Author Topic: critical failures  (Read 1859 times)

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Banaticus

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critical failures
« on: May 18, 2010, 12:17:42 AM »
Yes, in 3.5, a natural 1 on an attack roll is a miss.  But isn't there something, somewhere, about something else happening (GM's choice?), or have we been playing with an archaic rule that's a holdover of a previous edition?

wotmaniac

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Re: critical failures
« Reply #1 on: May 18, 2010, 01:08:46 AM »
#2.

but if it's working for you, then just go with it.

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Havok4

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Re: critical failures
« Reply #2 on: May 18, 2010, 01:13:26 AM »
There are no rules for critical failures in core DnD, but it is probably one of the most common houserules in existence. I personally do not like them as they nerf melee characters even more while not harming casters in the least.

Banaticus

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Re: critical failures
« Reply #3 on: May 18, 2010, 02:01:20 AM »
Unless you hold true that a natural 1 on a ranged spell is also a critical failure... but, yeah, there's no attack roll for a fireball.

veekie

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Re: critical failures
« Reply #4 on: May 18, 2010, 05:18:53 AM »
Well, it's one of the more common houserules, fun to have, in the right context, since critical failures can be a fount of spontaneous hilarity/drama.
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Hallack

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Re: critical failures
« Reply #5 on: May 18, 2010, 10:22:12 AM »
Well, it's one of the more common houserules, fun to have, in the right context, since critical failures can be a fount of spontaneous hilarity/drama.

In general I don't like it.  In a light hearted game they can be used for funny but in less comedic games they just suck.  If your players are wanting to play characters that... you know, are heroic, 5% chance to stab yourself in the foot no matter your competence just freakin sucks.

Took some time but finally convinced one of our DMs to stop using this stupid rule (yes, a hold over from previous editions) a year or so back.

We are now using the Crit/Fumble decks put out by Pathfinder in some of our games and I think they are a much better way of doing fumbles and maybe even crits. 

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RobbyPants

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Re: critical failures
« Reply #6 on: May 18, 2010, 10:25:51 AM »
If you're going to institute critical failures, at least mirror the critical hit rules: add in a confirmation roll.  So, if you roll a natural 1, then you roll another attack roll.  If the confirmation roll hits, then you simply miss on your attack.  If the confirmation roll misses, then you have a fumble (whatever that means in your rules).

It helps keep from punishing people with extra attacks so badly.  If they're competent melee types, then they shouldn't miss that confirmation roll as often.
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RealMarkP

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Re: critical failures
« Reply #7 on: May 19, 2010, 03:53:27 PM »
I have house rules for such things. Both critical failures and critical hits have a table where you roll a percentile dice to figure out the outcome. A critical hit requires confirmation while the critical fumbles require a reflex save to negate the effects. My Consolidated Rules have the tables on page 6 and 7. Take a look.

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Re: critical failures
« Reply #8 on: May 19, 2010, 04:15:53 PM »
I don't enforce fumbles. Player Characters make more attack rolls in their existence than any NPC I roll up (who has an average life expectancy of .4 sessions), and the enemies rarely need to worry about fumbling due to special attack options (like a breath weapon).

The only challenge it adds is to a noncaster who wants to be competent. The only things it adds to the game are threat increase and extra rolls, so it just sucks up more time and resources.


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veekie

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Re: critical failures
« Reply #9 on: May 19, 2010, 04:42:12 PM »
Well, the only fair kind of game to do these in is in a total switch to defense(so all attacks use attack rolls instead of saves), and of course, for the fumbles to be interesting, but not critically fatal, a mistake many fumble charts make(the consequence being completely out of proportion to the attack attempted).

Robby's confirmation roll idea adds a safeguard as well, though I'd preferred simply failing the required target by 10+, indicating gross incompetence from the start, and ensuring that all consequences are scaled to the attack/task attempted.
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