Planning for a gestalt campaign

[Amaranth]

Hey, all.

I'm planning a character for a gestalt campaign and I was hoping to enlist the aid of some other gamers.  Before going into the outline of what I want to do, I should explain a bit about the campaign.  The standard prohibition that gestalt characters cannot take "combination" prestige classes (ex. mystic theurge) has been lifted, with the understanding that the DM will be able to do the same thing when making NPC's. 

That said, I'm planning a multiple threat character with full progression on wizard (conjurer, for abrupt jaunt) and either psion (telepath) or erudite.  I also plan to work in Ur-Priest, though if the benefit is high enough I may be willing to delay entering it for a level or two.  So what I'm looking for is something to do that works with Ur-Priest/Wiz/Psi advancement.

I have 4 primary ideas (though I'm sure there are more that I haven't thought of) that I think will work well.
* all have the common progression:
Wiz/Psi
Wiz/Psi
Wiz/Psi
Cerebromancer/XXXXXX
Cerebromancer/XXXXXX
Cerebromancer/Ur-Priest
...

1) Throw in a savage bard level for the fort save and skill requirements, and enter sublime chord at 10th level and use cerebromancer/mystic theurge or psychic theurge/ultimate magus (improving Wiz casting at 1,4,7).
****I've pretty well ruled this out because I can't manage to support three high ability scores with a 34 point buy

2) Warblade at 4th, warlock at 5th, then psychic theurge/eldritch theurge until I max out Ur-priest spellcasting.
**** Gives some decent abilities(DR, constant fly/invisibility), but by the level I would get them I should be able to emulate those with items or spells.  And if I ever need eldritch blast on a character with that much firepower, I'll have to have screwed up something awful.

3) Warblade at 4th, Binder at 5th, Ur Priest/Cerebromancer for 6th and 7th then Anima Mage/Psychic Theurge.
**** This gives me a big advantage in the Vestige Metamagic/Vestige Casting fronts (I'm thinking of persistent spell).  This build does, however, only offer me some relatively weak abilities from the actual vestiges and it depends on either taking Human or Strongheart Halfling for race, or talking my DM into allowing flaws to enter at the lowest levels.

4) Warblade at 4th, Incarnate at 5th, Ur-priest/Cerebromancer for 6th and 7th, then 6 levels of sapphire heirophant/cerebromancer.
**** This faces basically the same issues as the Binder, but I think the soulmeld abilities are a bit better than most of the vestige abilities (though I won't be able to bind to many chakras, heck, only one unless I blow feats at 9 and 12).  I'd still be short on feats unless I manage to talk the DM into allowing two flaws, or one flaw and play a race that gives a bonus feat.  I would try to meet the prereq's for sapphire heirophant by taking the following feat progression
1) spell focus (evil)
1) Iron will
1) Shape soulmeld (threefold mask of the chimera) *** between Impulse Boots and this, I should be safe from sneak attacks
3) Arcane Disciple (law) *** for access to the law domain
6) Bonus Essentia


By no means am I limiting myself to these options, however.  If anyone has better ideas, the only things I can't budge on are full progression for wizard spellcasting and psionic manifesting.  I'd really like to keep Ur-priest, but I could be sold on something else.  All critiques and advice welcome!

Thanks,
Amaranth

[Emy]

If you're combining Psion manifesting, Wizard casting, and Ur-Priest casting, you could take the Academic Priest [Dragonlance: Legends of the Twins] feat to be entirely Int based (except save DCs for Ur-Priest spells).

[Havok4]

If you are going to be a wizard as well as a full cleric it would be somewhat pointless to take erudite as you will have plenty of versatility anyway. So just go psion.  I would recomend a shaper as you can do some really fun things with astral construct and psionic minor creation. The higher level powers are fairly nice as well.

[Whiplord]

If you are going to be a wizard as well as a full cleric it would be somewhat pointless to take erudite as you will have plenty of versatility anyway. So just go psion.  I would recomend a shaper as you can do some really fun things with astral construct and psionic minor creation. The higher level powers are fairly nice as well.

I've always much preferred simply grabbing Astral Construct via Expanded Knowledge. Telepath's powers seemed much better in general.

[Havok4]

That depends on what you face most of the time. The shaper's powers work on pretty much anything all of the time. Whereas the telepath's powers are useless against a large number of creatures. Also the telepath's powers are rendered useless by a single spell (unless you pick up shatter mind blank or spend actions dispelling). But against those it does effect it tends to be more powerful so the most effective choice is based off your campaign.

[Kuroimaken]

Wow, talk about an absolute multi-threat, dude.

Alright, let's see what I can help with here.

First off, MAD is an obvious enemy. You might wanna ask yourself if you even NEED that much firepower - heck, starting with Wiz/Cleric and going MT/Warblade would already make you a one-man killing machine on pretty much every count. Having played quite a bit with Binders, I should tell you that their abilities aren't really as easily tossable as you might think - depending on what you intend to do with your character, Binder goes a long way towards saving yourself some resources.

First off, all Binder abilities are (Su), which is great if your DM likes to toss critters with spell resistance at you (and trust me, Conjuration spells are awesome but they can't really deal with EVERYTHING). At the higher levels you also tend to have a myriad assortment of passive abilities in addition to "stranger" options, including a bunch of immunities and resistances (Acererak bind is notorious for this). The psionic vestiges from the website will save you plenty of slots that you'd normally reserve towards divination spells (Tryad, I'm looking at you). You will also be able to craft magic items without taking up item creation feats, which saves you some slots too, by binding Astaroth. If you wanna go with sword-slinging, you can just bind Vestiges that help you with that, and enhance yourself with spells later without worrying much about duration...

In short, I wouldn't advise to take Binders lightly, particularly when it comes to gestalt. You don't need too high a Charisma score to not fear failing Binding checks if you invest in some binding implements, too.

I can't really offer much advice in terms of Incarnum builds, unfortunately.

Stay the hell away from Warlock. Everything he does, you can do better with freaking RESERVE FEATS.

[Rebel7284]

what level are you starting at and how is your DM treating LA and racial HD?

[Amaranth]

We're starting at 3rd level, advancements can be planned out for LA or HD races (on one side of the build), but I don't want to give up caster levels unless I have to.  I doubt I'd be allowed to take LA as one half of the build after having taken class levels on that side (unless they were in an acquired template such as lich, vampire, etc).

I guess I'd be willing to give up one level (on one side) to LA if the benefits were synergistic with the arcane/psionic focus and/or gave a significant boon to Int.

[Rebel7284]

Phrenic Lesser Tiefling +2 Dex +4 Int +2 Wis +2 Cha  OR
Phrenic Lesser Aasimar +2 Int +4 Wis, +6 Cha

[The_Mad_Linguist]

Phrenic Lesser Tiefling +2 Dex +4 Int +2 Wis +2 Cha  OR
Phrenic Lesser Aasimar +2 Int +4 Wis, +6 Cha

Ahem

Phrenic Lesser Fey'ri +2 Dex, +6 int -2 Con, Change Shape into any humanoid at will, and your choice of four special abilities, ranging from Fire resistance 10 to enervation 1/day.  Oh, and you're eligible for Magic In The Blood since you're planetouched, so do that.

Man, they really should have specified a list of what planetouched could be made lesser.

Sharn are also a pretty cool guy.  Eh casts spells as SLAs, gets bonus actions, qualifies for Mystic Theurge with racial abilities, and doesn't afraid of anything.

[Amaranth]

Ok, everyone, thanks for the help.  I've got a bit more progress made here, and I think I'll throw up what I'm considering for the final build.

Focused Conjurer // White Dragonspawn (Dragonlance)   (Iron Will, Improved Initiative for Scribe Scroll, Academic Priest -- from Flaw)

F. C. // Telepath (Inquisitor)
F. C. // Telepath Spell Focus (Evil)
F. C. // Telepath
Cerebromancer // Binder
Cer. // Thrallherd (Improved Binding)
Cer. // Ur-Priest
Cer. // U.P.
Psychic Theurge  // Anima Mage  (Persistent spell)
P.T. // A.M.
P.T. // A.M.
P.T. // A.M. [Divine Metamagic (persistent)]
P.T. // A.M.
P.T. // A.M.
P.T. // A.M.  (Feat.....  Any advice?)
P.T. // A.M.
Telepath // A.M.
Telepath // A.M. (Bonus Psionic feat, feat......... any advice?)
Cer. // Warblade
Focused Conjurer // Dragon Disciple  (Bonus 9th level spell slot,  Domain granted ability....... any advice?)

This brings me through level 20.   As you can see there are several places where I haven't made up my mind what is best, and any tips are welcome.

As far as race goes, I'll be a middle aged White Dragonspawn Lesser Fey'ri with the following ability scores (and starting at 3rd level of the above build)

Str 8
Dex 16
Con 12
Int 20
Wis 13
Cha 14

Academic priest makes it so only the DC for Ur-priest spells is wisdom based, so I can get away with just intelligence.   I'll just use the divine spells for buffs and healing, etc (really secondary to psionics and arcane for this character anyway).

For the one level of sorcerer casting, I have Blockade and Nerveskitter at the moment (If I can get that +12 initiative at 3rd level, I should be able to help set up the party for an easy win and avoid being flatfooted).

Any additional hints or advice guys/gals?

[Rebel7284]

honestly, I'd drop psion completely for factotum.  There are few things that can survive double standard actions each turn with spells automatically overcoming all SR.  Taking the pheric template with magic in the blood allows you to be a pretty ghetto psion anyway.

1 Pheric LA
2 Pheric LA
3 Fact 1
4 Fact 2
5 Savage Bard 1
6 Ur Priest 1
7 Ur Priest 2
8 Fact 4
9 Fact 5
10 Fact 6
11 Fact 7
12 Fact 8
13 Fact 9
14 Fact 10
15 Fact 11
16+ XX


1 Conj 1
2 Conj 2
3 Conj 3
4 Conj 4
5 Conj 5
6 Conj 6
7 Mystic Theurge 1
8 Mystic Theurge 2
9 Mystic Theurge 3
10 Mystic Theurge 4
11 Mystic Theurge 5
12 Mystic Theurge 6
13 Mystic Theurge 7
14 Mystic Theurge 8
15+ XX

[Anklebite]

MT is illegal for gestalt, unless the DM houserules in double progression PrCs.

[The_Mad_Linguist]

MT is illegal for gestalt, unless the DM houserules in double progression PrCs.

Which he has.  Read the first post.

[Amaranth]

Rebel:  I'm not saying that isn't a good build, but isn't what I set out for.  I don't want a character that has "some" psionic abilities, I want the full depth of the psion class (Damp Power, Schism, Touchsight, Energy Stun, Dominate, etc..) as it will help compensate for having given up three schools of magic (enchantment, necromancy and evocation).  As a conjurer I'll have no shortage of spells which bypass SR anyway.