few boost constructs and you can manifest a level 9 astral construct; which has a CR 3 levels higher than your entire party.

Make it invisible, give it an AC of 41, PR, the ability to teleport, fly, shoot eye lasers, etc...not many things at 7th level can defeat that.
I find that tailoring my constructs carefully means they're really tough to beat regardless. It's one of the better things vs summoning pre-built critters.
« Last Edit: October 24, 2010, 05:10:44 PM by Lycanthromancer »
[spoiler]Masculine men like masculine things. Masculine men are masculine. Therefore, liking masculine men is masculine.

I dare anyone to find a hole in that logic.
______________________________________
[/spoiler]I'm a writer. These are my stories. Some are even SFW! (Warning: Mostly Gay.)
My awesome poster collection. (Warning, some are NSFW.)
Agita's awesome poster collection.
[spoiler]
+1 Lycanthromancer
Which book is Lycanthromancer in?
Lyca ... is in the book. Yes he is.
 :D
shit.. concerning psionics optimization, lycan IS the book
[/spoiler]

lianightdemon

  • Barbary Macaque at the Rock of Gibraltar
  • ***
  • Posts: 196
Re: How can we optimize Astral Construct?
« Reply #13 on: October 24, 2010, 05:51:10 PM »

Lycanthromancer

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 4003
    • Email
Re: How can we optimize Astral Construct?
« Reply #14 on: October 24, 2010, 06:04:21 PM »
Actually this is the one he means
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Psionic_Variant_-_Natural_Psion_%283.5e_Template%29
...The heck? The link in my post isn't the one I r-click/copied/pasted to.

But yeah, that one.
[spoiler]Masculine men like masculine things. Masculine men are masculine. Therefore, liking masculine men is masculine.

I dare anyone to find a hole in that logic.
______________________________________
[/spoiler]I'm a writer. These are my stories. Some are even SFW! (Warning: Mostly Gay.)
My awesome poster collection. (Warning, some are NSFW.)
Agita's awesome poster collection.
[spoiler]
+1 Lycanthromancer
Which book is Lycanthromancer in?
Lyca ... is in the book. Yes he is.
 :D
shit.. concerning psionics optimization, lycan IS the book
[/spoiler]