Author Topic: Umpteenth Person To Say, "I could do a better job than 3.5"  (Read 1288 times)

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Bauglir

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So, I've been planning to do a revision of D&D 3.5 for a while now, and I've only just recently buckled down and actually started writing it. I've got most of the character-building rules worked out (with luck, I should have a sample class, race, couple of feats, skills, leveling rules, etc. worked out by Monday, although a lot of the info is placeholder stuff until I get to things like conditions and stuff).

So I'm starting this thread for a couple of reasons. Most importantly, I want to know who (if anyone) would be interested in working with me on it. I'm kind of hoping to get a private board for this, but I don't want to go bug the BGs about that if I'm the only one interested (in a perfect world, I'd want to get it published under the OGL eventually, and as preposterously unlikely as that is, I want to keep the option open, which probably means not spewing all the information across the internet in an unofficial format during development).

Secondly, I want to put my design goals up here; what I'm looking for is a system that retains (and even expands) the variety of options, as well as the general feel, of D&D 3.5, while at the same time clearing up TO rule abuses, streamlining gameplay (without dumbing it down), evening the playing field between classes (get rid of "casters win at everything forever"), and generally fixing parts of the rules that don't make as much sense as they could.

A couple of the major ideas I've started to implement in order to make that happen:
1: Characters no longer level up like they do in D&D 3.5. This is the biggest change; each class has a number of tiers, each of which grants a new class feature or similar ability, and are most analogous to levels. When a campaign starts, the DM picks a tier for the characters to start at, and this sets a power level for the whole campaign, including most NPCs. Characters do not increase in tier very often; when it happens is essentially DM fiat, because increasing a tier is supposed to represent something like spending years meditating in the mountains, a giant personal epiphany, or a life-changing event like that. Within each tier, characters gain levels from gaining XP, but these only provide bonuses to statistics, or allow a character to learn a new spell, maneuver, or what have you. No radically new or more powerful abilities.
2: Feats are a much bigger part of character definition than before, but a character chooses fewer of them. A feat grants something like a full sneak attack progression based on character level, or similarly powerful abilities. Classes that grant bonus feats only do so when they grant a special use of that feat at the same level.
3: Characters don't become more powerful in all areas as they gain levels. Characters have to choose how to allocate bonuses to statistics like saves or hit points. Gaining a tier, however, does force some generalized advancement, but not nearly as much as gaining a level in D&D.
4: Class skills no longer exist; characters can choose to put ranks into any skill, and skills a character should be better at are determined by backgrounds similar to occupations in d20 modern, which now exist and grant certain bonuses.
5: Hit points and Wound points to clear up the confusion as to what taking damage actually means.

Planned changes also include simplified grapple rules (everybody does that), an expanded and simplified attack of opportunity system to give players something to do when it isn't their turn and make it easier to USE AoOs, tangible effects on characters from low health, and absolutely no recursive abilities.

I was planning on doing an expanded diplomacy system, but after a long (and loud) discussion with a friend about how roleplaying should be handled by the system, I've been convinced that the best way to go is to minimize mechanical handling of it, so look for something that boils down to a Diplomacy check that tells the player the level of eloquence to go for, and relies on DM judgment that factors in the roll as well as the actual roleplaying to determine success. Definitely nothing like, "I roll a Diplomacy check, and succeed, that dude will throw himself in the path of a charging orc for me", however.

Vague Planned Timeline:
1. Character Creation Rules, Part 1 - This is something to provide a framework for the rest of the game. What we need here is vague ideas of what these parts of the game can do, and maybe a few sample rules. When not specifically noted otherwise, assume all functions as in D&D. This will be corrected in the next step.
2. Gameplay Rules - Rules for combat, skill use, etc. Basically all the stuff you need to know in order to do the playing.
3. Character Creation Rules, Part 2 - This is where we start codifying exactly what characters can do, revise things from Part 1, and convert at least all the options from the PHB, as well as handle a replacement magic item system that isn't six kinds of broken with Christmas Tree Syndrome to boot.
4. Monster Rules - Now that we know what characters can do, we can create monsters that are appropriate challenges for them and figure out what sorts of abilities will shake things up. Also includes guidelines for making new monsters.
5. Setting Rules - Rules on environments, deities, special magic item creation rules, and other things that PCs aren't likely to be using, but aren't necessarily opponents either.
6. Accessory Rules - Epic games, Level Adjusted creatures, Variant rules, and other things that don't quite fit elsewhere.
7. Administrative Tasks - Set up an SRD-like Wiki, other stuff that isn't the actual game but is necessary for getting it out.

Anyway, if you're interested in helping, just leave a post here or send me a PM. If there's enough interest, I'll go pester the BGs about setting up a private board and that sort of thing. I'm interested in anyone with a history of homebrewing, TO, PO, fluff writing, artwork, and pretty much anything else that goes into a good tabletop game (pretty much any skill in any creative activity in the history of ever, even if it doesn't sound creative).
So you end up stuck in an endless loop, unable to act, forever.

In retrospect, much like Keanu Reeves.

archangel.arcanis

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Re: Umpteenth Person To Say, "I could do a better job than 3.5"
« Reply #1 on: June 25, 2010, 11:43:54 AM »
I'm interested in seeing more of what you have so far before i commit to the project. You may also want to speak to RobbyPants as he has worked on a rewrite of the rules intermittently as well.
Clerics and Druids are like the 4 and 2 in 42. Together they are the answer to the ultimate question in D&D.
Retire the character before the DM smacks you with the Table as the book will feel totally inadequate now.-Hazren

RobbyPants

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Re: Umpteenth Person To Say, "I could do a better job than 3.5"
« Reply #2 on: June 26, 2010, 10:38:46 AM »
Yeah, I'm in the middle of something myself right now, but I wanted to get it further along before posting it.  It's based off the the rebalancing project I worked on here a year-and-a-half ago (in my sig).

Although, I'm just trying to work on more of a patch for 3.5 rather than actually making a whole new edition.
My balancing 3.5 compendium
Elemental mage test game

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Bauglir

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Re: Umpteenth Person To Say, "I could do a better job than 3.5"
« Reply #3 on: June 28, 2010, 01:20:05 PM »
this is a general statistic that is the sum of base attack bonus, caster level, and similar statistics that describe a character's prowess in basic combat skills, and the actual mechanics need to be fleshed out better), and the skill uses the character's highest ability modifier. Use this skill to resolve unimportant combats; the highest roll wins (leaving the opponent unconscious, or dead if the opponent cannot be knocked out), and the combat lasts for a number of rounds equal to 10 minus the difference between the rolls, to a minimum of 1 round.

If your character would have training in an area not listed, feel free to invent a new skill, using existing skills as guidelines.

A skill check is 1d20+the character's ranks in the skill+the character's modifier in the skill's key ability+any miscellaneous modifiers. An ability check works just like a skill check, but no ranks are involved.

A character begins with 4 skill ranks, plus 1 rank per point of Intelligence modifier. The character may distribute these points however he likes, with the exception that a character cannot have more ranks in any skill than his tier.

A character also chooses a background at character creation. A background, among its other benefits, grants a +3 bonus to some skills associated with it. Ordinarily, a background will grant this benefit to 2 or 3 different skills.[/spoiler]


So you end up stuck in an endless loop, unable to act, forever.

In retrospect, much like Keanu Reeves.