Author Topic: [3.5]Improved monster classes: adapting creatures for player use-Taking Requests  (Read 330892 times)

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oslecamo

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Centaur overhaul done. The original one was kinda lacking since it pretty much was just large creature whitout any original ability. Let me know what you think!

Nice work on the Hellwasp Swarm, swarms are pretty cool and making one playable is just as cool, there just aren't that many playable swarms or support for players who want to play them.

One of the main goals of this project I must say, picking cool creatures that are however simply unplayable out of the bat, and making them work for a player.

The_Mad_Linguist

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Nice! I would love if my current DM would let me play that class, I mean who doesn't wantto play a swarm of Devil Bugs!
Urban druid, man.
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The_Mad_Linguist

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Nice! I would love if my current DM would let me play that class, I mean who doesn't wantto play a swarm of Devil Bugs!
Urban druid, man.

Perhaps you missed the "Devil" part. Can your druid crawl under people's skins to control them? :smirk
You can wildshape into a hellwasp swarm.
Linguist, Mad, Unique, none of these things am I
My custom class: The Priest of the Unseen Host
Planetouched Handbook
Want to improve your character?  Then die.

oslecamo

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Nice! I would love if my current DM would let me play that class, I mean who doesn't wantto play a swarm of Devil Bugs!
Urban druid, man.

Perhaps you missed the "Devil" part. Can your druid crawl under people's skins to control them? :smirk
You can wildshape into a hellwasp swarm.

No, urban druid can just wildshape into a vermin-based swarm, not every swarm under the sun and the moon. Hellwasp swarms are not vermins.  Just as hellhounds aren't animals.

Besides, you would still be playing a druid untill lv 12, wich kinda defeats the purpose of wanting of playing a swarm.

The_Mad_Linguist

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Nice! I would love if my current DM would let me play that class, I mean who doesn't wantto play a swarm of Devil Bugs!
Urban druid, man.

Perhaps you missed the "Devil" part. Can your druid crawl under people's skins to control them? :smirk
You can wildshape into a hellwasp swarm.

No, urban druid can just wildshape into a vermin-based swarm, not every swarm under the sun and the moon. Hellwasp swarms are not vermins.  Just as hellhounds aren't animals.

Besides, you would still be playing a druid untill lv 12, wich kinda defeats the purpose of wanting of playing a swarm.
Right.. now that I'm remembering properly, that was a character adapted from 3.0 who already had tainted wildshape...

although come to think of it, RAW I think druids can normally turn into a swarm of rats or crows once they hit the right size category.
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AleksanderTheGreat

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Pleasure Devil and Lilithu plox? :flutter
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Quote from: Solo
Optimizing is the antithesis of roleplaying because it takes focus away from the important parts of the game.
I'm inclined to disagree. People work hard on there characters, there personality, back ground, appearance, so forth. No one wants there character that they have invested time, energy, thought, and probably emotion in to be killed because they didn't take strong enough feats or skills or spells or what have you.

oslecamo

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Pleasure Devil and Lilithu plox? :flutter

Pleasure Devil is from Fiendish Codex II, but where the hell is Lilith from?(pun intended)

I know she's a consort of the Lord of the 7th layer of Hell, but I don't remember ever seeing her stats.

EDIT:And from the ecology section it seems like Pleasure devils are promoted Erinyes. Mind if I do it as a prc for the Erinyes?

AleksanderTheGreat

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Pleasure Devil is from Fiendish Codex II, but where the hell is Lilith from?(pun intended)
It's a demon from Fiendish Codex I. A greater succubus.
Quote
EDIT:And from the ecology section it seems like Pleasure devils are promoted Erinyes. Mind if I do it as a prc for the Erinyes?
:/ If you must. I'd rather see it as a separate monster class but do what is better in your opinion.
Quote from: Sephirothsword117
Quote from: Solo
Optimizing is the antithesis of roleplaying because it takes focus away from the important parts of the game.
I'm inclined to disagree. People work hard on there characters, there personality, back ground, appearance, so forth. No one wants there character that they have invested time, energy, thought, and probably emotion in to be killed because they didn't take strong enough feats or skills or spells or what have you.

Bloody Initiate

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Both are promotions of their base creature, the Pleasure Devil is a promoted Erinyes and a Lilitu is a promoted Succubus, although the Lilitu is more different from the Succubus than the Pleasure Devil is from the Erinyes. Makes sense for them to be prestige classes, just like "Assassin" isn't a base class, it's a specialized rogue.
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Prime32

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IIRC Lillitu corrupt peoples' faith, infiltrating cults etc.
My work
The tier system in a nutshell:
[spoiler]Tier 6: A cartographer.
Tier 5: An expert cartographer or a decent marksman.
Tier 4: An expert marksman.
Tier 3: An expert marksman, cartographer and chef who can tie strong knots and is trained in hostage negotiation or a marksman so good he can shoot down every bullet fired by a minigun while armed with a rusted single-shot pistol that veers to the left.
Tier 2: Someone with teleportation, mind control, time manipulation, intangibility, the ability to turn into an exact duplicate of anything, or the ability to see into the future with perfect accuracy.
Tier 1: Someone with teleportation, mind control, time manipulation, intangibility, the ability to turn into an exact duplicate of anything and the ability to see into the future with perfect accuracy.[/spoiler]

Bloody Initiate

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More like turning temples into cults, but yeah you remember correctly. They specialize in corrupting the "incorruptible," and Pleasure Devils are just the devil version of the same concept with a greater emphasis on sexuality than on the preferred targets of corruption.
I don't employ memes. Mass-produced ammunition, even from reputable manufacturers, tends to malfunction on occasion.

AleksanderTheGreat

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To be more accurate, Pleasure Devil is specialized in corrupting the more devoted servants of dieties (higher level paladins and clerics in particular).
Lilithu corrupts churches and temples.
Quote from: Sephirothsword117
Quote from: Solo
Optimizing is the antithesis of roleplaying because it takes focus away from the important parts of the game.
I'm inclined to disagree. People work hard on there characters, there personality, back ground, appearance, so forth. No one wants there character that they have invested time, energy, thought, and probably emotion in to be killed because they didn't take strong enough feats or skills or spells or what have you.

oslecamo

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To be more accurate, Pleasure Devil is specialized in corrupting the more devoted servants of dieties (higher level paladins and clerics in particular).
Lilithu corrupts churches and temples.

Wich are basically advanced paths of the basic succubbus and erinyes, wich are both supposed to be corruptors. That's why I wanted to make them prcs, so the first levels aren't "yet another low-medium level infernal corruptor".

Mind you, looking at her again, the Erinyes could use a spice up on the corruption deparment. Will give her a lift-up before taking on the bigger versions.

AleksanderTheGreat

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Erynies aren't corruptors. They're soldiers or scouts. Only the more seductive ones are promoted to something more then just cannon fodder.
And BTW. The picture of the erynies is in fact a picture of the pleasure devil (it's the exact same as in FC2, although she's not really depicted in her natural form) (I mean the picture you're using for the erynies monster class).
Quote from: Sephirothsword117
Quote from: Solo
Optimizing is the antithesis of roleplaying because it takes focus away from the important parts of the game.
I'm inclined to disagree. People work hard on there characters, there personality, back ground, appearance, so forth. No one wants there character that they have invested time, energy, thought, and probably emotion in to be killed because they didn't take strong enough feats or skills or spells or what have you.

oslecamo

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Erynies aren't corruptors. They're soldiers or scouts. Only the more seductive ones are promoted to something more then just cannon fodder.
From Fiendish Codex II pg 13:

Both harvester devils and erinyes are assigned the coveted task of recruiting mortals to active damnation through the signing of Faustian pacts.


Erinyes are direct descendants of fallen angels. They're much more than simple cannon fodder, specially because lesser devils cannot be promoted into an erinyes (unlike all other devil forms). They stand on a category of their own, and altough they do see more frontline combat than a succubus, they also work hard for seducing souls for the 9 Hells.

And BTW. The picture of the erynies is in fact a picture of the pleasure devil (it's the exact same as in FC2, although she's not really depicted in her natural form) (I mean the picture you're using for the erynies monster class).

Google Image Erinyes. Tell me what you see. :smirk

AleksanderTheGreat

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Quote
From Fiendish Codex II pg 13:

Both harvester devils and erinyes are assigned the coveted task of recruiting mortals to active damnation through the signing of Faustian pacts.


Erinyes are direct descendants of fallen angels. They're much more than simple cannon fodder, specially because lesser devils cannot be promoted into an erinyes (unlike all other devil forms). They stand on a category of their own, and altough they do see more frontline combat than a succubus, they also work hard for seducing souls for the 9 Hells.
Eh... I'm not saying that they can't be corruptors, they just aren't in default. They where warriors/corruptors in earlier editions (at least that's what I heard, I only played 3.5 so far), in 3 edition they where devolved into simple soldiers, but they tried to bring that "fluff" in FC2. That's why they created the pleasure devil. Notice that in MM they are described as scouts, servants and concubines of powerful devils. The "servant" part might be refering to the "corrupting" but it doesn't have to.

Quote
Google Image Erinyes. Tell me what you see.
I see lots of different pictures. They named a picture of a pleasure devil taken from FC2 as an erinyes. So what? I mean a pleasure devil IS theoreticly an erinyes. Check this out.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2011, 03:18:59 AM by AleksanderTheGreat »
Quote from: Sephirothsword117
Quote from: Solo
Optimizing is the antithesis of roleplaying because it takes focus away from the important parts of the game.
I'm inclined to disagree. People work hard on there characters, there personality, back ground, appearance, so forth. No one wants there character that they have invested time, energy, thought, and probably emotion in to be killed because they didn't take strong enough feats or skills or spells or what have you.

Prime32

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Again, I should point out that erinyes can be male.
My work
The tier system in a nutshell:
[spoiler]Tier 6: A cartographer.
Tier 5: An expert cartographer or a decent marksman.
Tier 4: An expert marksman.
Tier 3: An expert marksman, cartographer and chef who can tie strong knots and is trained in hostage negotiation or a marksman so good he can shoot down every bullet fired by a minigun while armed with a rusted single-shot pistol that veers to the left.
Tier 2: Someone with teleportation, mind control, time manipulation, intangibility, the ability to turn into an exact duplicate of anything, or the ability to see into the future with perfect accuracy.
Tier 1: Someone with teleportation, mind control, time manipulation, intangibility, the ability to turn into an exact duplicate of anything and the ability to see into the future with perfect accuracy.[/spoiler]

AleksanderTheGreat

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Again, I should point out that erinyes can be male.
Of course. That's how I see it to. I'm not sure how it actually is in canon but I don't care. In my games everything that's not explicitly stated as genderless has two genders. :)
Actually I've seen a male erinyes in some handbook. Exemplars of Evil perhabs?
Quote from: Sephirothsword117
Quote from: Solo
Optimizing is the antithesis of roleplaying because it takes focus away from the important parts of the game.
I'm inclined to disagree. People work hard on there characters, there personality, back ground, appearance, so forth. No one wants there character that they have invested time, energy, thought, and probably emotion in to be killed because they didn't take strong enough feats or skills or spells or what have you.

Bloody Initiate

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Again, I should point out that erinyes can be male.

Someone on the GitP forums recently made an Erinyes class and I started to make one in response. To emphasize the multiple gender possibilities I was writing all the class features with "his" instead of "her," etc.
I don't employ memes. Mass-produced ammunition, even from reputable manufacturers, tends to malfunction on occasion.