Author Topic: Core Rogue to Assassin  (Read 1733 times)

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Aven

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Core Rogue to Assassin
« on: December 05, 2009, 10:49:52 PM »
Hey everyone. So, very soon, my friends and I are going to start up a new session of 3.5 with some new players. As such, we are starting from level 1 and we are limited to our core books (PH, DMG, MM). I have chosen to be a Rogue for this, and the idea is that it will be themed similar to Volke from Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance, if anyone knows what I'm talking about. He is human, uses daggers excusively, does not use TWF, and is pretty much an all around Rogue until the first chance to become an Assassin from the DMG. To generate our ability scores, we used point buy from the DMG with a total of 28 points to work with. I came out with:
STR:12
DEX:14
CON:13
INT:14
WIS:11
CHA:12

The feats I chose were Toughness and Improved Feint.
Now, while I am aware that he is a first level character and that they tend to be completely underwhelming in stats and whatnot, I was very disappointed that he came out with only a +1 on any chance to hit an enemy, among other things. Does anyone have any ideas as to what I could do to beef him up a bit, or if I really couldn't expect better than that based on my limitations? Thanks in advance.

DerWille

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Re: Core Rogue to Assassin
« Reply #1 on: December 05, 2009, 11:10:28 PM »
Hmm, to be honest, you've set up alot of limits on yourself. I strongly recommend that you be willing to pick up two weapon fighting and not limit yourself to only daggers. To really optimize yourself I'd recommend that you become flexible and focus more on Volke's personality than his specific fighting style. Anyways for your stats maybe something like:

Str: 10 (2)
Dex: 16 (10)
Con: 14(6)
Int: 14 (6)
Wis: 12 (4)
Cha: 8

 Unless you want to be the party face. Then you'll want to boost up charisma.

Fighter 2/Rogue 8/Assassin 10 (If you're really set on going into assassin)

Down side is you won't have as many skill points this way but you could try:
Ranger 2/Rogue 8/Assassin 10

For the first build feats would be like:
1) Weapons Finesse, Point Blank Shot, Two Weapon Fighting
2) Quick Draw
3) Rapid shot
6) Precise Shot
9) Then whatever from here on out. Maybe more two weapon fighting stuff.

 The idea is to nab 1 BAB at level 1 so you can get Weapons Finesse. All of the archery feats and quick draw is for throwing alchemist fire and acid flasks at people. They're touch attacks that can be made from a distance and get you sneak attack damage. Or you can buy a ton of daggers and throw those at people and just make attack rolls instead. Eventually when you get Assassin you can poison your daggers and throw a ton of them at people.

 So using this build, you would get +4 to attack from range and in melee using daggers granted a +0 to damage, but that's why you'll be relying on sneak attack for that extra damage.


Aven

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Re: Core Rogue to Assassin
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2009, 11:13:37 PM »
Okay, thank you for the input on that. I don't really consider multiclassing very often, but I think I agree with your idea of using the fighter to start out. I'm definitely going to rethink what I'm doing for this now. Thanks.

DerWille

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Re: Core Rogue to Assassin
« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2009, 11:21:45 PM »
Out of curiosity, how skillful do you want your character to be? If you don't care much about sneaking around Fighter will work just fine. If you do care about it, go with Ranger. It's 2+int mod+1 skills vs 6+int mod+1 skills.

If you went with a Ranger base try something like

Ranger 2/Rogue 8/Assassin 10 and mix the levels to what is convenient for you.
1. Weapons Finesse, Point Blank Shot
2. Two Weapon Fighting
3. Quick Draw
6. Rapid Shot
9. Precise Shot
12+ Whatever you want

Bloody Initiate

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Re: Core Rogue to Assassin
« Reply #4 on: December 05, 2009, 11:30:19 PM »
Go the skillful route. You'll be useless otherwise. 2+int mod with no hide/move silently at lvl one is screwing your effectiveness too hard too fast.

Also never take toughness ever.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2009, 11:32:40 PM by Bloody Initiate »
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DerWille

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Re: Core Rogue to Assassin
« Reply #5 on: December 05, 2009, 11:38:09 PM »
Go the skillful route. You'll be useless otherwise. 2+int mod with no hide/move silently at lvl one is screwing your effectiveness too hard too fast.

 You're right. He should go skillful.

Quote
Also never take toughness ever.

 Quoted for truth.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2009, 04:34:29 AM by DerWille »

Operation Shoestring

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Re: Core Rogue to Assassin
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2009, 03:53:12 AM »
You should start with a rogue level.  More skill points that way.  Unless you *have* to have Wep Finesse at level 1.

Honestly, start with a Shortbow if you are starting at level 1.  Rogues are too squishy to be front-lining at level 1 anyway.

You can get stabby at level 2, when you dip a level of something that gets you a feat (IIRC, if you take track at level1, you can take "any feat you qualify for" at Ranger1/level 2 instead of Track), or just wait for level 3.

Can I ask why Assassin?  Death attack is utterly useless unless you ambush enemies, IMO.  If you have to sit on the side of a fight studying, it'll be almost over by the time you can get a death attack off... and even then it allows a save... and most monsters have good fort saves.

zavule

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Re: Core Rogue to Assassin
« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2009, 05:29:24 AM »
Hmm... could you talk your DM into including the system reference document?  Its technically the complete core of the d20 system.

http://www.d20srd.org/

It'd give you a tiny bit more flexibility, and access to class variants that might be helpful.  

The thug variant of the fighter:  http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#fighterVariantThug

combined with the sneak attack variant:  Some fighters prefer stealth and cunning over martial skill. This variant can also be combined with the thug variant.
Gain Sneak attack (as rogue).


So, as a 1st level human thug, you could have sneak attack, two weapon fighting, and weapon finesse.  You give up some skill points as well as some armor proficiency, but you have d10 hit dice, and you'll likely be wearing light armor anyway.  Thug (sneak attack version) 4 rogue 16 would give you full sneak attack progression, and a base attack bonus of +16.  Add in two weapon fighting feats and that's seven attacks.

« Last Edit: December 06, 2009, 05:40:45 AM by zavule »
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