Author Topic: Dragon wildshape = 4th level sorcerer spells? Optimization help request.  (Read 1884 times)

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Propaganda

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If you (and your DM) buy the argument that spellcasting is an ex ability, it follows that if you wildshape into a young adult Steel Dragon (16 hd), you gain the abilities of a 9th level sorcerer.

1.  Am I understanding this correctly?

If so, then:
2. How might a druid best optimize their choices of up to 4th level wiz/sorcerer spells?  Are there spells that synergize particularly well with a druid's abilities?

KellKheraptis

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If you (and your DM) buy the argument that spellcasting is an ex ability, it follows that if you wildshape into a young adult Steel Dragon (16 hd), you gain the abilities of a 9th level sorcerer.

1.  Am I understanding this correctly?

If so, then:
2. How might a druid best optimize their choices of up to 4th level wiz/sorcerer spells?  Are there spells that synergize particularly well with a druid's abilities?

Extended Wraithstrike comes to mind immediately :)
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Suzerain

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Also, keep in mind that steel dragon has access to cleric spells.

Also, if you'd use Tome Dragon, you'd get 11th level casting (15HD). No clerical casting though. Instead, all divination/conjuration+knowledge domain as bonus spells known.

Surreal

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addendum question: as above, but stack on a loredrake kobold with the two rituals... what is your resultant casting?
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Echoes

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Technically, racial spellcasting should count as a natural ability, but yes, you should get it RAW. Now, it's in no way balanced or even remotely close to RAI, I'm sure, but that's beside the point.

As to Loredrake vs. racial spellcasting acquired via wild shape, I would rule that they overlap, much like in a gestalt. However, I'm pretty sure the rules are silent on this matter, again other than in cases such as gestalt.

As to spells, there are a few choice picks:

Celerity. Dear lord, celerity. If I could take exactly one 4th-level spell, that'd be it. The effect it has on combat is enormous. Against people without it, you win regardless of initiative, assuming you can negate flat-footedness (see below). Against people with it, it lets you compete rather than being overrun. Dimension door is also an excellent choice, since Druids are desperately lacking in instantaneous movement. The "end your turn" effect sucks, but depending on whether it applies to everyone or just the caster, share it with your animal companion as you celerity + dimension door within partial charge range of the enemy and let your pet dino rip him apart.

For lower-level spells, shivering touch + share spell + natural attacks = winsauce. Imagine a venomfire-ed fleshraker. Now imagine him doing 3d6 Dex damage in addition. Now do that again. Yeah, you win even harder than you did before.

Wraithstrike wrecks a lot of things that have high AC but low touch AC. Like Dragons. You know what else wrecks dragons? Shivering touch. See a pattern here?

For low-level utility, nerveskitter is extremely useful, both for initiative boosting and for negating flat-footedness. Remember, once you've acted, however briefly, you are no longer flat-footed.

For cleric spells, the clear winner is easy: divine power. Use bone talisman to qualify for Divine feats (because the spell is stupid), grab yourself a handy haversack full of nightsticks, and go to town with Persist/Extend/whatever.
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Propaganda

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Some thanks and another spell to add:

Suzerain- cleric spells?  Wow, nice catch!

Thanks KellKheraptis and especially to Echoes for the extensive and thoughtful reply.

I wanted to add Solo's suggestion (from the Druid Handbook where I initially made my request before creating my own topic):

wings of cover

... which has the special synergy in dragon form of covering not only you but also your allies.