Author Topic: Auto-crit or auto-dodge or infinite damage  (Read 3474 times)

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Squash Monster

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Auto-crit or auto-dodge or infinite damage
« on: June 04, 2008, 06:17:19 AM »
This is only available at level 30, which is good because it's hideously broken.

If I may direct your attention to the capstone ability of the Demigod epic destiny, Divine Miracle, you will notice that it essentially turns your encounter powers into at-will powers as soon as you run out of encounter powers.  You will also notice that this is all encounter powers, not just attack powers.

A friend of mine noticed something very interesting; if you had a minor-action encounter power, you could alternate between that and a standard-action encounter power at will.

Then it hit me: you can use an immediate interrupt action at will as well.

If you play an elf or a halfling, you have a racial encounter power that fits this bill nicely.  With Elven Accuracy, you can continue to reroll attacks until you get a natural 20.  With Second Chance, your opponent rerolls until he gets a 1.

Or, if you happen to be an Astral Weapon who owns a Vorpal Weapon, you can repeatedly use Pray For More until you have an arbitrarily high amount of damage.

At this point, your elf paladin / astral weapon / demigod can auto-hit and automatically do infinite damage, as soon as you run out of encounter powers.  You simply need to make sure that you have as few other encounter powers as possible so you can trigger this early and often.


So, that's three game-breaking ways to use Divine Miracle.  Which of them actually work?

EDIT: Wizard gets Displacement, which is the halfling racial power for everybody within 5 squares; you could get this through multiclassing if you like.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2008, 06:24:48 AM by Squash Monster »

Runestar

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Re: Auto-crit or auto-dodge or infinite damage
« Reply #1 on: June 04, 2008, 06:34:53 AM »
Aren't you limited to just 1 immediate action/round, same as with 3e?

Interesting. If you could get a minor-action, move action and standard action encounter power, you could cycle through all 3 of them each round. Though it seems extremely difficult to find a class which can manage this, much less a combination of 3 which interact well with one another. We have no shortage of standard action encounter powers, but minor and move action ones seem to be sorely lacking.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2008, 06:54:51 AM by Runestar »
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heffroncm

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Re: Auto-crit or auto-dodge or infinite damage
« Reply #2 on: June 04, 2008, 09:18:41 AM »
I think this might be best suited with a Cleric.  Healing Word is an Encounter power, qualifying it for Divine Miracle.  Having an infinitite supply of Healing Surge triggers, you can then procede to expened all of your Encounter powers in the first few minutes of each day, and then choose not to partake in any Short Rests.  That way, you never refresh your Encounter powers, and go through the entire day with Divine Miracle active and huge Healing Surges for everyone.

AlienFromBeyond

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Re: Auto-crit or auto-dodge or infinite damage
« Reply #3 on: June 04, 2008, 11:14:12 AM »
Then it hit me: you can use an immediate interrupt action at will as well.

If you play an elf or a halfling, you have a racial encounter power that fits this bill nicely.  With Elven Accuracy, you can continue to reroll attacks until you get a natural 20.

Or, if you happen to be an Astral Weapon who owns a Vorpal Weapon, you can repeatedly use Pray For More until you have an arbitrarily high amount of damage.
These are better than immediate interrupts, these are Free Actions on your turn (can't use Immediate Interrupts on your own turn).

Grats on finding that interaction. I knew Demigod's level 30 power was insane :).

EDIT: Elven Accuracy spam might not work, not on the same attack anyways. It mentions using the second roll, so you might end up using whatever you rolled the 2nd time, and not the 67th time or whatever. Just a possible interpretation warning.

EDIT2: If the Demigod power works on the Channel Divinities you can use infinite Divine Fortune to succeed on all saving throws and for a massive bonus to hit. Only a 1 would miss, which you could reroll as an Elf to make your chance to miss 1/400.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2008, 11:23:58 AM by PerfectPrefect »

Runestar

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Re: Auto-crit or auto-dodge or infinite damage
« Reply #4 on: June 04, 2008, 12:38:13 PM »
Quote
EDIT: Elven Accuracy spam might not work, not on the same attack anyways. It mentions using the second roll, so you might end up using whatever you rolled the 2nd time, and not the 67th time or whatever. Just a possible interpretation warning.

Did wotc simply get lucky with this one, or are they actually catching on to us... :P

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tsuyoshikentsu

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Re: Auto-crit or auto-dodge or infinite damage
« Reply #5 on: June 04, 2008, 03:06:59 PM »
Elf Warlock/Blood Mage/Demigod.  Yay, we broke 4E before it even came out.
Anyway, this cake is great!  It's so delicious and moist.

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Tshern

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Re: Auto-crit or auto-dodge or infinite damage
« Reply #6 on: June 04, 2008, 03:20:51 PM »
Elf Warlock/Blood Mage/Demigod.  Yay, we broke 4E before it even came out.
Kind of sad, isn't it? They tried so hard to make it playable..

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Squash Monster

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Re: Auto-crit or auto-dodge or infinite damage
« Reply #7 on: June 04, 2008, 04:33:26 PM »
Elf Warlock/Blood Mage/Demigod.  Yay, we broke 4E before it even came out.
I haven't been keeping up on my blood mage cheese.  What does this do that makes it worth sacrificing the infinite damage from astral weapon?  Other than being a better 1 to 30 build, that is.


Level 30 build snapshot for the paladin version:
Elf Paladin / Warlod / Astral Weapon / Demigod
Important Items:
Vorpal anything
Encounter Powers:
Chimera Battlestrike (hits all adjacent enemies, and it's a minor action)
Benign Transposition (gives additional mobility)
Hand of the Gods (minor action makes it easier to spend)
Carving a Path of Light (can't have Pray for More without it)
Pray for More (infinite damage)
Elven Accuracy (auto-hit)

You have to spend all your encounter powers to trigger your trick.  That will take two turns, as you have two minor actions and two standard actions needed.

Once you are out of powers, do the following each turn:
Move towards an enemy (move action)
Use Benign Transposition (standard action) to cover the last few squares - recover Chimera Battlestrike
Use Chimera Battlestrike (minor action) to attack all adjacent enemies - recover Elven Accuracy
Use Elven Accuracy (free action) until satisfied with the roll - recover Pray for More
Use Pray For More (free action) and your vorpal weapon until satisfied with damage - recover Elven Accuracy
Repeat last two steps until all your attack rolls have been made - recover Benign Transposition
Wait until your next turn.

tsuyoshikentsu

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Re: Auto-crit or auto-dodge or infinite damage
« Reply #8 on: June 04, 2008, 04:35:48 PM »
Well, Blood Pulse is an ancounter ability, right?  And if you multiclass, so is Thunderwhatever.
Anyway, this cake is great!  It's so delicious and moist.

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Squash Monster

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Re: Auto-crit or auto-dodge or infinite damage
« Reply #9 on: June 04, 2008, 04:56:10 PM »
Right, but that takes two rounds and does 2d6+2d10+int, then 2d10+5d6+con, with another +d6 per point of int bonus damage to one person (or so claims the thread, I'm sure it's went up a bit).  As opposed to Pray For More / Vorpal, which does damage until you're sick of doing damage.

Adslahnit

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Re: Auto-crit or auto-dodge or infinite damage
« Reply #10 on: June 04, 2008, 05:23:18 PM »
Then it hit me: you can use an immediate interrupt action at will as well.

Nope, you only get one immediate interrupt/reaction per round.

If you play an elf or a halfling, you have a racial encounter power that fits this bill nicely.  With Elven Accuracy, you can continue to reroll attacks until you get a natural 20.  With Second Chance, your opponent rerolls until he gets a 1.

Elven Accuracy makes you use the second roll. Not the third roll or the fourth roll that came up for whatever reason, but the second attack roll. Second Chance is an immediate reaction, and once again, you only get one immediate interruption/reaction per round.

Or, if you happen to be an Astral Weapon who owns a Vorpal Weapon, you can repeatedly use Pray For More until you have an arbitrarily high amount of damage.

At this point, your elf paladin / astral weapon / demigod can auto-hit and automatically do infinite damage, as soon as you run out of encounter powers.  You simply need to make sure that you have as few other encounter powers as possible so you can trigger this early and often.

Pray for More also has the "second roll" restriction, just like Elven Accuracy, so that doesn't exactly work.

AlienFromBeyond

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Re: Auto-crit or auto-dodge or infinite damage
« Reply #11 on: June 04, 2008, 05:42:34 PM »
Then it hit me: you can use an immediate interrupt action at will as well.

Nope, you only get one immediate interrupt/reaction per round.

If you play an elf or a halfling, you have a racial encounter power that fits this bill nicely.  With Elven Accuracy, you can continue to reroll attacks until you get a natural 20.  With Second Chance, your opponent rerolls until he gets a 1.

Elven Accuracy makes you use the second roll. Not the third roll or the fourth roll that came up for whatever reason, but the second attack roll. Second Chance is an immediate reaction, and once again, you only get one immediate interruption/reaction per round.

Or, if you happen to be an Astral Weapon who owns a Vorpal Weapon, you can repeatedly use Pray For More until you have an arbitrarily high amount of damage.

At this point, your elf paladin / astral weapon / demigod can auto-hit and automatically do infinite damage, as soon as you run out of encounter powers.  You simply need to make sure that you have as few other encounter powers as possible so you can trigger this early and often.

Pray for More also has the "second roll" restriction, just like Elven Accuracy, so that doesn't exactly work.
Man, I'm so good at predicting this would happen. The second roll restriction is a doozy, and I think it's pretty obvious which way WotC will go once we ask them.

Mass Divine Fortune spam still works though I think.

Adslahnit

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Re: Auto-crit or auto-dodge or infinite damage
« Reply #12 on: June 04, 2008, 06:23:26 PM »
Mass Divine Fortune spam still works though I think.

Except that Divine Fortune is a class feature, not a power. And even if it were an actual power, you'd get stopped by the "bonuses from the same source don't stack" rule which was carried over from 3.5.

I remember seeing you on /tg/ once. We happen to be discussing this right now:
http://zip.4chan.org/tg/res/1902297.html

AlienFromBeyond

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Re: Auto-crit or auto-dodge or infinite damage
« Reply #13 on: June 04, 2008, 07:36:57 PM »
Mass Divine Fortune spam still works though I think.

Except that Divine Fortune is a class feature, not a power. And even if it were an actual power, you'd get stopped by the "bonuses from the same source don't stack" rule which was carried over from 3.5.

I remember seeing you on /tg/ once. We happen to be discussing this right now:
http://zip.4chan.org/tg/res/1902297.html
Hmm, good point. Thought Channel Divinity worked liked Divine Challenge, in that it is both a class feature and a power at the same time.