Warning, Eager, and Quickrazor

[Pan-Fried Hamster]

This is a bit of a rules question, but I'm also trying to optimize my Initiative for Iajutsu Focus and general nuking purposes.

The MiC version of both of these enhancements specifies that a weapon must be held or wielded to gain the benefits.

A Quickrazor is at a -2 attack if wielded like a normal weapon, but you can draw or sheathe it as a free action.

I figured I could hold it as normal, then sheathe it as a free action on my first round of combat to benefit from Iajutsu Focus damage on my first strike (by immediately drawing it again on the first attack).

My DM's interpretation is that it should apply if my hand is free to use the razor (which is more permissive), but he also pointed out that this would be altering my Initiative modifier constantly during combat due to switching between having the weapon available and not (I frequently use a Guisarme, which I can hold in my offhand if I want to make razor attacks).

Does a character's place in the Initiative order change if an Eager or Warning weapon switches between being held and not?

I thought Init only mattered when rolled (Nerveskitter, for instance, only has a 1 round duration). The one thing I can find to support my DM's interpretation is a comment in the Bunko's Bargain Basement thread:
http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=350.msg247593#msg247593

Does anyone know where aforementioned FAQ ruling is and if it carried forward to 3.5? Similarly, does your place in the initiative order change if your DEX score drops through ability damage/drain?

The DM takes the position that changes to the modifier should change where you fall in the order. I'm on the side of changes to the modifier only mattering if, for some reason, you need to roll initiative again in a battle (or if you're re-rolling every round). Do I have a case, or are Warning/Eager weapons going to become a nightmare?

[Sinfire Titan]

There is a precedent for this: Warblades have a White Raven maneuver that resets their Init count to 20, regardless of what it was. The effects take place at the start of the next round.


In order to use the Quickrazor effectively, you should dual-wield them. When you stop attacking with your primary hand, don't sheathe the blade until your next turn begins (and unsheathe the off-hand razor as you do). Alternate between which hand is holding a razor each turn and your count will be unaffected (it will be boosted constantly).

[Pan-Fried Hamster]

...or put the enhancements on my polearm, I suppose. Which is ironic, because the Quickrazor fits the idea of Eager / Warning much better thematically. Still, thanks for the clarification!

[Rebel7284]

Nerveskitter/Shock and Awe seem to both indicate that initiative is only rolled once and stays locked unless modified by abilities or delaying.

[Widow]

I always thought a poison ring from dragom magazine 316 was useful for these enchantments.  It is a ring you wear on your hand with a needle that you can flip in or out.  It counts as a weapon, so enchant away.  There is no limit to the number of weapons you can have and pretty hard to disarm (or should I say dehand).

[Glutton]

It appears the check is only rolled once.

Initiative Checks

At the start of a battle, each combatant makes an initiative check. An initiative check is a Dexterity check. Each character applies his or her Dexterity modifier to the roll. Characters act in order, counting down from highest result to lowest. In every round that follows, the characters act in the same order (unless a character takes an action that results in his or her initiative changing

[Sinfire Titan]

It appears the check is only rolled once.

And there's the confirmation. Any action taken that alters your Init count alters when you act next turn (seeing as it can't speed up or slow down your actions, outside of readying or delaying).

[Endarire]

Moment of Alacrity (Diamond Mind6) gives +20 initiative, not init = 20.

[BowenSilverclaw]

Just wear a (Spiked) Gauntlet with those enhancements if you want to avoid the rules hassle

[Pan-Fried Hamster]

Yar. Gauntlet it may have to be, since I want more useful stuff on my main weapon.

I'm just surprised. I was always under the impression that initiative modifiers were irrelevant after you rolled it, so putting a weapon away wouldn't matter. Speaking of which, anyone know if that FAQ made it to 3.5? I really want to know who ruled that you needed to track changes to it. =P

[McPoyo]

There's a reference somewhere concerning ability score damage/drain/penalties about dexterity being lowered changing initiative position in one of the sage articles. Not core, or technically even an official stance, but it might be worth mentioning.

[Pan-Fried Hamster]

I guess my main issue with it, beyond "these enchantments make more sense on a weapon I actually use" is that it just seems like it's adding unnecessary complexity to what is already a complex game. If initiative round-by-round matters so much, re-roll it every round. If not, then apply whatever modifiers are present when it's rolled, then forget about them.

[McPoyo]

I've found it doesn't change initiative flow or complexity at all. You just diddle a little note with an arrow, or put it on dry erase and rewrite the number (I put order next to the name, so you just look for the next number in series instead of checking init numbers if nothing changes). I've played in games where DMs had magnets with player's names written on them, then just moved them around that way, or clothespins attached to the top of their screen at the relevant init number (like a ruler), so they just get shifted around.

[JaronK]

The obvious solution is to use Eager +1 Armor Spikes of Warning, and then enchant your quickrazor with more useful offensive enchantments like Blurstrike.

JaronK