Author Topic: PEACH: Sorcerer Progression in a World without Wizards  (Read 1234 times)

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Necrosnoop110

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PEACH: Sorcerer Progression in a World without Wizards
« on: October 04, 2010, 10:44:32 PM »
In my homebrewed campaign wizards and all classes that require crafting/written magic are no longer playable. So since the wizard is out, I thought I should boost the sorcerers spell progression to fill the gap. (this is mostly a core game) Please take a look and offer feedback.

Thanks,
Necro


RobbyPants

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Re: PEACH: Sorcerer Progression in a World without Wizards
« Reply #1 on: October 05, 2010, 01:36:27 AM »
I'm doing something similar, except all of my casters are like beguilers/dread necros/ect.  So, in general, I approve.
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wotmaniac

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Re: PEACH: Sorcerer Progression in a World without Wizards
« Reply #2 on: October 05, 2010, 01:59:23 AM »
if all you need to do is "fill the gap" of not having any prepared casters, then all you should need to do is add to the lists of spells known -- that's it. 
doing anything else just boosts raw power/durability; which doesn't seem to have anything to do with your thesis (nor do I believe it is necessary).

how much you add to it is largely a matter of your general campaign style:
- if wizards in your games end up basically getting every spell in the game in their spellbooks, then I can see maybe doubling spells known;
- if spellbooks are generally a little more restricted, then +50% spells known should do it ;
- if you're really strict/tight with spellbooks, then no change really needs to be made.  just allow the "extra spell" feat (or give it as a bonus feat every few levels). 
some other options might be:
- give bonus feats via wizard progression
- give either the "metamagic specialist" ACF -or- "rapid metamagic" feat for free
- have sorcerers cast similar to spirit shamans (where "spells known" can change daily, drawing from the entire spell list)


:twocents:
« Last Edit: October 05, 2010, 02:30:13 AM by wotmaniac »

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SiggyDevil

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Re: PEACH: Sorcerer Progression in a World without Wizards
« Reply #3 on: October 05, 2010, 03:52:27 AM »
Keep in mind the Tier ranking for Sorcerers. ANYTHING added will simply send them up farther from warriors and rogues.

Free cantrips are always a good idea. Even unlimited healing. Oooh 1 HP a round! Fully party healing out of combat! So borken. Borked.

Nice chart.

veekie

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Re: PEACH: Sorcerer Progression in a World without Wizards
« Reply #4 on: October 05, 2010, 10:45:34 AM »
Free cantrips is a good idea, but in the absence of prepared casters, there isn't generally a major need for swifter spell knowledge.
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Necrosnoop110

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Re: PEACH: Sorcerer Progression in a World without Wizards
« Reply #5 on: October 05, 2010, 05:44:04 PM »
Free cantrips is a good idea, but in the absence of prepared casters, there isn't generally a major need for swifter spell knowledge.
What about the idea that nearly all other casters and manifesters (cleric, druid, psion, etc.) would gain spell knowledge at a faster rate than the sorcerer? 

Necrosnoop110

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Re: PEACH: Sorcerer Progression in a World without Wizards
« Reply #6 on: October 05, 2010, 06:08:55 PM »
if all you need to do is "fill the gap" of not having any prepared casters, then all you should need to do is add to the lists of spells known -- that's it.  
doing anything else just boosts raw power/durability; which doesn't seem to have anything to do with your thesis (nor do I believe it is necessary).
Something like this:
« Last Edit: October 05, 2010, 06:10:43 PM by Necrosnoop110 »

veekie

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Re: PEACH: Sorcerer Progression in a World without Wizards
« Reply #7 on: October 05, 2010, 08:11:10 PM »
Yeah, note that sorcs are really no slouches, despite being a spell level later compared to wizards and having no class features to speak of. They're Tier 2 for a very good reason.
The mind transcends the body.
It's also a little cold because of that.
Please get it a blanket.

I wish I could read your mind,
I can barely read mine.

"Skynet begins to learn at a geometric rate. It becomes self-aware at 2:14 a.m. Eastern time, August 29th. At 2:15, it begins rolling up characters."

[spoiler]
"Just what do you think the moon up in the sky is? Everyone sees that big, round shiny thing and thinks there must be something round up there, right? That's just silly. The truth is much more awesome than that. You can almost never see the real Moon, and its appearance is death to humans. You can only see the Moon when it's reflected in things. And the things it reflects in, like water or glass, can all be broken, right? Since the moon you see in the sky is just being reflected in the heavens, if you tear open the heavens it's easy to break it~"
-Ibuki Suika, on overkill

To sumbolaion diakoneto moi, basilisk ouranionon.
Epigenentheto, apoleia keraune hos timeis pteirei.
Hekatonkatis kai khiliakis astrapsato.
Khiliarkhou Astrape!
[/spoiler]

There is no higher price than 'free'.

"I won't die. I've been ordered not to die."

oslecamo

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Re: PEACH: Sorcerer Progression in a World without Wizards
« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2010, 09:11:28 PM »
Yeah, note that sorcs are really no slouches, despite being a spell level later compared to wizards and having no class features to speak of.

Well by that view wizards don't have class features as well. They both cast spells from the same list, then the wizard can learn extra spells and gains some extra feats, and the sorceror casts spontaneously and has more spells per day instead of more feats. It doesn't exactly balance out, however point is that the wizard isn't gaining any award for original abilities.

However some people would say that spells from lv1 to 9, learning new ones every level, from a very large and powerfull list, is already very damn good.

RobbyPants

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Re: PEACH: Sorcerer Progression in a World without Wizards
« Reply #9 on: October 06, 2010, 01:19:03 PM »
Yes.  Yes it is.
My balancing 3.5 compendium
Elemental mage test game

Quotes
[spoiler]
Quote from: Cafiend
It is a shame stupidity isn't painful.
Quote from: StormKnight
Totally true.  Historians believe that most past civilizations would have endured for centuries longer if they had successfully determined Batman's alignment.
Quote from: Grand Theft Otto
Why are so many posts on the board the equivalent of " Dear Dr. Crotch, I keep punching myself in the crotch, and my groin hurts... what should I do? How can I make my groin stop hurting?"
Quote from: CryoSilver
I suggest carving "Don't be a dick" into him with a knife.  A dull, rusty knife.  A dull, rusty, bent, flaming knife.
Quote from: Seerow
Fluffy: It's over Steve! I've got the high ground!
Steve: You underestimate my power!
Fluffy: Don't try it, Steve!
Steve: *charges*
Fluffy: *three critical strikes*
Steve: ****
Quote from: claypigeons
I don't even stat out commoners. Commoner = corpse that just isn't a zombie. Yet.
Quote from: CryoSilver
When I think "Old Testament Boots of Peace" I think of a paladin curb-stomping an orc and screaming "Your death brings peace to this land!"
Quote from: Orville_Oaksong
Buy a small country. Or Pelor. Both are good investments.
[/spoiler]

SiggyDevil

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Re: PEACH: Sorcerer Progression in a World without Wizards
« Reply #10 on: October 06, 2010, 07:59:16 PM »
However some people would say that spells from lv1 to 9, learning new ones every level, from a very large and powerfull list, is already very damn good.

Experienced gamers and observant readers alike will note that. It's unfortunate that, yes, only some notice.

D&D is spells. Pure and simple.