Author Topic: Total Invulnerability Build  (Read 17879 times)

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veekie

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #20 on: February 02, 2010, 12:00:35 AM »
Well, again, the second aspect applies, the creature existing at both places at once means a spell targeting either location(not a person, use an AoE) would hit.
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Tohron

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #21 on: February 02, 2010, 01:25:06 PM »
Well, again, the second aspect applies, the creature existing at both places at once means a spell targeting either location(not a person, use an AoE) would hit.

Indeed, which is why AoE spells that don't require LoS would be the main threat right now.  Mind-switching the wizard and his followers into parts of the building (which the lyres would make invulnerable) would protect against many spells - the problem is how to play the lyres without either leaving space for something to teleport inside and disable the lyres, or placing them inside something like a gelatinous cube that could be killed with such AoE spells.  Part of the problem is that the SRD does not defined what is required to "use" the lyre - could I just put it in mercury (which would be considered part of an inanimate construction) and telekinetically play it there?  It doesn't say.

One advantage of true-mind-switching into a building I didn't fully mention is that your lyre-provided invulnerability protects you from all "attacks" made against you.  So any direct damage spells won't hurt at all - whether it would protect against debuffs is unclear.
« Last Edit: February 02, 2010, 01:27:25 PM by Tohron »

PhaedrusXY

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #22 on: February 02, 2010, 09:39:51 PM »
Well, again, the second aspect applies, the creature existing at both places at once means a spell targeting either location(not a person, use an AoE) would hit.
Or two spells cast at the same time, one targeting each location. That's not that hard to do...
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Bloody Initiate

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #23 on: February 04, 2010, 04:58:58 PM »
Okay, so let's start with a level 30 wizard.  Already ultra-powerful, but this is mainly a thought experiment to test out certain defenses.  He has Leadership, Epic Leadership, and Legendary Commander, and with boosted Charisma from epic spells, has essentially unlimited followers.  He has levels in Incantatrix, War Weaver, and IotSV.  Now that his power knows few if any bounds, one of his main concerns is staying alive.  And he has a plan.
The way epic spells work just have them all boost your ritual spell to permanently dominate everyone on your current plane, with the save DC jacked up to a couple billion.

5% of the population succeeds their save, become player characters, and now you have a campaign setting.
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The_Mad_Linguist

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #24 on: February 04, 2010, 04:59:51 PM »
Okay, so let's start with a level 30 wizard.  Already ultra-powerful, but this is mainly a thought experiment to test out certain defenses.  He has Leadership, Epic Leadership, and Legendary Commander, and with boosted Charisma from epic spells, has essentially unlimited followers.  He has levels in Incantatrix, War Weaver, and IotSV.  Now that his power knows few if any bounds, one of his main concerns is staying alive.  And he has a plan.
The way epic spells work just have them all boost your ritual spell to permanently dominate everyone on your current plane, with the save DC jacked up to a couple billion.

5% of the population succeeds their save, become player characters, and now you have a campaign setting.
So that's why PCs are immune to diplomacy...
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Bloody Initiate

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #25 on: February 04, 2010, 05:05:57 PM »
Okay, so let's start with a level 30 wizard.  Already ultra-powerful, but this is mainly a thought experiment to test out certain defenses.  He has Leadership, Epic Leadership, and Legendary Commander, and with boosted Charisma from epic spells, has essentially unlimited followers.  He has levels in Incantatrix, War Weaver, and IotSV.  Now that his power knows few if any bounds, one of his main concerns is staying alive.  And he has a plan.
The way epic spells work just have them all boost your ritual spell to permanently dominate everyone on your current plane, with the save DC jacked up to a couple billion.

5% of the population succeeds their save, become player characters, and now you have a campaign setting.
So that's why PCs are immune to diplomacy...

That and the fact that you're attempting to reason with and persuade someone who is pretending they're a wizard, medieval knight, dashing rogue, or some other unbelievable possibility for an overweight Cheetos and Mountain Dew fan.
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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #26 on: February 06, 2010, 06:47:15 PM »
Okay, so let's start with a level 30 wizard.  Already ultra-powerful, but this is mainly a thought experiment to test out certain defenses.  He has Leadership, Epic Leadership, and Legendary Commander, and with boosted Charisma from epic spells, has essentially unlimited followers.  He has levels in Incantatrix, War Weaver, and IotSV.  Now that his power knows few if any bounds, one of his main concerns is staying alive.  And he has a plan.
The way epic spells work just have them all boost your ritual spell to permanently dominate everyone on your current plane, with the save DC jacked up to a couple billion.

5% of the population succeeds their save, become player characters, and now you have a campaign setting.
So that's why PCs are immune to diplomacy...

That and the fact that you're attempting to reason with and persuade someone who is pretending they're a wizard, medieval knight, dashing rogue, or some other unbelievable possibility for an overweight Cheetos and Mountain Dew fan.

I hate cheetos.
So you end up stuck in an endless loop, unable to act, forever.

In retrospect, much like Keanu Reeves.

nijineko

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #27 on: March 02, 2010, 05:50:55 PM »
good effort...  :clap

a few things that occur to me. since we are using implied rules and effects here, it seems that a lyre in order to function properly would require the sound waves to be generated by the strings, to travel to the structure, and affect the structure. considering that silence can negate such music-based effects, it stands to reason that any sufficiently sound-warping effect would as well. thus (maybe) it requires an air space around the lyre and such air space has to touch the wall / structure it is affecting.

you can get a single non-epic true res effect for the cost of a single feat and some planar travel time. renewable at only the cost of the travel time. or you could just stand in the spot, i guess, instead of dealing with the travel time.... ^^

since we are wandering off into the wotc-didn't-happen-to-define-a-poorly-worded-rule-to-cover-that-whoops area, i would suggest that in while the travel time between circles might be instantaneous, the dwell-activation time for the circle is not. once the person arrives in the circle, it takes a moment for the circle to recognize this and activate. after all it takes a standard action to activate an instantaneous effect in many cases. examples of this are littered through the magic / psionics rules. so that would be say 60% of a round or so's worth of time. we'll fudge and call that 4 seconds. thus i suggest that there will be a lag of maybe 4 seconds between each teleportation effect. i don't think you can achieve quantum uncertainty. even in modern successful teleportation experiments, there is a dwell time of some fempto-seconds, if i recall correctly.

i'll think of more after a while... =D
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Amechra

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #28 on: April 20, 2010, 08:20:35 PM »
Think about it. Even if this worked, think of the headache! :lmao
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Sounds fine to me.
probably over on "Off-topic".
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Kethrian

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #29 on: September 29, 2011, 08:19:12 AM »
I know it's been a while, but I'm just surprised that no one has mentioned this other small, but glaring error: if the bauble's location cannot be clearly defined, then the contingencies willl automatically fail.

zook1shoe

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #30 on: September 29, 2011, 03:29:39 PM »
Truthfully, the only thing I've seen to truly make yourself invincible in D&D means either Pun-Pun or simply not existing in the first place.

Agreed, or a Water Elemental Dry Lich :P

nijineko

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #31 on: September 30, 2011, 12:17:40 AM »
I know it's been a while, but I'm just surprised that no one has mentioned this other small, but glaring error: if the bauble's location cannot be clearly defined, then the contingencies willl automatically fail.

we were saving that for the clinching gotcha, should other attempts fail. ^^
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Kethrian

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #32 on: October 04, 2011, 06:30:37 AM »
I know it's been a while, but I'm just surprised that no one has mentioned this other small, but glaring error: if the bauble's location cannot be clearly defined, then the contingencies willl automatically fail.

we were saving that for the clinching gotcha, should other attempts fail. ^^

Ah, so that's your evil strategy!  ;)

nijineko

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #33 on: October 04, 2011, 10:45:03 PM »
curses, foiled again. next time i'll get you next time, i... wait. does this mean you were a pc all along in disguise as a board member?!? gasp!! ^^
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Nytemare3701

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #34 on: October 05, 2011, 05:11:31 AM »
Truthfully, the only thing I've seen to truly make yourself invincible in D&D means either Pun-Pun or simply not existing in the first place.

Agreed, or a Water Elemental Dry Lich :P


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SorO_Lost

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #35 on: October 07, 2011, 06:39:01 PM »
What is going on over here?

Level 30 Epic Spell using Wizard acting like it needs some break in physics to work? Lame-wtf.
Water Elemental Dry Lich? Lame-pun.

This thread needs more

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Kethrian

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #36 on: October 07, 2011, 10:01:32 PM »
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Tohron

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #37 on: October 07, 2011, 10:18:37 PM »
I know it's been a while, but I'm just surprised that no one has mentioned this other small, but glaring error: if the bauble's location cannot be clearly defined, then the contingencies willl automatically fail.

Since this thread seems to not be dead yet, I thought I might as well respond to this criticism: if you have 6 contingencies (1 for each teleportation circle) and hence 6 possible locations for the bauble, all of the contingencies failing would indicate that the bauble somehow got out of all the teleportation circles, which clearly is not possible.  Thus, that leaves either the randomly determined position interpretation (under which the divination screen fails), or the indeterminate position interpretation (which the whole divination screen concept is based on).

Also:

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monotheocannibalization
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Kethrian

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #38 on: October 07, 2011, 10:42:40 PM »
I know it's been a while, but I'm just surprised that no one has mentioned this other small, but glaring error: if the bauble's location cannot be clearly defined, then the contingencies willl automatically fail.

Since this thread seems to not be dead yet, I thought I might as well respond to this criticism: if you have 6 contingencies (1 for each teleportation circle) and hence 6 possible locations for the bauble, all of the contingencies failing would indicate that the bauble somehow got out of all the teleportation circles, which clearly is not possible.  Thus, that leaves either the randomly determined position interpretation (under which the divination screen fails), or the indeterminate position interpretation (which the whole divination screen concept is based on).

Also:

hyperpolyfilamentism
monotheocannibalization
supraphonicflourocarbonosis

Yes, I was referring to the fact that if divinations fail, contingencies will, too.

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nijineko

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Re: Total Invulnerability Build
« Reply #39 on: October 09, 2011, 01:18:59 AM »
punpunpun
hasturhasturhastur
triskedecktanecrophiliphobia
arukibito ga michi wo erabu no ka, michi ga arukibito wo erabu no deshou ka?
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