Author Topic: The Complete Cost Reduction Handbook by Bastian with PlzBreakMyCampaign's help  (Read 108847 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Bastian

  • Bi-Curious George
  • ****
  • Posts: 540
Dragon 357 is 4e. I don't have that one but I'm immediately skeptical of the information.I'm dumb. Here it is.

[spoiler][/spoiler]
Your image is broken.

Littha

  • Man in Gorilla Suit
  • *****
  • Posts: 2155
    • Email
I can see it fine.

Bastian

  • Bi-Curious George
  • ****
  • Posts: 540
I can see it fine.
Really? I tried it in both Firefox and Chrome and I tried going to the URL and I still couldn't see it.

Littha

  • Man in Gorilla Suit
  • *****
  • Posts: 2155
    • Email
I'm on firefox

The_Mad_Linguist

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 8780
  • Simulated Thing
Dragon 357 is 4e. I don't have that one but I'm immediately skeptical of the information.I'm dumb. Here it is.

[spoiler][/spoiler]
Your image is broken.
It just takes a while to load
Linguist, Mad, Unique, none of these things am I
My custom class: The Priest of the Unseen Host
Planetouched Handbook
Want to improve your character?  Then die.

Andion Isurand

  • Domesticated Capuchin Monkey
  • **
  • Posts: 119
  • An Anomaly of The Art
    • MageRune - Andion Isurand's Homebrew Blog
Re: New ACF and spell to add to the list.
« Reply #145 on: February 26, 2011, 09:47:19 PM »
I would like to add the following items to the list:

The "Scribe" cleric ACF from Dragon Magazine 353 pg 89, grants you the Scribe Scroll feat and reduces the exp cost to scribe them by 25%... in exchange for your turning/rebuking ability.

The Research Aid spell from Dragon 342 pg 55, reduces the time the caster spends crafting by 50% (among other things).  It's a level 4 divine spell gained by taking the Initiate of Boccob feat.


Does research aid help magical or non-magical crafting?

"Crafting magic items takes half the normal amount of time."

Bastian

  • Bi-Curious George
  • ****
  • Posts: 540
Added both the Research Aid spell and Salamander Orchids. Thank you both.

Might want to mention the weapon templates in DMG 2 with their affinities.  Some of them can be used to save some cash on weapons and armor.
Adding them now.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2011, 09:59:42 AM by Bastian »

Andion Isurand

  • Domesticated Capuchin Monkey
  • **
  • Posts: 119
  • An Anomaly of The Art
    • MageRune - Andion Isurand's Homebrew Blog
Finish study of the Nether Scrolls' second chapter: "Magicus Creare" aka "Spells of Creation" (LEoF)       =       75%
« Last Edit: March 17, 2011, 05:23:18 AM by Andion Isurand »

jojolagger

  • Hong Kong
  • ****
  • Posts: 951
Those who study all 10 scrolls in the second chapter "Magicus Creare" (Spells of Creation) gains the following benefit (in addition to three item creation feats):
75% item xp cost and 3 bonus feats! what's the catch?
Countdown to Zombie Apocalypse 97
When you see this, copy it into your sig and -1
:lovefirefox
Quotes [spoiler]
In other words, he thinks there's a "correct" way to play D&D.  *sigh*
There is: Kill shit and loot the corpse!
When you use a tool the way it was designed for -- its intended function -- then it will work very well for you.

But it's not the tool's fault if you use it for something else and you fail utterly, such as trying to eat cereal with a butterknife, pounding nails with a screwdriver, blogging to voice your political opinions, and brushing your teeth with a hammer.
[/spoiler]

Andion Isurand

  • Domesticated Capuchin Monkey
  • **
  • Posts: 119
  • An Anomaly of The Art
    • MageRune - Andion Isurand's Homebrew Blog
Those who study all 10 scrolls in the second chapter "Magicus Creare" (Spells of Creation) gains the following benefit (in addition to three item creation feats):
75% item xp cost and 3 bonus feats! what's the catch?

Finding and studying them all... as they are highly sought after by practically everyone with the will and means to make use of them.

also....

Finish study of Chapter 1 to gain:    +30 inheret bonus on Spellcraft checks; +1 to save DCs for all arcane spells

Finish study of Chapter 3 to gain:    Craft Construct as a bonus feat; all arcane constructs you create have maximum HP.

Finish study of Chapter 4 to gain:    Plane Shift as a spell-like ability once per day; ignore any hostile or debilitating planar environmental effects.

Chapter 5 needs some kind of key to unlock its benefits.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2011, 09:30:11 PM by Andion Isurand »

Echoes

  • Bi-Curious George
  • ****
  • Posts: 476
Those who study all 10 scrolls in the second chapter "Magicus Creare" (Spells of Creation) gains the following benefit (in addition to three item creation feats):
75% item xp cost and 3 bonus feats! what's the catch?

Finding and studying them all... as they are highly sought after by practically everyone with the will and means to make use of them.

also....

Finish study of Chapter 1 to gain:    +30 inheret bonus on Spellcraft checks; +1 to save DCs for all arcane spells

Finish study of Chapter 3 to gain:    Craft Construct as a bonus feat; all arcane constructs you create have maximum HP.

Finish study of Chapter 4 to gain:    Plane Shift as a spell-like ability once per day; ignore any hostile or debilitating planar environmental effects.

Chapter 5 needs some kind of key to unlock its benefits.

Also, you get a level in an arcane spellcasting class of your choice for each scroll you read. Which means that if you finish one chapter, you gain ten levels. If you read the entire set, you gain fifty levels. So, reading the nether scrolls automatically makes you an epic character whether you want it or not.

The problem is that they're artifacts, meaning that getting your hands on them is almost entirely DM fiat. The books gives the location for one set (it's a tree in the ruins of Myth Drannor), but whether you actually get them is not something you have any control over. Either your DM is cool with you getting absurd amounts of power and lets you quest for them, or he doesn't. Nothing you, as a player, do will affect whether you get the scrolls (outside of DM fellatio). You can't say "I'm going to train in the Nether Scrolls Arcanist PrC and learn their secrets". You can just go "Hey DM, can I quest for absurd amounts of power? BTW, here's some Ho-Hos and a Mountain Dew. ;)"
BrokeAndDrive speaks the Truth (linked for great justice and signature limits)

Quotes I Found Entertaining:

Huge amounts of people are fuckwits. That doesn't mean that fuckwit is a valid lifestyle.

As a general rule, murdering people and taking their stuff is pretty much superior to breaking their stuff, murdering them, then not having any stuff to take.

Out of Context Theater
[spoiler]
Oh I'll make a party. I'll make a party so hard... I'll make a party that makes you feel so awkward downstairs.

You'll see the party and only be able to respond, "Oh yeah baby."
[/spoiler]

Andion Isurand

  • Domesticated Capuchin Monkey
  • **
  • Posts: 119
  • An Anomaly of The Art
    • MageRune - Andion Isurand's Homebrew Blog
I'm not entirely sure a creature is meant to gain one level from each scroll they study past the first.

Otherwise you'd have at least some sarrukh and netherese liches and elven baelnorns persisting into the present (D&D 3.5) with 50+ levels.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2011, 12:57:57 AM by Andion Isurand »

Echoes

  • Bi-Curious George
  • ****
  • Posts: 476
I'm not entirely sure a creature is meant to gain one level from each scroll they study.

Otherwise you'd have at least some sarrukh and netherese liches and elven baelnorns persisting today with 50+ levels.

So your argument for it not working is because ... there'd be walking penis-extension NPC spellcasters running around? In the Forgotten Realms? Have you even read any of the setting material? Like, at all? We are literally talking about the Land of Walking Penis Extension DMPCsTM, here.

Leaving all that aside, you're actually right. There totally are ancient baelnorns living in Myth Drannor itself who are explicitly guarding the treasures, including the nether scrolls, that lie within. There's also multiple wyrm dragons, a bunch of devils summoned by servitors of Bane, cabals of illithiliches, a host of phaerimm (who are about as broken-retarded as the sharn, only they want to drain all the life-energy out of the planet) and some dark cult. The entire fallen city is literally a hive of hostile factions all warring with each other and with intrepid adventurers over the treasures of the city.

Snark aside, actual rules text ahoy!

Quote from: Lost Empires of Faerun, page 156
Reading even one nether scroll offers considerable insight into the Art. Any character studying one immediately gains one level in an arcane spellcasting class of her choice ... A character who manages to read all ten scrolls that make up a chapter gains an additional benefit whose nature depends on the topic studied.

That's straight out the book with the exception of the bolding. Reading one scroll gets you a level. It's not one or more scrolls, it's one. So when you read a chapter, you also gain ten levels in whatever arcane class(es) you want.
BrokeAndDrive speaks the Truth (linked for great justice and signature limits)

Quotes I Found Entertaining:

Huge amounts of people are fuckwits. That doesn't mean that fuckwit is a valid lifestyle.

As a general rule, murdering people and taking their stuff is pretty much superior to breaking their stuff, murdering them, then not having any stuff to take.

Out of Context Theater
[spoiler]
Oh I'll make a party. I'll make a party so hard... I'll make a party that makes you feel so awkward downstairs.

You'll see the party and only be able to respond, "Oh yeah baby."
[/spoiler]

Andion Isurand

  • Domesticated Capuchin Monkey
  • **
  • Posts: 119
  • An Anomaly of The Art
    • MageRune - Andion Isurand's Homebrew Blog
I'm just saying that the original authors of the Nether Scrolls, the members of the Baetith, would have much to show.  The closest we're given in 3.5 is the Terraseer who was given only 30 class levels of arcane spellcasting.

With 41 class levels of arcane spellcasting, you have the netherese arcanist Ioulaum (aka) the Oracle of Ellyn'taal (about 5k years old)...  apparently wasn't able to set aside 50 months to review all 50 scrolls... even though the elves of Cormanthyr were able to steal one whole set of 50 scrolls from the Netherese and consolidate them into the Quess'Ar'Teranthvar.

In this single form of a golden beech tree, its far more likely that a few elven mages would have walked away having studied all fifty scrolls...

Now, FR is swamped with NPCs that cast long mighty shadows tantamount to an eternal solar eclipse ... but I don't think there has ever been an FR NPC with 50+ listed class levels aside from deities... (at least not in D&D 3.5)
« Last Edit: March 18, 2011, 04:21:10 AM by Andion Isurand »

Bastian

  • Bi-Curious George
  • ****
  • Posts: 540
Finish study of the Nether Scrolls' second chapter: "Magicus Creare" aka "Spells of Creation" (LEoF)       =       75%
Added. Thanks again.

McPoyo

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 3783
    • Email
Because they never updated those NPCs from 3.0 where they did, or they were killed off through their idiocy (see:Karsus, who did, and then died essentially to DM Fiat).
[Spoiler]
A gygaxian dungeon is like the world's most messed up game show.

Behind door number one: INSTANT DEATH!
Behind door number 2: A magic crown!
Behind door number 3: 4d6 giant bees, and THREE HUNDRED POUNDS OF HONEY!
They don't/haven't, was the point. 3.5 is as dead as people not liking nice tits.

Sometimes, their tits (3.5) get enhancements (houserules), but that doesn't mean people don't like nice tits.

Though sometimes, the surgeon (DM) botches them pretty bad...
Best metaphor I have seen in a long time.  I give you much fu.
Three Errata for the Mage-kings under the sky,
Seven for the Barbarian-lords in their halls of stone,
Nine for Mortal Monks doomed to die,
One for the Wizard on his dark throne
In the Land of Charop where the Shadows lie.
[/spoiler]

snakeman830

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 3494
  • BG's resident furry min/maxxer
Because they never updated those NPCs from 3.0 where they did, or they were killed off through their idiocy (see:Karsus, who did, and then died essentially to DM Fiat).
Yeah, but Karsus never really went away and somehow extended his bloodline into Greyhawk, Ravenloft, Kalamar, and Eberron (see Tome of Magic :p)
I am constantly amazed by how many DM's ban Tomb of Battle.  The book doesn't even exist!

Quotes:[spoiler]
By yes, she means no.
That explains so much about my life.
hiicantcomeupwithacharacterthatisntaghostwhyisthatamijustretardedorsomething
Why would you even do this? It hurts my eyes and looks like you ate your keyboard before suffering an attack of explosive diarrhea.
[/spoiler]

If using Genesis to hide your phylactry, set it at -300 degrees farenheit.  See how do-gooders fare with a liquid atmosphere.

McPoyo

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 3783
    • Email
Becoming a vestige counts as further DM Dickery, since he can't be res'd now :P
[Spoiler]
A gygaxian dungeon is like the world's most messed up game show.

Behind door number one: INSTANT DEATH!
Behind door number 2: A magic crown!
Behind door number 3: 4d6 giant bees, and THREE HUNDRED POUNDS OF HONEY!
They don't/haven't, was the point. 3.5 is as dead as people not liking nice tits.

Sometimes, their tits (3.5) get enhancements (houserules), but that doesn't mean people don't like nice tits.

Though sometimes, the surgeon (DM) botches them pretty bad...
Best metaphor I have seen in a long time.  I give you much fu.
Three Errata for the Mage-kings under the sky,
Seven for the Barbarian-lords in their halls of stone,
Nine for Mortal Monks doomed to die,
One for the Wizard on his dark throne
In the Land of Charop where the Shadows lie.
[/spoiler]

JaronK

  • Organ Grinder
  • *****
  • Posts: 4039
I wonder about the nether scrolls though... could you call it the same bonus and thus say they don't stack, so the first scroll gives you a level and the rest don't?

Meh, probably not, but it seems a bit silly to have such items in existence.  I suppose someone should cross post those scrolls into the war handbook... clearly the secret to a nasty army is to conscript a bunch of loyal troops, show them each your 20 collecting scrolls, and have an army of 20th level Wizards to crush all before you.

I also wonder about that wording "any."  Could you take an arcane class you don't yet qualify for that way?  Screw Wizard, let's go with Beholder Mage!

JaronK

Echoes

  • Bi-Curious George
  • ****
  • Posts: 476
I wonder about the nether scrolls though... could you call it the same bonus and thus say they don't stack, so the first scroll gives you a level and the rest don't?

Meh, probably not, but it seems a bit silly to have such items in existence.  I suppose someone should cross post those scrolls into the war handbook... clearly the secret to a nasty army is to conscript a bunch of loyal troops, show them each your 20 collecting scrolls, and have an army of 20th level Wizards to crush all before you.

I also wonder about that wording "any."  Could you take an arcane class you don't yet qualify for that way?  Screw Wizard, let's go with Beholder Mage!

JaronK

From the ask a simple question, get a simple answer thread:

Q 175: If someone reads from a nether scroll (Lost Empire of Faerun) could they gain a level in an arcane casting class they don't qualify for?

No. Your XP total is set to the mid-point for next level, and you have to take a level in an arcane spellcasting class. No where does it state that you get to ignore prerequisites when taking this level.

The other major stumbling block regarding the nether scrolls is that they're minor artifacts, and getting them is basically DM fiat. You can't really do anything other than say "I want to get this awesome item, mother may I?" and hope the DM is willing. Even saying "We want to go explore Myth Drannor and find these awesome relics" doesn't cut it, because there are hordes of various extremely powerful foes between you and the scrolls (tree, whatever), many of whom could very well be epic-level characters in their own right who've read the scrolls (the baelnorns, specifically).

That's why I kinda object to their inclusion in the handbook. A player doesn't have any control over whether they can get access to them, so they really aren't relevant in a CO discussion. TO, certainly, but not CO.
BrokeAndDrive speaks the Truth (linked for great justice and signature limits)

Quotes I Found Entertaining:

Huge amounts of people are fuckwits. That doesn't mean that fuckwit is a valid lifestyle.

As a general rule, murdering people and taking their stuff is pretty much superior to breaking their stuff, murdering them, then not having any stuff to take.

Out of Context Theater
[spoiler]
Oh I'll make a party. I'll make a party so hard... I'll make a party that makes you feel so awkward downstairs.

You'll see the party and only be able to respond, "Oh yeah baby."
[/spoiler]