Author Topic: [SWSE] Let's have a general Saga Edition thread, ok?  (Read 21072 times)

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Mushroom Ninja

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Re: [SWSE] Let's have a general Saga Edition thread, ok?
« Reply #40 on: January 04, 2010, 03:00:05 AM »
EDIT:  oh, and WOTC's support of Saga, frankly, sucks.  It's a shame, given that Star Wars is such an unpopular and unknown genre and all.  And, Saga strikes me as probably their overall best and most well-put together system.  Bastards.

Well, we were getting new sourcebooks at a pretty steady rate for a while, but it seems to have dried up.  I was really hoping that they'd remake the Arms and Equipment guide for Saga, but I don't see it anywhere on the horizon.   :(

Korwin

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Re: [SWSE] Let's have a general Saga Edition thread, ok?
« Reply #41 on: January 05, 2010, 06:38:06 AM »
I've been pressganged into DM'ing a SWSE adventure and I can't for the life of me find any Wealth By Level.
They're going to start at lvl 5, and beside the extra credits the Zeltron Noble will gain from the Wealthy-talent, I have no idea what they should have.

Does anyone know?

For some reason WotC never decided to grace us with a WBL table.  Apparently we are not worthy.

From here:
Quote
Q: What are the starting credits for a character above 1st level?

A: As a very loose guideline, your wealth at any given level should be something like this: (level x [level -1]) x 2,000 credits*

* Double this for a noble with the Wealth talent.

This basically assumes that roughly 60% of your total income is spent on upkeep, paying rent, buying food, paying taxes, repairing equipment, getting medical care, etc. (This is a much higher rate than in D&D, where you'd only be expected to "burn" about 10% -- but D&D doesn't have an Imperial Revenue Service.)

For example, at 16th level, it should be somewhere around half a million credits.

The reason I say this is a very loose guideline, though, is that at least half of this wealth would tend to be in a non-liquid form (e.g. property, intangibles such as favors and allies, etc.). As a very rough guideline, having someone owe you a favor (i.e. one-time intervention on your behalf, not to exceed one encounter) is worth about 2,000 x CL; having a long-term ally (i.e. someone who will help you out any time they are available) is worth about 40,000 x CL x (% chance that they're available).

ProfessorCirno

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Re: [SWSE] Let's have a general Saga Edition thread, ok?
« Reply #42 on: January 10, 2010, 12:54:21 AM »
To be fair, regarding the wealth levels, while soldier characters with the armor talents can put the money to good use, most characters are fairly limited on what they can buy.  Superior Tech isn't even really available until level...9, I think?  So for most characters, they have their standard gear which is for the most part purchasable within level one or two (depending on how much the noble shares), a weapon or two, and...that's it.  The jedi doesn't even need most of that stuff.  So for most characters, there IS a cap on how good their money will do them.

Unless they want to splurge and create their own starship, of course ;)

...Oh, uh, also, hello!
"Can I make it absolutely clear, here, now, that I'm only here because the producers said I had to be. I don't like snow, I hate being cold, I hate outdoor pursuits, I hate the idea that I've got to "push my body to find the limit," I can't stand this stupid clothing that makes this rustling noise when you move all the time, and I hate the zips, and the toggles, and all the pockets, and that and I hate your stupid truck."

"Listen. If we make it, look at it this way: you will be the first person ever to go to the North Pole who didn't want to be there."

Mushroom Ninja

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Re: [SWSE] Let's have a general Saga Edition thread, ok?
« Reply #43 on: January 10, 2010, 02:06:01 AM »
Well, there's droids also. 

Korwin

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Re: [SWSE] Let's have a general Saga Edition thread, ok?
« Reply #44 on: February 12, 2010, 06:17:27 AM »
hmm, bump.

Also I reformated my build archive otherwhere. (like the formating better)

Anyone read the Skill Challenges in Galaxy of Intrigue.
First impression is - ignore that chapter... but has anyone a different opinion?


j0lt

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Re: [SWSE] Let's have a general Saga Edition thread, ok?
« Reply #45 on: February 12, 2010, 09:21:43 AM »
Is it the same as skill challenges from 4e (a series of related skill checks, if you succeed on X number before failing on Y number, you win the encounter)?
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Korwin

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Re: [SWSE] Let's have a general Saga Edition thread, ok?
« Reply #46 on: February 15, 2010, 04:29:59 PM »
Is it the same as skill challenges from 4e (a series of related skill checks, if you succeed on X number before failing on Y number, you win the encounter)?

Basically.

I heard they changed the DC's
Code: [Select]
CL 01 - Easy DC 13 - Heroic DC 31
CL 20 - Easy DC 26 - Heroic DC 46
and they added Challenge Effects which modify the skill challenges
  • Antagonist
  • Catastrophic Failure
  • Changing Objectives
  • Close Call
  • Containment
  • Degenerating
  • Degrees of Failure
  • Degrees of Success
  • Extreme Success
  • Individual Effort
  • Initiative
  • Opposed DC
  • Recovery
  • Restricted Skills
  • Second Effort
  • Timed Challenge
To pick on effect, Antagonist. Here the Players dont fail due to their own mistakes, but they fail if the enemy has enough sucesses.

Shadowhunter

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Re: [SWSE] Let's have a general Saga Edition thread, ok?
« Reply #47 on: September 29, 2011, 09:24:36 PM »
I will do some good and proper threadomancy here.
Because I think it's better to have this in one place than scattered throughout multiple topics.

Aiming is Good.

This is the evolved idea that I had when I first started with the threshold-abusing sniper.

What is this?
It's a single-target ranged lockdown build. It limits your target to such few actions eventually that they might as well huddle up and die, because they're not going to contribute in this battle as long as you can hit them.

What is it not?
This is not a character that can put the hurt on many opponents at once. Leave that to the AoE or full attack party members.

What is it good against?
Anything that can be stunned.

What is it bad against?
Anything that can't be stunned.

What do you need?
Core Rulebook.
Galaxy at War.
The Unknown Regions.
Scum and Villainy.
Maybe Starships of the Galaxy.
Maybe Clone Wars Campaign Guide.

So, your basic build will be largely dependent on picking the Gunslinger prestige class. You can actually graft this onto any combination of base classes that won't be needing any Talents later on in the game, so it doesn't constrict you as much as some other builds. That said, Gunslinger do require a bunch of feats, but feats are less valuable than Talents in SWSE.
So take any combination of classes you like, but try to have as high of a BAB as possible.
You won't have to have any talents to qualify for this trick (though a level 1 dip into Scoundrel really won't hurt. More on that later).
Neither do you really have to be any race. But I'd advice against anything with a Dex-penalty, since that eats into your accuracy.
Make sure that you have weapon proficiency (pistols), you'll have it from the start unless the only class you have picked is Jedi.

You're going to be using some feats and some talents, let's have a look at them, shall we?

Feats:[spoiler]
QUICK DRAW
You can draw and holster weapons with startling quickness.
Prerequisite: Base attack bonus + 1.
Benefit: You can draw or holster a weapon as a swift action instead of as a move action.

Prerequisite for Gunslinger. Also thematically cool.

POINT BLANK SHOT
You are skilled at making well-placed shots with ranged weapons at point
blank range.
Benefit: You get a + 1 bonus on attack and damage rolls with ranged weapons against opponents within point blank range (see Table 8-5: Weapon
Ranges, page 129).


Prerequisite for Gunslinger and Deadeye. It's a staple of ranged builds, what can I say?
Scoundrels get it for free.

PRECISE SHOT
You are skilled at timing your ranged attacks so that you don't hit your
allies by mistake.
Prerequisite: Point Blank Shot.
Benefit: You can shoot or throw a ranged weapon at an opponent engaged in melee combat with one or more of your allies without tak ing the
standard -5 penalty (see Shooting or Throwing into a Melee, page 161).


Another prereq. for both Gunslinger and Deadeye. Now your opponent won't be able to hide from your calculating wrath even if he does rush your tanking buddy. Too bad for him. :rollseyes

DEADEYE
You are skilled at picking off enemies with well-aimed ranged attacks.
Prerequisites: Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, base attack bonus +4.
Benefit: If you aim before making a ranged attack (see Aim, page 154) and the attack hits, increase the damage you deal by an additional weapon
die. For example, if you score a hit with a blaster pistol using the Deadeye feat, the blaster shot deals 4d6 points of damage (instead of the normal 3d6 points).
The effects of this feat do not stack with the extra damage provided by the Burst Fire or Rapid Shot feat.


The original reason why I started looking at ways to improve aiming. You'll take this. No ifs, no buts.

CAREFUL SHOT
You are particularly skilled at aiming your attacks.
Prerequisites: Point Blank Shot, base attack bonus +2.
Benefit: If you aim before making a ranged attack (see Aim on page 154), you gain a + 1 bonus on your attack roll.


Accuracy is good.
[/spoiler]

Talents:
[spoiler]Now, there's two talent trees you will be using. The Gunslinger and the Sharpshooter ones.

Gunslinger Talent Tree -
Core:
Debilitating Shot: If you aim before making a ranged attack (see Aim, page 154), you move the target character -1 step along the condition track if the attack deals damage (see Conditions, page 148).


Staple. Really good. Stupidly good. Use it.

The Unknown Regions.
Slowing Shot: If you successfully use Debilitating Shot, until the target moves to the normal state on the condition track or until the end of the encounter, the target's speed is reduced by 2 squares, and it loses its Dexterity bonus to its Reflex Defense and is considered flat-footed. These effects occur in addition to the effect of Debilitating Shot (see page 216 of the Saga Edition core rulebook). If you spend a Force Point, the target's speed is reduced by 4 squares or half of its normal speed, whichever is the greater reduction.
Prerequisite: Debilitating Shot.

Not a bad de-buff. Stacking it with the later ones will cause major shenanigans.


Sharpshooter Talent Tree (found in Galaxy of War)-

Precision Shot: When using the aim action, you gain the benefit of the Point Blank Shot feat against your target, regardless or range category.
Prerequisite: Far Shot feat.


Ok, it's not that overwhelming, but it's a prerequisite for the later ones and it does make the feat better. Every piece of accuracy helps. Remember, it's more important that you hit than that you deal significant damage. Accuracy -> Damage in this build.


Pinning Shot: You can keep your target worrying about where the next shot is coming from instead of trying to flee. When you deal damage to an enemy you have aimed at, the target's speed is reduced to 2 squares, and the target cannot take either a double move action or use the run action until the end of your next turn. This is a stunning effect.
Perquisite: Precision Shot.

Now we're talking. Note the wording on Slowing Shot and Pinning Shot.
Slowing reduce by 2 squares.
Pinning reduce to 2 squares.
SWSE have no rule on what effect activates first.
Now the opponent have a mighty speed of 0 squares. Even if you don't have Slowing Shot (which is only good if you can capitalize on the target being flat-footed and loosing Dex), all he can do is to move 2 squares. He can't move twice or run. He's not going anywhere.

Harrying Shot: When you make a successful ranged attack against an enemy that you have aimed at and the attack deals damage, the target cannot use a standard action to make an attack roll on his or her next turn. This counts as a stunning effect.
Prerequisite: Pinning Shot, Precision Shot.


Ok. So, he can't move properly. He can't attack normally either. I don't know the technicalities of whether or he can still full attack though, so I give no guarantees on that part.
[/spoiler]

The benefit of a 1 level dip into Scoundrel:

[spoiler]You gain Point Blank Shot as a bonus feat.
You also gain a talent, which should be the Missfortune Tree Dastardly Strike.

Dastardly Strike: Whenever you make a successful attack against an opponent that is denied its Dexterity
bonus to Reflex Defense, the target moves -1 step along the condition track (see Conditions, page 148).


Remember what I said about taking advantage of the targets flat-footedness?
This is primarily it.
If you have another Scoundrel on your team that have been picking up Sneak Attack talents, she'll adore you.
[/spoiler]

Proper gear for the job:[spoiler]
Get yourself a modified rifle of some sort. Remember that no part of your build hinges on you using a pistol, the talents and feats are all compatible with other weapons. Avoid the Blaster Rifle, Sniper from Scum and Villainy. It's inferior to the BlastTech DLT-20A from the Clone Wars Campaign setting.
Same damage, no need for a tripod, no accuracy loss if you don't aim (not that you should ever not aim, but you might lack actions for some reason), cheaper, option for autofire and, most importantly, not guaranteed to only have a magazine size of 10 shots.
The Sniper Rifle have only 10 shots before you need to reload, the DLT lacks that information. Since the standard seems to be 50 shots for such a rifle, I assume that's the magazine size. Even if it's only 10 according to your GM, it's cheaper and better.

Note that you can use a pistol if you like. There's no stopping you. But I do like my base 31d0 rifles into 4d10 with Deadeye :D

Double Trigger is a weapon mod from Scum and Villainy.
You get another +1 to hit if you use Careful Shot.

Tech Specialist is from Starships of the Galaxy and the upgraded version is in Scum and Villainy.
You don't have to be the specialist yourself if you can find someone for you to do it.
This equates into either a +1 or +2 equipment bonus to accuracy.[/spoiler]

There.
[Spoiler]
Quote from: Runestar
the most effective optimization is the one you can actually get away with.  :smirk

Quote from: Vinom
(A group of nerds are called a murder because like crows we are anti-social, like shiny things, and often squack at each other over nothing for hours)

I often have to remind people not to underrate divination.  The ability to effectively metagame without actually metagaming beats the ability to set things on fire more times than not.
[/quote]
[/spoiler]

Binder? You're Welcome

Zceryll makes Binders go from tier 3 to tier 2.
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