Author Topic: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)  (Read 20784 times)

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Cephid Arcanis

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #80 on: November 01, 2009, 09:21:09 PM »
Just picked up a ring of X-ray vision. 20' range. Continuously active because I'm immune to ability damage.

Combine that with Lifesense (which causes living creatures to shed light in a 60' radius) and I'll notice anyone within 80' of me. Beyond that I still keep my full AC due to uncanny dodge.

And you can still be immobilised and that takes away your Uncanny dodge benefits. With Ghost trap and 9th level spells that should not be a problem.

Picked up a ring of freedom of movement, so that is fixed too.
That'll save me against the Druid using those jaws of force too.

Safe again. Wicked!

Maybe I should make my spear a spell blade for immunity to ghost trap...

So I still need:
- force immunity/resistance. (beyond a brooch of shielding)
- Some sort of non-detection effect.
- A different type of deadly offence in case they are immune to all my other abilities and my stunning spear.

Is there any way to increase my effective paladin level for the purpose of deadly touch (or laying of hands)?
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Bloody Initiate

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #81 on: November 01, 2009, 11:00:24 PM »
I'd try to optimize a Warforged Juggernaut, simply for the entertainment. I love those guys, they're not great for everything but I enjoy their directness and their knack for slapping around high-level undead. I made one specifically designed to solo Ravenloft so he could end the campaign by slapping Strahd into a wall (Dungeon Crasher goodness). It wasn't necessarily the most optimized thing ever, but it was funny.
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Havok4

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #82 on: November 01, 2009, 11:11:47 PM »
I'd try to optimize a Warforged Juggernaut, simply for the entertainment. I love those guys, they're not great for everything but I enjoy their directness and their knack for slapping around high-level undead. I made one specifically designed to solo Ravenloft so he could end the campaign by slapping Strahd into a wall (Dungeon Crasher goodness). It wasn't necessarily the most optimized thing ever, but it was funny.
It would get even funnier with frenzied berzerker added into the mix.

The_Mad_Linguist

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #83 on: November 01, 2009, 11:31:09 PM »
telekinesis from the ethereal plane.
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Cephid Arcanis

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #84 on: November 01, 2009, 11:41:46 PM »
I'd try to optimize a Warforged Juggernaut, simply for the entertainment.
That would be fun. And they can pick up life sense too. (they do end up with con: - don't they?)
Wicked feat.

telekinesis from the ethereal plane.

You'd have to make attack rolls for combat manuver of violant thrust. And I have freedom of movement against grapple. If you want to throw me I get a will save.
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Bloody Initiate

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #85 on: November 01, 2009, 11:54:42 PM »
I'd try to optimize a Warforged Juggernaut, simply for the entertainment.
That would be fun. And they can pick up life sense too. (they do end up with con: - don't they?)
Wicked feat.

Nope, they keep their constitution score. It makes them rather unique, which is why I like them. There are tons of ways to get immunities to mind-affecting and ability damage/drain (aka Undead/Construct-style immunities), but what I enjoy about Warforged is the part where I'm ACTUALLY a Construct.

Mind-Flayers? Fuck ya! Even if I fail my save against the mind blast (regular warforged aren't immune to mind-affecting out of the box) what are you going to do? Polish my cranial unit with your spittle?

Monsters that want to swallow you? Even if they are willing to eat me (They probably are even though I neither taste nor smell like anything they normally eat) they're probably going to pick me LAST after they've eaten the rest of my party, in which case I would have gotten my unappetizing ass out of there 4 rounds ago.

Monsters that in some way want to eat/steal your essence? Same deal as with the swallowers, dirty jokes aside (AND irrelevant!)

Warforged are probably one of my favorite races if not my favorite, for as many flavor reasons as technical ones.

If they go Juggernaut, take Warforged immunity feats, or find many of the other ways to get all those gorgeous immunities, they're actually better off keeping the con score. They get a bonus to con, which means they'll often have more HP than their con-less cousins, and they'll have a better fort save (Construct type gets all bad saves) for the things that can still force them to make one (Spells and such that specifically target constructs and undead usually give a will save, but occasionally a fort save. It's the obscure shit that breaks builds. Also Disintegrate is not on many lists of immunities since it's not necromancy or a death effect, but having a bad fort save sucks when your opponent specialized in Disintegrate). Oh, and they can still run.

Speaking of running, it's worth mentioning that you can't. There are all kinds of ways to kill most builds, but a lot of builds can just run away. If someone makes something that can get to you and beat you (And chase you if you run away), you might find it an unpleasant surprise that you're incapable of simply RUNNING away. You lose the ability to use the Run action when you have no con score. It may seem irrelevant, until the only thing between you and your final death is the difference between you and your foe's move speed.

« Last Edit: November 02, 2009, 12:06:41 AM by Bloody Initiate »
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Cephid Arcanis

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #86 on: November 02, 2009, 12:16:51 AM »
Speaking of running, it's worth mentioning that you can't. There are all kinds of ways to kill most builds, but a lot of builds can just run away. If someone makes something that can get to you and beat you (And chase you if you run away), you might find it an unpleasant surprise that you're incapable of simply RUNNING away. You lose the ability to use the Run action when you have no con score. It may seem irrelevant, until the only thing between you and your final death is the difference between you and your foe's move speed.

Yeah I should have a look at some fun warforged goodness.

No one can run when ethereal, and if they not ethereal they can't chase me when I am.
And I like that 'If...'! It just keeps getting smaller and smaller with everyones help. Thanks guys.

So any ideas on:
- force immunity/resistance. (beyond a brooch of shielding)
- Some sort of non-detection effect.
- A different type of deadly offence in case they are immune to all my other abilities and my stunning spear?
 
"It is the mark of a practiced mind to be able to entertain an idea without accepting it"

Bloody Initiate

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #87 on: November 02, 2009, 12:46:20 AM »

So any ideas on:
- force immunity/resistance. (beyond a brooch of shielding)
- Some sort of non-detection effect.
- A different type of deadly offence in case they are immune to all my other abilities and my stunning spear?
 


First off, you can't have Force Immunity.

That's the point of Force, it's the attack type that gets through everything. The only thing I personally know of that has immunity to Force is the Force Dragon, which is an epic monster.

So stop looking for that one, that's like asking saying "How do I beat this guy who I can't possibly beat?". It's a contradiction.

As for non-detection, you're hiding in a wall while ethereal. What more do you want? Things in D&D are designed to be beaten. Eventually, someone detects you because it's required by the game that they do. This is like the Force Immunity, you can get so good, but beyond that you're not allowed. After awhile you're not acquiring power, you're acquiring theoretical power.

What you're looking for is immunity to divination and scrying as well as a colossal hide check with hide in plain sight. I like the "Dark" template from Tome of Magic for Hide in Plain Sight, but there are many other places to pick it up (Most of which require a greater investment than a +1 template).

As for attacks, I'm far from a pro optimizer. What you really need is 2 attacks. You need one direct attack that will damage everything, even if it doesn't damage them much, and that you can land against high ACs. Then you need an area attack, which again doesn't have to be uber-powerful but it has to be consistent and reliable.
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Negative Zero

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #88 on: November 02, 2009, 12:48:32 AM »
Forceward from Spell Compendium makes you functionally immune to force.

For non-detection, Mind Blank is the gold standard.

PhaedrusXY

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #89 on: November 02, 2009, 12:53:12 AM »
Vecna blooded for immunity to divinations.
[spoiler]
A couple of water benders, a dike, a flaming arrow, and a few barrels of blasting jelly?

Sounds like the makings of a gay porn film.
...thanks
[/spoiler]

Cephid Arcanis

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #90 on: November 02, 2009, 01:10:12 AM »
Forceward from Spell Compendium makes you functionally immune to force.

For non-detection, Mind Blank is the gold standard.

Any way to get Mind blank without high level casting/powers? Any item?
All other nondetection stuff I have found isn't good enough. The caster gets a fairly low caster level check even against items worth 40,000gp.
Slayer 6 would be great, but I don't know how the hell I would fit that in.

And I can't think of how to get forceward either. Even force resistance:10 would save from most things.
Can a hexblade cast non-hexblade spells from items or scrolls?
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PhaedrusXY

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #91 on: November 02, 2009, 01:14:01 AM »
Any way to get Mind blank without high level casting/powers? Any item?
Third Eye of Conceal. 120,000 gp.
Quote
And I can't think of how to get forceward either. Even force resistance:10 would save from most things.
Can a hexblade cast non-hexblade spells from items or scrolls?
With use magic device ranks. :P
[spoiler]
A couple of water benders, a dike, a flaming arrow, and a few barrels of blasting jelly?

Sounds like the makings of a gay porn film.
...thanks
[/spoiler]

Cephid Arcanis

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #92 on: November 02, 2009, 01:29:34 AM »
As for non-detection, you're hiding in a wall while ethereal. What more do you want?

I WANT TO BE IMMORTAL!!!!!!!!!!! :evillaugh

Specifically, I want to stop stupid F@^%!ng wizards using contact outer plane to find the one or two obscure ways of killing me! If I can do that, there is almost no way someone could justify: "standing at 45.6' to the north of you, at dawn on the 37th of Junedember, I cast a tripple maximised, quadruple empowered, vortex of teeth just as you manifest, about to dominate a anchient force dragon and eat the rest of existance."

...or something. And yes, I think overlapping pumped up vortex of teeth could get me.
i.e. know of me, find me, timestop, teleport in, maximised vortex of teeth x 4 or 5, teleport out. I'd never even know I was dead.

WAIT A MINUTE!!!
I don't die from going below 1 hp until I take a second hit. Would I take all the damage at once? If so, I'd just go ethereal and escape!

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Cephid Arcanis

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #93 on: November 02, 2009, 01:30:50 AM »
Third Eye of Conceal. 120,000 gp.

Damn that is expencive! I can see why thou. I can just afford it. I think.
and 6,000gp to add spell blade (ghost net) to my spear.
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Bloody Initiate

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #94 on: November 02, 2009, 01:38:51 AM »
As for non-detection, you're hiding in a wall while ethereal. What more do you want?

I WANT TO BE IMMORTAL!!!!!!!!!!! :evillaugh

Specifically, I want to stop stupid F@^%!ng wizards using contact outer plane to find the one or two obscure ways of killing me! If I can do that, there is almost no way someone could justify: "standing at 45.6' to the north of you, at dawn on the 37th of Junedember, I cast a tripple maximised, quadruple empowered, vortex of teeth just as you manifest, about to dominate a anchient force dragon and eat the rest of existance."

...or something. And yes, I think overlapping pumped up vortex of teeth could get me.
i.e. know of me, find me, timestop, teleport in, maximised vortex of teeth x 4 or 5, teleport out. I'd never even know I was dead.

WAIT A MINUTE!!!
I don't die from going below 1 hp until I take a second hit. Would I take all the damage at once? If so, I'd just go ethereal and escape!



I know how you feel.

Also, the Necrotic Reserve is only so good. Depending on the attack it may or may not save you. One of our players had it (He was a vampire) and it's really sweet until someone nails you with attacks that by their very nature are multiple attacks (Magic missiles, force missiles, manyjaws, scorching rays, anything twin spelled). They happen all at once but the damage doesn't (You get to apply your resistances more than once) so what normally saves your life (Multiplying your defenses) kills you in the case of Necrotic reserve vs. Heavily metamagic'd multi-ray spells.

The thing is, you weren't going to survive anyway, so it's no big deal.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2009, 01:43:19 AM by Bloody Initiate »
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Cephid Arcanis

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #95 on: November 02, 2009, 01:54:37 AM »
They happen all at once but the damage doesn't (You get to apply your resistances more than once) so what normally saves your life (Multiplying your defenses) kills you in the case of Necrotic reserve vs. Heavily metamagic'd multi-ray spells.

The thing is, you weren't going to survive anyway, so it's no big deal.

Ray spells don't worry me cause of the silly touch AC.
Magic doesn't cause of brooch of shielding.
Force missile would suck if it's an auto hit. Immunity seems more and more necessary.

If things really go bad, I've still got the auto resurection thing, but I really want to save that for an absolute, game ending emergency.

The scariest things so far is actually a bard convincing me to move on! That is some funny shit.

well, that and the permanent anti magic field left by an artificier. Can they really do that?! or is it some sort of custom item?
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Bloody Initiate

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #96 on: November 02, 2009, 02:10:15 AM »
Ray spells don't worry me cause of the silly touch AC.
Magic doesn't cause of brooch of shielding.
Force missile would suck if it's an auto hit. Immunity seems more and more necessary.

If things really go bad, I've still got the auto resurection thing, but I really want to save that for an absolute, game ending emergency.

The scariest things so far is actually a bard convincing me to move on! That is some funny shit.

I was just using Magic Missiles and Scorching Rays as examples of attacks that happen all at once but are seperate attacks. There are other attacks that do this, I just don't feel like scouring every source book for every spell or ability that behaves in this fashion.

As I said before, if you're playing this character, no one can affect you with diplomacy. Diplomacy doesn't work on PCs.

If you're NOT playing this character and it's just an NPC, I hate bards and would do the diplomacy with some level 4 or 5 build that didn't have any levels of bard.
I don't employ memes. Mass-produced ammunition, even from reputable manufacturers, tends to malfunction on occasion.

Cephid Arcanis

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #97 on: November 02, 2009, 02:22:05 AM »
As I said before, if you're playing this character, no one can affect you with diplomacy. Diplomacy doesn't work on PCs.

Sweet! Yet another one down (even if it is a meta game trick/rule).

So I think it is down to permenent AMF's and contact outer plane + the exactly right combo of crazy high level spells.

Any other threats still apply?

Super pumped cleric of the sun turning me too I suppose.
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Negative Zero

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #98 on: November 02, 2009, 02:34:46 AM »
There's a spell (I want to say Lifeward in SpC, but I could be wrong) that gives the undead target immunity to turning.

Anklebite

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Re: HELP KILL MY CHARACTER! (...or help me stop you)
« Reply #99 on: November 02, 2009, 02:36:45 AM »
now that you spent all this time trying to do deal with no-roll no-save force spells, now come up with a way to deal with the transdimensional spell metamagic feat.   and after that, ghost touch weapons and serren wood arrows.  in the end, incorpreality doesn't really save you from anything....


but on that previous note, a transdimensional iceberg would be freakin' hilarious.   "I drop a colosal sized chunk of ice through the ethereal plane at you. 20d6, no saving throw. oh, and you are pinned beneath ethereal ice and snow."
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