Author Topic: Very Frenzied Berzerker  (Read 3300 times)

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Hand_of_Vecna

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Very Frenzied Berzerker
« on: December 12, 2009, 11:53:34 PM »
So I was just putting together a few possible barbarian builds for my wife and I was looking over the Frenzied Berzerker. The Frenzy ability grants an extra attack and it says it doesn't stack with other effects that grant an extra attack such as haste. I was wondering wether the whirling frenzy ACF would be an exception since it isn't a magical effect.

DerWille

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Re: Very Frenzied Berzerker
« Reply #1 on: December 13, 2009, 12:52:23 AM »
I would assume it doesn't stack because whirling frenzy grants an extra attack and it says it doesn't stack with anything that grants an extra attack. 

raith0

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Re: Very Frenzied Berzerker
« Reply #2 on: December 16, 2009, 09:00:16 PM »
im going to have to second that as well but if they want to make a lot of attacks just add in pounce and you are set with a charge and a few ways of upping the damage more with feats and you are good to go

KellKheraptis

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Re: Very Frenzied Berzerker
« Reply #3 on: December 17, 2009, 03:43:45 AM »
My standard response when I see Frenzied Berserker is make everyone cry with a Valenar Elf :)  Revenant Blade combined with FB is capable of some serious pain, and that'll give you all the bookoo attacks you want, too.
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rubberduck

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Re: Very Frenzied Berzerker
« Reply #4 on: December 17, 2009, 04:01:47 AM »
i always liked my old warforten barbarian fighter warforhed charger frenzied berserker
i was immune to like 20% of alp the spells :-)
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wezylithyx

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Re: Very Frenzied Berzerker
« Reply #5 on: December 17, 2009, 04:41:56 AM »
To get back to the OP, Whirling Frenzy is a flurry-style ability; I would believe they stack, since you're taking a penalty on attack rolls for the extra attack from whirling frenzy. Its worded so vaguely (any "other effects that grant additional attacks") that it can be interpreted however the DM wants. Say you cleric casts Girallon's Blessing on you, granting you extra arms and natural attacks, does that negate the frenzy attack? Ridiculous, if you ask me.
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qwvb

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Re: Very Frenzied Berzerker
« Reply #6 on: December 17, 2009, 04:13:56 PM »
To get back to the OP, Whirling Frenzy is a flurry-style ability; I would believe they stack, since you're taking a penalty on attack rolls for the extra attack from whirling frenzy. Its worded so vaguely (any "other effects that grant additional attacks") that it can be interpreted however the DM wants. Say you cleric casts Girallon's Blessing on you, granting you extra arms and natural attacks, does that negate the frenzy attack? Ridiculous, if you ask me.
In fact Girallon's Blessing provides natural attacks, which are another pattern of attacks, not extra attacks, which means that under the effect of Whirling Frenzy OR Frenzy OR Haste, you do get a single extra attack out of them.

To Hand_of_Vecna : Sadly, they don't stack... Anyway, I would prefer a bonus to Con instead or Armor and Reflex.

Alastar

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Re: Very Frenzied Berzerker
« Reply #7 on: December 17, 2009, 11:24:42 PM »
Ok, frenzy is a ''haste style effect''  meaning it does not stack with other ''haste style effects'' such as a speed weapon, the haste spell, righteous wrath of the faithful, and so on.

whirling frenzy is a flurry style effect, giving -2 to alll attacks in exchange for another attack, it is vastly different from a ''haste style effect''.

The two stack, and it's pretty obvious they do.

KellKheraptis

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Re: Very Frenzied Berzerker
« Reply #8 on: December 17, 2009, 11:28:45 PM »
Ok, frenzy is a ''haste style effect''  meaning it does not stack with other ''haste style effects'' such as a speed weapon, the haste spell, righteous wrath of the faithful, and so on.

whirling frenzy is a flurry style effect, giving -2 to alll attacks in exchange for another attack, it is vastly different from a ''haste style effect''.

The two stack, and it's pretty obvious they do.

I usually let most of that stuff stack, like 3.0 and Imp. Crit/Keen, but then the non-Swiftblades need all the edge they can get :P
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Hand_of_Vecna

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Re: Very Frenzied Berzerker
« Reply #9 on: December 18, 2009, 03:10:15 AM »
Interesting, I like the haste like vs. flurry like distinction. I suspected most most would come down on the no side but, apparently it's at least worth argueing to individual DMs. I find it so frustrating sometimes that it's easier for tanks to accomplish things like having lots of attacks or being a capable grappler through liberal use of magic that makes you not resemble your origional character concept than by being a badass and stringing together feats and class features.

Oh where are Velenar elf, revenant blade and warforten barbarian? Man, I usually don't not know that many things so fast.

KellKheraptis

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Re: Very Frenzied Berzerker
« Reply #10 on: December 18, 2009, 03:22:31 AM »
Interesting, I like the haste like vs. flurry like distinction. I suspected most most would come down on the no side but, apparently it's at least worth argueing to individual DMs. I find it so frustrating sometimes that it's easier for tanks to accomplish things like having lots of attacks or being a capable grappler through liberal use of magic that makes you not resemble your origional character concept than by being a badass and stringing together feats and class features.

Oh where are Velenar elf, revenant blade and warforten barbarian? Man, I usually don't not know that many things so fast.

Valenar Elves are from Eberon, and Revenant Blade is too.  They are the users of the Valenar Double Scimitar, and at the end, you get to use it as a two handed weapon and a double weapon (so x1.5 str on both ends).
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bearsarebrown

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Re: Very Frenzied Berzerker
« Reply #11 on: December 18, 2009, 03:24:04 AM »
Interesting, I like the haste like vs. flurry like distinction. I suspected most most would come down on the no side but, apparently it's at least worth argueing to individual DMs. I find it so frustrating sometimes that it's easier for tanks to accomplish things like having lots of attacks or being a capable grappler through liberal use of magic that makes you not resemble your origional character concept than by being a badass and stringing together feats and class features.

Oh where are Velenar elf, revenant blade and warforten barbarian? Man, I usually don't not know that many things so fast.

Valenar Elves are from Eberon, and Revenant Blade is too.  They are the users of the Valenar Double Scimitar, and at the end, you get to use it as a two handed weapon and a double weapon (so x1.5 str on both ends).

I saw this and immediately created a build for it (ranger 2/fighter 2/barbarian 1/Revenant Blade 5/Frenzied Bezerker 10) then googled it, and found the exact same build in the handbook! It's... it's so strong!

Hand_of_Vecna

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Re: Very Frenzied Berzerker
« Reply #12 on: December 18, 2009, 04:33:25 AM »
Valenar Elves are from Eberon, and Revenant Blade is too.  They are the users of the Valenar Double Scimitar, and at the end, you get to use it as a two handed weapon and a double weapon (so x1.5 str on both ends).

Very nice.

Alastar

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Re: Very Frenzied Berzerker
« Reply #13 on: December 18, 2009, 12:06:48 PM »
My character in an eberon build is named raging whirlwind and is going for that build.

except I'm monk 2 instead of ranger 2, since our dm allowed monks to have full BAB.

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Re: Very Frenzied Berzerker
« Reply #14 on: December 18, 2009, 05:04:27 PM »
Interesting, I like the haste like vs. flurry like distinction. I suspected most most would come down on the no side but, apparently it's at least worth argueing to individual DMs. I find it so frustrating sometimes that it's easier for tanks to accomplish things like having lots of attacks or being a capable grappler through liberal use of magic that makes you not resemble your origional character concept than by being a badass and stringing together feats and class features.

Oh where are Velenar elf, revenant blade and warforten barbarian? Man, I usually don't not know that many things so fast.

Valenar Elves are from Eberon, and Revenant Blade is too.  They are the users of the Valenar Double Scimitar, and at the end, you get to use it as a two handed weapon and a double weapon (so x1.5 str on both ends).

I love Revenant Blades. I actually had one planned for a PbP game here, but that seems to have died out. Le sigh.