Author Topic: Legacy Champion - what are some good entries?  (Read 2875 times)

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Akalsaris

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Legacy Champion - what are some good entries?
« on: November 15, 2009, 07:15:22 PM »
So I was looking at the Legacy Champion, from Weapons of Legacy (Pg. 19).  I love the flavor of weapons of legacy, and the customization of the legacy items, so the prestige class has some appeal to me.  So I figured I'd start a thread on it and see what classes people think would go well with it.  If there's enough interest I might make a handbook out of it, though I have no direct experience with the prestige class.

To help with optimizing:
Building a Weapon of Legacy, for dummies

Here's the rundown:
-Druid-like chasis: each level is 3/4 BAB, d8 HP, poor fort/ref and good Will, 4+int skills (Concentration, Decipher Script, Gather Information, Knowledge (history), Use Magic Device, plus existing class skills from all your classes)
-Requires 10th level, the Least Legacy feat, and 5 ranks in knowledge (history) - not difficult at all.
-Advances class features for 8/10 levels (loses at 1st and 7th)
-Has weapon of legacy related abilities - specifically, 2 bonus feats, 3 extra legacies, 3 swap-a-legacy opportunities, and can unlock lesser and greater legacies without paying the GP cost.

Let's assume for the sake of this exercise that the class does not advance prestige classes.  Yes, I know that Hellfire Warlock for an extra 8 levels would be awesome fun, but let's restrict ourselves to base classes for this. 

Some ideas to start it off:
-Shouldn't really use it on anything that doesn't have good class features to advance, like sorcerer or cleric - other PrCs have better options without losing CLs. 
-Most full casters probably won't bother when there are PrCs that grant full casting.
-Likewise, anything with full BAB probably doesn't want to lose BAB by taking levels in this
-Are there any multiclass combos that would benefit from this?  Maybe in combination with ascetic rogue, master spellthief or swift hunter?

-Binder might be a decent choice, this improves the skills from 2 to 4+int but drops the fort save, loses out on mind blank and an extra vestige
-Druid loses 2 levels of AC, and huge elemental form 3/day, and 2 CLs - probably not worth it.
-Bard gains better HP, loses skills and reflex saves, as well as the last inspire courage.  Probably worth it?
-Rogue gains better HP, loses 4 skill ranks.  Rogue 14/Legacy Champion 6 doesn't lose any class abilities.
-Any psionic class might be good with this, as long as it has ways to regain ML.
-Truenamer would be marginally improved...*shudders*
-Factotum 14/Legacy Champion 6 would lose skills and a use of arcane dilettante, 2 IP, and opportunistic piety - maybe not worth it.
-Warlock gains skills and HP, loses a greater invocation and 1d6 EB, some minor DR and energy resistance.  Probably a good trade?


SorO_Lost

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Re: Legacy Champion - what are some good entries?
« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2009, 08:32:28 PM »
Warlock 9 / Binder 1 / Hellfire Warlock 3 / Legacy Champion 7 with a Greater Chasuble of Fell Power and Empower/Maximize Spell-Like Ability.
Has EB 10d6 & Hellfire Blast 18d6? and abuses them both with an Eldritch Glaive.

Sorcerer 6 / Warblade 1 / JPM 4 / Abjurant Champion 5 / Legacy Champion 5.
Casts Shield as a switf action for +13 [shield] to AC and runs around with Greater Luminous Armor for +17 [armor] to AC.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2009, 08:36:12 PM by SorO_Lost »
Tiers explained in 8 sentences. With examples!
[spoiler]Tiers break down into who has spellcasting more than anything else due to spells being better than anything else in the game.
6: Skill based. Commoner, Expert, Samurai.
5: Mundane warrior. Barbarian, Fighter, Monk.
4: Partial casters. Adapt, Hexblade, Paladin, Ranger, Spelltheif.
3: Focused casters. Bard, Beguiler, Dread Necromancer, Martial Adapts, Warmage.
2: Full casters. Favored Soul, Psion, Sorcerer, Wu Jen.
1: Elitists. Artificer, Cleric, Druid, Wizard.
0: Gods. StP Erudite, Illthid Savant, Pun-Pun, Rocks fall & you die.
[/spoiler]

Anklebite

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Re: Legacy Champion - what are some good entries?
« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2009, 11:35:36 PM »
Warlock 9 / Binder 1 / Hellfire Warlock 3 / Legacy Champion 7 with a Greater Chasuble of Fell Power and Empower/Maximize Spell-Like Ability.
Has EB 10d6 & Hellfire Blast 18d6? and abuses them both with an Eldritch Glaive.

Sorcerer 6 / Warblade 1 / JPM 4 / Abjurant Champion 5 / Legacy Champion 5.
Casts Shield as a switf action for +13 [shield] to AC and runs around with Greater Luminous Armor for +17 [armor] to AC.

and can auto-quicken 5th level abjurations.
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PlzBreakMyCampaign

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Re: Legacy Champion - what are some good entries?
« Reply #3 on: November 16, 2009, 11:10:02 AM »
I have good (ab)use of this PrC in my bloodlines handbook. I'm not going to update it to the 'OH DEAR LORD MY EYES' new WotC boards, but its in my compendium.
[Spoiler]
Quote
An interesting read, nice to see a civil discussion
The point of Spell Resistance is to make it harder to get buffed.
And healed. Don't forget that.
Huge amounts of people are fuckwits. That doesn't mean that fuckwit is a valid lifestyle.
[/Spoiler]

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More Funny than Humble[Spoiler]
Quote from: PlzBreakMyCampaign
Your a shifter... you have all you ever need.
It blows MoMF out of the water

But if your greedy for more [Wish] for something that only effects you, like another class level or two that doesn't count against your ECL.
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Rebel7284

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Re: Legacy Champion - what are some good entries?
« Reply #4 on: November 16, 2009, 01:06:01 PM »
The most interesting uses of Legacy Champion I have seen besides hellfire warlock is War Weaver.  Releasing 9th level spells from the tapestry is kinda sexy. 

Limiting it to base classes really hits it's power though.  A roguish build probably loses the least from this (ie: scout, rogue, spellthief)
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TheEndIsNear

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Re: Legacy Champion - what are some good entries?
« Reply #5 on: November 16, 2009, 06:22:32 PM »
I have good (ab)use of this PrC in my bloodlines handbook. I'm not going to update it to the 'OH DEAR LORD MY EYES' new WotC boards, but its in my compendium.

Can't seem to find it, google only find people asking for it...

Do you have a link?

Akalsaris

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Re: Legacy Champion - what are some good entries?
« Reply #6 on: November 16, 2009, 06:30:58 PM »
Here's a character I came up with last night after working through WoL a bit.


Yarick, NE Strongheart Halfling Swordsage 6/Black Dog 4/Legacy Champion 10
(BAB +14, IL 17)
[spoiler]
Note: can replace strongheart halfling with a normal halfling with either a flaw or sacrificing a feat if cross-setting material is an issue

Stats 32 PB
Str: 10
Dex: 20
Con: 14
Int: 10
Wis: 14
Cha: 8

Feats:
1st: Least Mark of Hospitality (Ghallandra)
1st Racial: Adaptive Style
1st bonus: Weapon Focus (Dagger)
3rd: Weapon Finesse
6th: Craven
9th: Two-Weapon Fighting
12th: Shadow Hand
14B: Legacy Focus
15th: Darkstalker
18th: Gloom Razor
18B: Quicken Legacy (Power Word: Blind)

Weapon: Umbral Awn
Bonuses:
Base: +1 dagger
5th: Shadowcloak
7th: +1 ghost touch dagger -> +1 assassination dagger (at 12th with replace least legacy)
8th: +1d6 SA
10th: Shadowhand
11th: Shadowstrike
12th: +1d6 SA
14th: +2 assasination dagger (+1 assassination toxic dagger with replace lesser legacy at 15th)
16th: Invisibility at will
17th: +1d6 SA (+0d6 at 20th with replace greater legacy, instead 2/day Power Word: Blind)
19th: +1 speed assassination dagger
20th: Shadowstep

Maneuvers:
1st: Sudden Leap, Wolf Fang Strike, Shadow Blade Technique, Burning Blade, Counter Charge, Stone Bones
2nd:  Sapphire Nightmare Blade
3rd: Shadow Jaunt
4th: Emerald Razor, Swap Stone Bones for Cloak of Deception
5th: Soaring Raptor Strike
6th: Swap Burning Blade for Shadow Garrote, Strength Draining Strike
12th: Pouncing Charge
13th: Swap Wolf Fang Strike for Dancing Mongoose, Shadow Stride
14th: Rabid Bear Strike
15th: Swap Shadow Garrote for Shadow Noose, Moment of Alacrity
16th: Death in the Dark
18th: Swap Distracting Ember for Raging Mongoose, Shadow Blink
19th: Diamond Defense
20th: 5-Shadow Strike, Swap Sapphire Nightmare Blade for Moment of Clarity

Stances:
1st: Island of Blades
1st: Child of Shadows
5th: Assassin's Stance
12th: Step pf the Dancing Moth
18th: Stance of Alacrity?  Wolf Pack Tactics?


How does it go together?
-With the legacy weapon, Yarick has +5d6+20 SA (2d6 from Assasin's Stance, 1d6 from Assassination, 2d6 from the dagger, +20 from Craven), as well as the ability to trigger SA through his two weak HiPS abilities (Shadowcloak, Lost in the Crowd), his ability to coat squares around him in grease as a swift action, his ability to become invisible at will, and 2/day quickened power word: blind.  With the dagger taking care of setting up sneak attack, Yarick can focus on damage and maneuverability with his maneuvers. 
-With poison use and refined/empowered poisons (black dog) as well as the assassination and toxic abilities, Yarick can do something like 4d6 Con (or 3d6 Dex, 3d8 str, etc) damage at DC X+7 (varies depending on weapon enhancement - so a tooth of leraje or a friendly spellcaster helps immensely), dealing the secondary damage after only 5 rounds. 
-Works as a scout and assassin.[/spoiler]

PlzBreakMyCampaign

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Re: Legacy Champion - what are some good entries?
« Reply #7 on: November 28, 2009, 11:12:59 AM »
I have good (ab)use of this PrC in my bloodlines handbook. I'm not going to update it to the 'OH DEAR LORD MY EYES' new WotC boards, but its in my compendium.

Can't seem to find it, google only find people asking for it...

Do you have a link?
The 339 version is now format fail but I keep backups of my threads in my compendium

edit: arg I meant to reply earlier
[Spoiler]
Quote
An interesting read, nice to see a civil discussion
The point of Spell Resistance is to make it harder to get buffed.
And healed. Don't forget that.
Huge amounts of people are fuckwits. That doesn't mean that fuckwit is a valid lifestyle.
[/Spoiler]

Old Geezer's Law of Hobby Taste: The more objectively inconsequential a hobby is, the more disagreements within the community will be expressed in outrageously insulting, overblown, and ludicrously emotionally laden terms.

More Funny than Humble[Spoiler]
Quote from: PlzBreakMyCampaign
Your a shifter... you have all you ever need.
It blows MoMF out of the water

But if your greedy for more [Wish] for something that only effects you, like another class level or two that doesn't count against your ECL.
Quote from: hungryhungryhippo987
Yes, I'm the 3.0 "Masters of the Wild" shifter, the awesome kind. My favorite form to take is Force Dragon. Yes, I am immortal ... My character is hands down the coolest guy in the campaign and there is nothing I could possibly want.
PBMC gets a cookie for DotA r

wackodraco

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Re: Legacy Champion - what are some good entries?
« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2009, 06:34:07 PM »
Transmuter 5/War Weaver 5/Primal Scholar 5/Legacy Champion 5.
I would personally apply your legacy champion boosts to primal scholar, but they're good on warweaver as well.
With this, expend an action point to regain 9 spell levels. Unfettered Heroism..... yeah.
And war weaver.
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