Author Topic: Optimization Challenge: Completing a campaign in Godmode with no treassure.  (Read 11256 times)

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bearsarebrown

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Wizard. You don't need items, you don't need gear. You just cast shit.

What ECL of play are we talkin?

KellKheraptis

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Damn, this sounds like the local DM here who runs on Mondays.  We used to make super front loaded characters just for that reason :P

And to help out, possibly a party of VoP Druids?
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carnivore

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no BoeD allowed


why not use  Pixies  ;)

 :D

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The party will need to complete a campaign that stretches from level 1 to 21. No LA or flaws is allowed.

VoP is banned, as it is from BoED.

We recently tried to make a party of all druids, but he ruled against it for reasons unknown.

We prefer belt-fed characters to front loaders :P

Havok4

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Yes carnivore we know you love your pixies.

I would have to recommend a psion for your character as you need nothing at all, no special inks to scribe your spells, no expensive special materials to cast them, no armor and no weapons. You just use your mind to destroy your enemies. If you want to be more physically focused try psychic warrior which can fight using natural weapons very effectively.Psionics is also very good when there are few encountered each day.  Also given the lack of magic Items you might want to take a look at the magic of incarnum. Very good stuff in there for a low loot campaign.

carnivore

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how does the DM handle this feat:

ENDURANCE [GENERAL]
Benefit: You gain a +4 bonus on the following checks and saves: Swim checks made to resist nonlethal damage, Constitution checks made to continue running, Constitution checks made to avoid nonlethal damage from a forced march, Constitution checks made to hold your breath, Constitution checks made to avoid nonlethal damage from starvation or thirst, Fortitude saves made to avoid nonlethal damage from hot or cold environments, and Fortitude saves made to resist damage from suffocation. Also, you may sleep in light or medium armor without becoming fatigued.
Normal: A character without this feat who sleeps in medium or heavier armor is automatically fatigued the next day.
Special: A ranger automatically gains Endurance as a bonus feat at 3rd level. He need not select it.



 :D

JaronK

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Binder 1/Archivist 3/Anima Mage 10/Tainted Sorcerer 1/Tenebrous Apostate 5.  Improved Binding, Persistant Spell, Martial Study (Moment of Perfect Mind) and Knowledge Devotion should be on your list of feats.  Take that Tainted Sorcerer level as soon as you've got Moment of Perfect Mind and can be sure to always hit the will save to avoid taking more levels in the class.  NEVER use Moment of Perfect Mind except when leveling up or when you're sure you won't level until the manuever is recharged.

Generally you'll want to bind Buer and Naberious, and later on you'll need to also bind Tenebrous... though you can drop Buer if you persist Lesser Mass Vigor or Vigorous Circle.  This means you never have to spend anything on material components (instead you take a small amount of hitpoint damage, which heals automatically).  As such, feel free to use Animate Dead on all fallen enemies worth doing it on.  You also get endless free metamagic all day long, since you take con damage instead of raising the level of the spells and you automatically heal that too at a rate of 1 point per round.  As such, cast Extended Persisted versions of all your buffs (Divine Power, Greater Luminous Armor, Mirror Image, Righteous Wrath of the Faithful, Vigorous Circle, etc).

As for your taint score, you'll want as high a Wisdom as you can get, since your max taint score is one less than twice your Wisdom.  Your taint score is effectively your stat bonus for bonus spells, spell DCs, and the highest level spell you can cast, so you want it high... but it might go up by one every time you cast a spell (fort DC up to 19), and if it hits twice your Wisdom you're in deep trouble.  So, if you had a Wisdom of 20 (which under the rules you've specified may be about what you can get away with) you could have a taint of up to 39, which is effectively like having a casting stat of 88.  Not too shabby!  But make sure you've got spells like Atonement, Heal, Remove Curse, Remove Disease, Restoration, and Greater Restoration.

Anyway, the moral of the story is that in a setting with few magic items casters are kings.  You could always be a VoP Monk.  Or you could consider talking to your DM... D&D isn't balanced for really low wealth, and setting wealth so low screws non casters (which is I doubt what he wants).  Consider setting up a house rule system in place of magic items that gives you the bonus of said items inhearently, such as something based on VoP.

JaronK

carnivore

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try this:

Crusader 20
Ranger 2/ Psion 8/ Slayer 10
Warlock 2/ Cleric 7/ Contemplative 1/ Eldritch Disciple 10
Wizard 5/ Shadowcraft Mage 5/ Incantatrix 10

 :D
 
« Last Edit: March 01, 2010, 06:22:03 PM by carnivore »

Havok4

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I will agree with JaronK on his last point there. No one in your party can play a non-caster/Other magic system user and remain level appropriate with those houserules. That pretty much limits the characters to wizards, sorcerers, clerics, druids, archivists, psions, wilders, psychic warriors, ardents, warlocks, incarnates, totemists, binders, favored souls, warmages, beguilers, dread necromancers, and factotums (sort of they can be rather gear dependent).

Agita

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For armor: Restful Crystal or Restful armor enchantment both let you sleep in medium or heavy armor. They're also really cheap. (Though I suppose if it's no treasure, that doesn't help.) Alternatively, carnivore pointed out Endurance. If a character still has to take his goddamn armor off, he's a pussy.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2010, 06:36:24 PM by Agita »
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archangel.arcanis

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To head off your DM's protests. I have personally asked Cam Banks about Psionics in DL and the jist of what he said is they left it out to save space but they personally allow it in their games.

How is your DM handling the Towers of High Sorcery and what era of play? As a DL fan who owns some of the game books i might be able to help.  Your DM sounds a lot like one that i am under right now, but they at least try to be fair to the PCs and give a bit more treasure than yours. I also assume all combats start out close enough that within 1 round someone is in melee as well.

Also remind your DM that while DL is relatively light on magic items they also made a big deal out of giving the heroes what they needed. Another thing to remind the DM about is that the characters belong to the player and he isn't allowed to dictate what you did or didn't do. That is a deal breaker worthy of leaving a game for. He needs to remember that you guys are adventurers and yes wearing full plate all day is going to get uncomfortable but your characters should be able to deal with it.

For character builds make something that can Nova since you really don't have to worry about a second combat most of the time.

edit: wanted to add Called as an option if you can ever get it added to your armor. MIC pg 9. It teleports your armor onto you with a command so you could leave it sitting off to the side, say a word and you are fully suited up.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2010, 06:37:54 PM by archangel.arcanis »
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« Last Edit: March 01, 2010, 07:18:32 PM by E-mail »

Agita

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the DM doesn't believe in web enhancements, errata [...]
Before errata, DMM could, as written, be applied to non-divine spells and use a metamagic feat you didn't know. Just saying.
And yes, Binders are from ToM.
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PhaedrusXY

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Carnivore: A character with endurance CAN sleep in armor, but he will never actually want to do it, because it is too uncomfortable. I don't get it either. It does, however, mean that characters like clerics, rangers and crusaders run the risk of unarmored melee combat often, and my experience tells me that they wont last too long.
DMs should never dictate the actions of player characters, as long as their actions are within the rules. Your DM sounds like a 1st class douche-bag, and I'm not sure why you continue to play under him.
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archangel.arcanis

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Warmage/War Mage (Age of Mortals i think) is probably going to work out for you if you stay working under this DM.

I would combine it with Frost Mage (Frostburn) and cold spell specialization feat. That could generate stupid amounts of damage that will ignore cold resistance. The cold specialization only helps if you can manipulate the weather to be cold though.
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Carnivore: A character with endurance CAN sleep in armor, but he will never actually want to do it, because it is too uncomfortable. I don't get it either. It does, however, mean that characters like clerics, rangers and crusaders run the risk of unarmored melee combat often, and my experience tells me that they wont last too long.
DMs should never dictate the actions of player characters, as long as their actions are within the rules. Your DM sounds like a 1st class douche-bag, and I'm not sure why you continue to play under him.

He is a LARPer, and he is quite possibly the weakest person I have ever known. When he is out LARPing, he will wear a homemade chain mail, and he will not be able to walk straight for days afterwards. He seems to think that a Str 16 Con 14 cleric with endurance wouldn't do much better than himself, and imposes enormous penalties to anyone who tries. There, thats the best explanation I can come up with. Please don't let it throw this thread of the track, but feel free to laugh quietly.

Agita

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Carnivore: A character with endurance CAN sleep in armor, but he will never actually want to do it, because it is too uncomfortable. I don't get it either. It does, however, mean that characters like clerics, rangers and crusaders run the risk of unarmored melee combat often, and my experience tells me that they wont last too long.
DMs should never dictate the actions of player characters, as long as their actions are within the rules. Your DM sounds like a 1st class douche-bag, and I'm not sure why you continue to play under him.

He is a LARPer, and he is quite possibly the weakest person I have ever known. When he is out LARPing, he will wear a homemade chain mail, and he will not be able to walk straight for days afterwards. He seems to think that a Str 16 Con 14 cleric with endurance wouldn't do much better than himself, and imposes enormous penalties to anyone who tries. There, thats the best explanation I can come up with. Please don't let it throw this thread of the track, but feel free to laugh quietly.
I'm quick to laugh at stupid people, but that just makes me sad. So a character with a +30 Jump mod also can't jump higher than he can?

Anyway, yeah, all-caster party is the way to go.
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KellKheraptis

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Carnivore: A character with endurance CAN sleep in armor, but he will never actually want to do it, because it is too uncomfortable. I don't get it either. It does, however, mean that characters like clerics, rangers and crusaders run the risk of unarmored melee combat often, and my experience tells me that they wont last too long.
DMs should never dictate the actions of player characters, as long as their actions are within the rules. Your DM sounds like a 1st class douche-bag, and I'm not sure why you continue to play under him.

This, with a side order of compiling all of the books needed to ascend to Punification using only books.  And then the moment he protests ANYTHING, spinning hook kick to the jaw followed by an elbow to the face, and remind him that monks aren't even fucking oriental by the meaning of the word in Europe, which is what standard DnD is mostly based on.  Also, snap his wrist and remind him that both Pankration (Greek) and Kampfriegen were Western hand to hand martial arts.  Sounds like this chump only recognizes force :)

Now that aside, grease will permafuck his monsters for a looong time.  Once he starts throwing sneaky shit at you, have a couple stat debuffs sizzling ready for him.  Once you guys are nice and high level (or even mid level really), start owning face on the magic-aided construction/money generation.  Let him feel the wraith of PC's being forced to forge an empire at 10th level that should never happen.  And once you get nice and high level, go full on Astral clones.

And as to wearing chain mail as pathetically as he does...all I have to say, being a student of Eastern and Western martial arts since I could walk, he's either A)Pathetically weak, or B)Wearing REALLY shitty chain mail.  'Nuff said there :P
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NiteCyper

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1. Can you **** the economy?

2. What about something like a Warforged Artificer imbuing himself? In this case, all you need is the spell, right?

3. Dirty trick #5, save game mechanics.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2010, 07:58:10 PM by NiteCyper »
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