K's Revised Necromancer Handbook

[Felix Underwood]

Hey, I just found a 1-level dip for slightly tougher undead for Dread Necros.

Wizard (Necromancer) 1. 

For some goofy reason, I thought that the Unearthed Arcana necromancer variant had the same ability name as the Dread Necromancer's 8th level class feature...  I just double checked and the ability name is different.

[snakeman830]

Hey, I just found a 1-level dip for slightly tougher undead for Dread Necros.

Wizard (Necromancer) 1. 

For some goofy reason, I thought that the Unearthed Arcana necromancer variant had the same ability name as the Dread Necromancer's 8th level class feature...  I just double checked and the ability name is different.

Yup.  So they stack (at least the hit points do).  I'll be doing this next time I attempt a DN.

[JaronK]

I don't think it's worthwhile for the lost caster level and slower class ability progression.  Corpse Crafter + Desecrate ought to be enough.

JaronK

[snakeman830]

I don't think it's worthwhile for the lost caster level and slower class ability progression.  Corpse Crafter + Desecrate ought to be enough.

JaronK

This is where I disagree.  One caster level is easy enough to make up and Dread Necros don't even lose spells known (except for the one from Advanced Learning).  I think that the ability to suddenly use countless magic items and the extra bit of hp is a worthwhile trade for one spell known and (kinda-)lichdom; both of which you'll get if you go epic (level 21 feat better be Craft Epic Wonderous Item).

[Brainpiercing]

I don't think it's worthwhile for the lost caster level and slower class ability progression.  Corpse Crafter + Desecrate ought to be enough.

JaronK

This is where I disagree.  One caster level is easy enough to make up and Dread Necros don't even lose spells known (except for the one from Advanced Learning).  I think that the ability to suddenly use countless magic items and the extra bit of hp is a worthwhile trade for one spell known and (kinda-)lichdom; both of which you'll get if you go epic (level 21 feat better be Craft Epic Wonderous Item).

Hmm, I would tend to agree with JaronK here. At least you need to make this a fairly late dip, i.e. level 9 or so.

[snakeman830]

Hmm, I would tend to agree with JaronK here. At least you need to make this a fairly late dip, i.e. level 9 or so.

Naturally.  Taking it before you get acces to Animate Dead really is shooting yourself in the foot since you just delayed the reason you took it.  Post level 9, it's a pretty good choice IMO.

[Akalsaris]

Would also be handy on a necromancy-focused ultimate magus build, I suppose.

[Treant]

If a Dread Necromaner and their Necromancer cohort used Cooperative Spell Metamagic to cast either Animate Dead or Fell Animate ____, would both of the class features apply to the created undead?

If the cohort had the Corpsecrafter feats would they be applied as well?

Would any of the free animation techniques remove the additional gems from this feat? (http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Graveborn_Warrior)

If the cohort had the Graveborn Warrior feat would that be applied as well? (see question 2)

Would a Fell Animate Desecrate only provide +2hp/level +2hp to undead? (http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Fell_Energy_Spell)

[Akalsaris]

Here's a nifty little thing I found for wiz/sorc necromancers: the Blackwater Taint spell from Stormwrack (Wiz/Sorc 6) creates a Desecrate effect on the water it's cast on (so cast it in a pool).  Handy as a free mid-level way to get desecrate for creating undead if you don't want to hire a cleric or buy an item with it.

[McPoyo]

Any way to get Fell Energy tacked onto any of the undead creation spells in such a way as to boost their stats? Maybe via Fell Energy Desecrate? The spell boosts undead created, so I could see an argument for it...

[blacklitelust]

Here's a nifty little thing I found for wiz/sorc necromancers: the Blackwater Taint spell from Stormwrack (Wiz/Sorc 6) creates a Desecrate effect on the water it's cast on (so cast it in a pool).  Handy as a free mid-level way to get desecrate for creating undead if you don't want to hire a cleric or buy an item with it.

What would happen if you were to cast it on an everful mug of water (or other source of infinite water) and use it to pour a small puddle over the corpse you wish to reanimate, always leaving a little water in the container to maintain the taint? Would this work? Could you cast Permanency on it as well?

[PhaedrusXY]

Any way to get Fell Energy tacked onto any of the undead creation spells in such a way as to boost their stats? Maybe via Fell Energy Desecrate? The spell boosts undead created, so I could see an argument for it...

You could probably manage something like this by starting out with one of the combos that they use for the crazy Locate City bomb. Add Flashfrost or whatever that feat is that adds cold damage to a spell, then the rest. This is assuming Fell Energy requires the spell to do damage.

[McPoyo]

Any way to get Fell Energy tacked onto any of the undead creation spells in such a way as to boost their stats? Maybe via Fell Energy Desecrate? The spell boosts undead created, so I could see an argument for it...

You could probably manage something like this by starting out with one of the combos that they use for the crazy Locate City bomb. Add Flashfrost or whatever that feat is that adds cold damage to a spell, then the rest. This is assuming Fell Energy requires the spell to do damage.

Fell Energy is the one that boosts stat enhancements for undead.

[deuxhero]

The guide makes a big deal that dread necro and wizard don't get desecrate. There is an obscure internet item Ring of Desecration that fixes the issue for fairly cheep.

[snakeman830]

The guide makes a big deal that dread necro and wizard don't get desecrate. There is an obscure internet item Ring of Desecration that fixes the issue for fairly cheep.

There's a 4,000gp ring in Complete Mage (Deadwalker's ring) that gives them the +2hp bonus that they're looking for.  Sure, it only works 3/day, but how many times are you creating undead more than 3/day?

[adecoy95]

are there any ways besides rebuke to control undead created by the create undead line of spells?

[Littha]

the Lord of the dead PRC could be interesting for free animate dead...

[snakeman830]

are there any ways besides rebuke to control undead created by the create undead line of spells?

There are a couple of spells that the undead can unfortunately resist with Will saves.  Master of Undeath, however, let's you control one undead that you create with a spell for caster level days without having it count against your limit.  After that time period is up, it turns hostile, but that gives you plenty of time to figure out what you're doing with it before then.

[Littha]

Command undead works pretty well on unintelegent undead

[bearsarebrown]

Anyone looked into Horned Harbringer? You loose all spellcasting but it's really cool!

XXX 5/Horned Harbringer 10/XXX 5

Assuming XXX is all full spellcasting, your Undead Controlling limit is (20+Cha)*10. And you get SpA.